Baby Blues, Too (2.0)

[Rich P 907]

I looked at T280 for a bit today and the points reductions have opened a lot of options

BB droids cost 1 point on them, tractor beams for all. 

Or you can run 3 heroic red sq and PA Bastian 

so many options 

[Magnus Grendel 11,679]

I think more than anything it's the R2 Astromechs/Jamming Beam or BB Astromechs/Tractor Beam that interest me.

T-70s are impressively tough once you're considering having 4 of them on the board at once, so one ending a turn heavily on fire but technically still alive is quite likely, and being able to close the foils and just run is not a bad option.

Meanwhile, BB astromechs make them very squirrelly. With speed 2 banks and speed 3 straights blue as well, they are impressively manoeuvrable in close quarters, whilst if you're just "getting around the board", you can just use your action to boost and make a decent speed in a dead run. I'm always respectful of any ship which can get a free reposition; it doesn't have to be at initiative over-nine-thousand; you can always create positioning problems for an opponent with no realistic solution.

Heavy laser cannons are cool and all, but I'm unsure of the value of them relative to Predator Red Squadron - if you use the reroll, you've essentially thrown 4 dice - meaning it's about 60% as good as a heavy laser at range 2-3, but critically it still works at range 1, where (a) you hit hardest and (b) you have an easier time lining up bullseye shots anyway, plus you get promoted to Initiative 3 into the bargain, meaning you get the drop on Academy/Obsidian swarms, Mining Guild swarms, Epsilon/Zeta Swarms, Omicron Group shuttles, and Starkiller Base pilots.

 

[Magnus Grendel 11,679]

As an aside - hadn't registered that the Heavy Laser Cannon is the only hyperspace-legal cannon so far.

Not sure what else to spend the points on for a BB Astromech Rookie, and sadly if you take Red Experts the price pushs you past 50 points.

I guess you can take 2 BB Rookies, and 2 BB Reds with Predator, but mixed initiative comes with its own downsides.

[theBitterFig 11,598]

9 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

As an aside - hadn't registered that the Heavy Laser Cannon is the only hyperspace-legal cannon so far.

Not sure what else to spend the points on for a BB Astromech Rookie, and sadly if you take Red Experts the price pushs you past 50 points.

I guess you can take 2 BB Rookies, and 2 BB Reds with Predator, but mixed initiative comes with its own downsides.

4 BB Blues, three of which HLC, and one has no cannon.  It irks me, but it'd fit.  One goes for the block, three go for the cannons.

Kind of a shame there aren't any useful cheap Modification or Tech upgrades.  Electronic Baffle seems like it couldn't be worthwhile (even though it does allow BB rolls when you'd otherwise be stressed), and only Munitions Failsafe is that cheap.

[theBitterFig 11,598]

13 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

T-70s are impressively tough once you're considering having 4 of them on the board at once, so one ending a turn heavily on fire but technically still alive is quite likely, and being able to close the foils and just run is not a bad option.

I think there's a deceptive strength to R2s.

Do a 3-hard away, or a 4-straight out, regen a shield, take a lock.  Next turn gain a 2nd shield, repair a crit.  On the 3rd turn, you're back in the fight on 3 or 4 HP with Focus/Lock.  There can be something kind of dispiriting when an opponent does this to you.

Edited February 1, 2019 by theBitterFig

[theBitterFig 11,598]

And another thought.  Going back to T-65s... Selfless Red Veterans with R2 units are 50 points.  Crits pulled here and there probably makes it hard to finally kill one early, and then the regen can kick in.  T-70 just have the better S-Foils, though...

[Magnus Grendel 11,679]

38 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Electronic Baffle seems like it couldn't be worthwhile (even though it does allow BB rolls when you'd otherwise be stressed)

I do wonder about that. The T-70 has enough hits that burning one to appease the manouvre gods isn't completely unreasonable, and being able to use it to shed ion or lock token is potentially much more importnt.

[theBitterFig 11,598]

On 12/13/2018 at 5:29 AM, Magnus Grendel said:

I was wondering about an updated version. Now, there are a couple of options going; since a T-70 has picked up a 4th hull, you no longer 'need' an astromech to work, meaning you can buy whatever upgrade suits your plans best.

There are a shed-load of named pilots and unique astromechs which I've no doubt I'll experiment with eventually, but to start with I want to get my eye in with basic ships.

• 4 x Blue Squadron Rookie
  • 4 points to spend
  1. Advanced Optics - pretty pointless on a 3-dice primary ship; you're asking for the dice to deliver a blank and no focus results, otherwise you've gained nothing. That doesn't come up that often - especially since turning 3 blanks into 2 blanks and a hit is unlikely to gain you much in real terms. The chance of rolling Hit/Hit/Blank is not trivial, though, and it'll really up your performance if you do against stuff like TIE phantoms or X-wing aces, who have defense modifiers out the wazoo but only 2 green dice to apply them to.

 

On 12/17/2018 at 4:00 PM, theBitterFig said:

There are a few different options for SFs...

• Omega Squadron, Init 3
  • Advanced Optics.  With the rear arc being 2 dice, AdvO makes their guns pretty consistent.  Again, doesn't really seem worth it.  Consistent rear-arc guns don't seem too important.

Given that Resistance A-Wings seem to be doing pretty well with Advanced Optics, I wonder if it's worth revisiting for the 3-dice jousting versions.  Weapons Guidance was something no one ever really considered on T-70s in 1e, since they couldn't afford it (and because it'd cost the droid and 7th hit point).  But the price is right in 2e.

Optics isn't really that bad on 3 dice.  Consider: on pretty much ~30% of attacks (152/512), you'll roll blanks without focuses.  That's actually kind of high.  About 19% of the time, you'll be making the step from 2 to 3 hits.  The chance of rolling both blanks and focuses?  ~28% (144/512), with the other ~42% (216/512) of the time rolling only focus/hits.

