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azeronbloodmoone

Boba Fett

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I know some of yall don't consider this not big thing, but i saw in a few threads about this. whether boba fett clear peg, per current rule, counts as part of the mini for cover, and also the base, well we have a official answer to page 24 for cover now.

Q: I've seen a lot of chat in the forums about modifying boba fett to be with out the clear beg and glue it to the base directly (to get the base to count as part of the mini) is this a legal move for official tournaments like LVO

 

bobba fett.PNG

Edited by azeronbloodmoone

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51 minutes ago, ScummyRebel said:

I’d like to know what cover exactly exists that only obscured the peg without at least obscuring his legs? 

48 minutes ago, Screwtape said:

It is not the peg that is important, but the base.

Yeah, that. It makes a big difference for standing on a building and shooting down.

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I think the main issue was a barricade didn't really cover 50% of the unit when it came to Fett. However, the Learn to Play says trooper models get cover from barricades. I imagine a clearer definition of barricade cover at some point to clean up that point. 

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41 minutes ago, crx3800 said:

I think the main issue was a barricade didn't really cover 50% of the unit when it came to Fett. However, the Learn to Play says trooper models get cover from barricades. I imagine a clearer definition of barricade cover at some point to clean up that point. 

I would hope that whoever your opponent is, they would be reasonable enough to agree he should gain cover from a barricade. It's pedantic and petty to try to argue he shouldn't.

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1 hour ago, crx3800 said:

I think the main issue was a barricade didn't really cover 50% of the unit when it came to Fett. However, the Learn to Play says trooper models get cover from barricades. I imagine a clearer definition of barricade cover at some point to clean up that point. 

The discussion was not about Boba Fett gaining cover from a barricade, that is pretty clear in the rules that he does.

The discussion was related to exactly what Alex Davy's response indicates. Currently per the RRG the base and clear (flight) peg of a model do not count towards determining if that model receives cover.

The thread discussing this issue is here, pertinent parts on 2nd page:

 

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I have seen situations where overhead terrain covers his whole model, but not the base.  Under the peg rule that would mean that there was no LOS.  I have other terrain where the full piece of terrain is tall enough but some features of it in certain stances and angles will only cover a portion of the base.  

For instance, the below picture.  The platform is more than half the height of a trooper unit, (ignore the board in the background, it is there for purposes of the picture, not recreating a terrain situation.  However when on top of the terrain, but in the indentation there is base occlusion and thus unless specified the ST gets cover while Boba does not under the peg rule.

Cok4bAO.jpg

Or this one right here, from this exact angle, under the peg rule Boba has no cover, where another trooper model in the same position would.  

ECxsDA8.jpg

(same set up, different angle)

6mLAI5M.jpg

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1 hour ago, Canuck7 said:

 

I would hope that whoever your opponent is, they would be reasonable enough to agree he should gain cover from a barricade. It's pedantic and petty to try to argue he shouldn't.

Thankfully, it isn't my opponents that have done this. Mainly a question/problem I see come up often in discussion with Fett. 

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and that is why i pushed to get an answer in the current rules before clarification the obscure rules clear state

When determining whether a piece of terrain blocks

line of sight to a defending mini, if there is a clear peg

separating the defending mini and its base, the clear peg

and the base are not treated as a part of the mini

alot of people just ASSUMED that this didn't apply to him. when it did before the clarification. the obscured rule didn't identify between trooper or vehicle. in the future it will.

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i find it funny that people say its pedantic and petty, but what if they came back and said the opposite how would yall react then. most players just assume stuff does or doesn't apply and not bother to ask for clarification from the game makers themselves. yes TO have alot of pull but they can't override rules for sanction tournaments. minature games are base off rules and to assume a rule does or doesn't apply to a mini with clear words on it isn't the right way to play but it can lead some players to play wrong the entire time and when they go to world championships qualifiers they can get destroyed by not reading the rules correctly. in the case of Boba Fett while the rules do apply to troopers for obscure rules in those few case where only the base would of been cover (like in the pictures above) the rule does state minis with clear pegs have this rule. the clarification was needed for Fett as he was a mini with clear peg.  i thank yall for the conversation and encourage it to continue with your opinions.

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7 hours ago, crx3800 said:

I think the main issue was a barricade didn't really cover 50% of the unit when it came to Fett. However, the Learn to Play says trooper models get cover from barricades.

A unit does not need to be 50% covered by a piece of terrain to receive cover, it only needs any part of its model or base (except repulsor vehicles, apparently) to be not visible.

