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Cuz05

Missiles.

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10 minutes ago, JJ48 said:

Seriously.  Play TIE Fighter or X-Wing Alliance.

Thanks, but I played X-Wing vs. TIE Fighter extensively when it was first released in 1997... Not sure if my current PC will even run it - it’ll probably be too quick, if the Wing Commander 3 fiasco is anything to go by.

”Your CD-ROM drive is spinning impossibly fast!” indeed...

37 minutes ago, JJ48 said:

Yeah, but so were torpedoes, so apparently referencing the original inspiration isn't allowed.

You can reference whatever you like ;)

It doesn’t, however, help to solve the problem that the ordnance that was based on this source of inspiration was broken in 1.0, and is still not quite right in 2.0...

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The simple (and most consistent with canon) solution has always been to make torpedoes less effective against high agility ships. It still boggles my mind that FFG didn't do that. There are lots of ways to go about doing it. Give torpedoes fewer red dice but bonus damage on a hit. Double green dice rolled against torpedos. Subtract a targets green dice from the torpedos dice before rolling. It's not hard to come up with ideas. The inverse being missiles should be more reliable for actually hitting a target but have less of an upside for high damage. Homing Missiles is a great missile. You could easily continue that theme with something like an Advanced Homing Missile that has the option for 2 auto damage instead (and maybe a single dice mod on a roll).

The net effect is torpedoes while being designed for larger targets like capital ships, still have a roll a roll in the dog-fighting of X-wing, but it's primarily to counter larger and less agile ships. While missiles fair better against the more agile fighters that don't want to get hit at all.

Edited by GeneralVryth

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6 hours ago, JJ48 said:

Seriously.  Play TIE Fighter or X-Wing Alliance.

I didn’t have a joystick while playing X-Wing, just mouse and keyboard.  So when flying the B-Wing I’d put my energy into shields and guns on the approach.  And then when I got close I’d trade guns for all engines and shields and ram things.  

It didn’t work on the star destroyers.  So I then had to learn how use all those torpedoes.

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9 hours ago, RedHotDice said:

Yes! Would you care to enligten us? :)

Idk abt him but here's how I would have done it:

 Accuracy die (blue): has no crits, and several double hit symbols, also fewer blanks (e.g. 2
double hit, 3 hit, 2 focus, 1 blank). Double hit symbols require two evades to cancel, but deal
one damage if uncancelled. Used for missiles (canonically small, fast, nimble things designed
to track and kill light ships, but didn't do much damage against big things with lots of shielding
and armour) but also for any similar high-accuracy-low-damage scenarios like flak cannon
equivalents, TLTs, etc.
Normal die: the current red die.
Damage die (black): has a lot of crits, and several double crit symbols, also probably more
blanks/eyeballs (e.g. 2 double crit, 2 crit, 1 focus 3 blank). Double crits require only 1 evade to
cancel, but deal two critical damage if uncancelled. Used for torpedoes (canonically slow,
powerful things that are almost impossible to tag fighters with but can cripple large ships and
capital ships) and other high-damage-low-accuracy weapons such as HLC.
Cancellation order doublehit>hit>doublecrit>crit
Also, addition of surges - depending on weapon, adding extra control effects (e.g. ion cannon
could spend a surge for an extra ion token or extra damage once per attack), or just flexibility on
damage - most units wouldn’t come with surge abilities, but upgrades and unique pilot abilities
could spend them for extra effects. Surges more common on blanks and eyeballs. Surges
could potentially also work even if the attack was dodged in some cases.

In short using different dice to decouple accuracy and damage.

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21 hours ago, JJ48 said:

If we're going strictly by the films, should anti-fighter missiles even be a thing in the Galactic Civil War era?

The main problem I see with your idea of linking torpedoes and target size is that, because hit and damage are linked, a small ship that blanks on defense will still take less damage than a large ship that blanks, which is the opposite of what we'd expect.   Maybe throw the changes onto defense dice, instead?  That is, small ships roll one extra green die, allowing them to evade more often, but still take full damage if it hits.

I'm not going strictly by the films. But we do see anti-fighter missiles in ROTS, which was decades before the GCW. So they do or did exist.

Yeah, that torp example was off the top of my head. The extra dice/full damage is one I've pondered as well. It would make torp shots against small ships all-or-nothing, which would be exciting to play out on the board...

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9 hours ago, thespaceinvader said:

Idk abt him but here's how I would have done it:

 Accuracy die (blue): has no crits, and several double hit symbols, also fewer blanks (e.g. 2
double hit, 3 hit, 2 focus, 1 blank). Double hit symbols require two evades to cancel, but deal
one damage if uncancelled. Used for missiles (canonically small, fast, nimble things designed
to track and kill light ships, but didn't do much damage against big things with lots of shielding
and armour) but also for any similar high-accuracy-low-damage scenarios like flak cannon
equivalents, TLTs, etc.
Normal die: the current red die.
Damage die (black): has a lot of crits, and several double crit symbols, also probably more
blanks/eyeballs (e.g. 2 double crit, 2 crit, 1 focus 3 blank). Double crits require only 1 evade to
cancel, but deal two critical damage if uncancelled. Used for torpedoes (canonically slow,
powerful things that are almost impossible to tag fighters with but can cripple large ships and
capital ships) and other high-damage-low-accuracy weapons such as HLC.
Cancellation order doublehit>hit>doublecrit>crit
Also, addition of surges - depending on weapon, adding extra control effects (e.g. ion cannon
could spend a surge for an extra ion token or extra damage once per attack), or just flexibility on
damage - most units wouldn’t come with surge abilities, but upgrades and unique pilot abilities
could spend them for extra effects. Surges more common on blanks and eyeballs. Surges
could potentially also work even if the attack was dodged in some cases.

In short using different dice to decouple accuracy and damage.

Ugh.. hard to read the way it is formatted - but also seems uneccessary complex, the same can be done as follows:

Missiles: roll 3-5 red dices (defender rolls green) to hit, and if hit deal 1 or 2 damage - depending on missile type.

Torpedos: roll 2-3 red dices for hit (defender rolls green), and if hit deal that damage + 1 to 3 additional damage - depending on torpedo type.

But this is more a flavour - it still does not deal with the core target-lock issue. 

Which is interesting as it adds the whole alpha versus beta strike..

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1 hour ago, RedHotDice said:

Ugh.. hard to read the way it is formatted - but also seems uneccessary complex, the same can be done as follows:

Missiles: roll 3-5 red dices (defender rolls green) to hit, and if hit deal 1 or 2 damage - depending on missile type.

Torpedos: roll 2-3 red dices for hit (defender rolls green), and if hit deal that damage + 1 to 3 additional damage - depending on torpedo type.

But this is more a flavour - it still does not deal with the core target-lock issue. 

Which is interesting as it adds the whole alpha versus beta strike..

Spitballing an idea. Would it unbalance the game if all ships could acquire target locks past range 3?

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27 minutes ago, Koing907 said:

Spitballing an idea. Would it unbalance the game if all ships could acquire target locks past range 3?

I think it would - target locks can also be used for regular attacks - would allow you to build up action-economy. 

Unless, there is an added rule that target locks are removed in the end-phase if they are beyond range 3 at that time - which would kind of make sense, as in "real-life" you can loose a target lock, but not in x-wing (unless you spend it). 

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