You might be doing cover incorrectly in your games.

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6 hours ago, Canuck7 said:

they would be reasonable enough to agree he should gain cover from a barricade

No reasonable is needed - the rules says trooper units gain heavy cover from barricades, period. The only thing in question with Fett is whether he was at some position where the only thing blocked by the barricade was his base. Per the rules as written, that doesn't count as obstruction, so he wouldn't be receiving cover from anything in that instance. That is what the e-mail in the original post is addressing.

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1 hour ago, Turan said:

A unit does not need to be 50% covered by a piece of terrain to receive cover, it only needs any part of its model or base (except repulsor vehicles, apparently) to be not visible.

You might be doing cover incorrectly in your games.

The unit also have to have 50% or more of the units in it Obscured when a line is drawn between the attacking unit leader and the mini(s) in the defending unit. If the line does not cross the obscuring terrain then it doesn't matter if any of the defending mini is not visible.

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3 hours ago, NeonWolf said:

The unit also have to have 50% or more of the units in it Obscured

Yes? That is a true statement, but doesn't apply to a discussion thread about Boba Fett. I posted because crx made a comment that indicated a misunderstanding of the rules as pertaining to Boba Fett.

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On 12/19/2018 at 2:32 PM, Turan said:

No reasonable is needed - the rules says trooper units gain heavy cover from barricades, period. The only thing in question with Fett is whether he was at some position where the only thing blocked by the barricade was his base. Per the rules as written, that doesn't count as obstruction, so he wouldn't be receiving cover from anything in that instance. That is what the e-mail in the original post is addressing.

Well, it's not like the concept of when you're looking at the cover (pre-game v midgame) and the 50% of model vs. 50% of models hasn't derailed a million cover conversations.  (I know I had to remind my opponent about the difference a bunch of times in a tourney this weekend....but I had my own rule confusion/blind spots).  it's not completely shocking for people to apply the "must vertically cover half of a mini in order to grant cover when the game begins" idea to barricades, which are a crazy weird exception when there's also a crazy weird exception character that stands higher than other characters.   

Edited by Zrob314

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12 hours ago, Turan said:

Yes? That is a true statement, but doesn't apply to a discussion thread about Boba Fett. I posted because crx made a comment that indicated a misunderstanding of the rules as pertaining to Boba Fett.

It still pertains to the rules in general and your statement could be misleading if someone were to apply it as-is. I added the rest of the requirements for clarity of the rules.

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2 hours ago, NeonWolf said:

It still pertains to the rules in general and your statement could be misleading if someone were to apply it as-is.

We'll have to agree to disagree about that. I don't see the point of giving extraneous information when providing a clarification - if you're going to do that, you might as well just say every time you reference a topic "Go read these paragraphs on this page" because you're providing every rule anyway 😋

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21 hours ago, Turan said:

A unit does not need to be 50% covered by a piece of terrain to receive cover, it only needs any part of its model or base (except repulsor vehicles, apparently) to be not visible.

You might be doing cover incorrectly in your games.

 

15 hours ago, Turan said:

Yes? That is a true statement, but doesn't apply to a discussion thread about Boba Fett. I posted because crx made a comment that indicated a misunderstanding of the rules as pertaining to Boba Fett.

 

56 minutes ago, Turan said:

We'll have to agree to disagree about that. I don't see the point of giving extraneous information when providing a clarification - if you're going to do that, you might as well just say every time you reference a topic "Go read these paragraphs on this page" because you're providing every rule anyway 😋

My point is that even if a part of a single-mini unit (in this case Boba Fett) is obscured by a piece of terrain, if the line drawn from the attacking unit leader does not cross the obscuring piece of terrain then the defender (again, Boba Fett) would not receive cover.  This is the part of the rules that you left out and yes it does pertain to this discussion.

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20 hours ago, NeonWolf said:

The unit also have to have 50% or more of the units in it Obscured

 

42 minutes ago, NeonWolf said:

My point is that even if a part of a single-mini unit (in this case Boba Fett) is obscured by a piece of terrain, if the line drawn from the attacking unit leader does not cross the obscuring piece of terrain then the defender (again, Boba Fett) would not receive cover.

My point is that did not seem to be your point. That should even be obvious as it was the part of your post I quoted in the first place.

I mean, whatever, dude...between the two of us everything possibly germane and beyond has been delineated, I'm just saying I try to limit the information I dump to what's immediately relevant. The potential error from the earlier poster did not have to do with the center-of-base line-drawing, so I didn't mention it. You did, it's all fine.

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