Meanwhile, both the T-70 and TIE/sf have meaningful fire modes which are 2-dice modes.  A T-70 can close S-Foils and Focus/Barrel Roll.  Not the best linked actions in the world, but it can come in handy.  When packing Optics, closing the wings to roll for position becomes a lot less costly on attack.

A SF has rear guns (and those times you make a mistake and flip the guns too early).  Again, this is something we've seen from A-Wings.  Flying past stuff with rear guns can be a potent strategy.  I kind of doubt that 5xSFs will be better than 5xRZ2, due to lower mobility, even with higher HP.  However, 4x Gunner SFs has 3 red dice on the approach.  Against 3 green dice, 5x shots from 2 red with Focus/AdvO is 3.99 expected damage.  With 4x shots from 3 red with Focus/Advo, this is 5.85 expected damage.  Against 2 green dice, 5 As: 5.5 damage; 4 SFs: 7.2 damage.  That's a much better chance to kill something like T-65 or Y-Wing at Range 3.  Optics/Gunner Omegas also have Init 3, which can kinda matter.  Lots of low-Init Y-Wings and A-Wings out there.

[Magnus Grendel 11,679]

I agree that advanced optics are still a nice-to-have on a T-70, I'm just not sure whether I'd prefer them or a heavy laser cannon (or red veteran with predator) if I wanted a bigger stick. The bullseye upgrade means it's harder to trigger but it's also a more substantial leg up in firepower (and as you note, Initiative 3 isn't trivial).

My once concern is that advanced optics gives you another means to use a focus token - on a swarm of TIE/sf or RZ-2, whichever ship gets targeted will be sans focus, but the smaller your squad numerically, the bigger the chunk of your squad losing the benefit of equipping optics.

5 Omegas with Advanced Optics feel like they get more mileage than 4 with Gunners - although 4 with Gunners have more raw firepower, and are much better at engaging high agility targets than 5 without gunners (and, for that matter, at generating massed attacks in a nasty swirling swarm-on-swarm fight where their bonus attacks might come into play).

 

The comment about closing S-foils is a good one - being able to roll, or rotate, and still produce 2 hits reliably is very nice.

I'm not sure that argument holds too well for the T-70s, though, because of the option of the BB Astromech, which nets you your roll as a pre-move, free action. I've had a  brief try with them and they're a very tasty squad - hyperspace restrictions mean you kind of have trouble spending the rest of the points, but Jess/BB/Heavy Laser Cannon (or optics) is a pretty good leader for the quartet. 

[theBitterFig 11,598]

6 minutes ago, Magnus Grendel said:

I agree that advanced optics are still a nice-to-have on a T-70, I'm just not sure whether I'd prefer them or a heavy laser cannon (or red veteran with predator) if I wanted a bigger stick. The bullseye upgrade means it's harder to trigger but it's also a more substantial leg up in firepower (and as you note, Initiative 3 isn't trivial).

My once concern is that advanced optics gives you another means to use a focus token - on a swarm of TIE/sf or RZ-2, whichever ship gets targeted will be sans focus, but the smaller your squad numerically, the bigger the chunk of your squad losing the benefit of equipping optics.

5 Omegas with Advanced Optics feel like they get more mileage than 4 with Gunners - although 4 with Gunners have more raw firepower, and are much better at engaging high agility targets than 5 without gunners (and, for that matter, at generating massed attacks in a nasty swirling swarm-on-swarm fight where their bonus attacks might come into play).

 

The comment about closing S-foils is a good one - being able to roll, or rotate, and still produce 2 hits reliably is very nice.

I'm not sure that argument holds too well for the T-70s, though, because of the option of the BB Astromech, which nets you your roll as a pre-move, free action. I've had a  brief try with them and they're a very tasty squad - hyperspace restrictions mean you kind of have trouble spending the rest of the points, but Jess/BB/Heavy Laser Cannon (or optics) is a pretty good leader for the quartet. 

I think that 3rd die matters, though.  Three Optics attacks (that is, one ship completely destroyed) from Gunner Omegas against 3 green dice (say, a 2-agility ship at Range 3) will be 4.387 damage expected.  5 2-dice Optics attacks with focus (so not even missing the token) against the same target would be 3.998 damage expected.  Against 2 green dice, 5 Omegas would do 5.444--three with gunners would do 5.417.  That seems like a lot added by the gunner, when three with has the damage of five without.  But the list will lose ships/points more quickly.  Having an extra 25% hit points and firing arcs is useful.  I'm planning on flying 5 non-Gunner Optics SFs today, and might break out the gunner version at a later date.

I know HLC is more damage if it can be lined up, but I just think it's going to be hard to line up.  Each AdvO 3-dice attack expects an extra 0.3 hits.  A HLC attack when focused adds 0.75 hits.  If you can line up 2 HLC shots, it'll be more hits than AdvO, but only getting 1 HLC attack won't do it, even if one is missing focus.  There's probably a skill level where HLC is going to just be better, but I'm probably not there.

[Magnus Grendel 11,679]

Just now, theBitterFig said:

 Having an extra 25% hit points and firing arcs is useful.  I'm planning on flying 5 non-Gunner Optics SFs today, and might break out the gunner version at a later date.

Good luck. I can assure you that the sheer durability of 5 x agility 2, 6-hit point ships is quite imposing, even if they are armed with rolled-up newspapers by comparison.

[theBitterFig 11,598]

11 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

Good luck. I can assure you that the sheer durability of 5 x agility 2, 6-hit point ships is quite imposing, even if they are armed with rolled-up newspapers by comparison.

Played the game, it felt good.  I lost, but feel like there were probably times I could have been more cutthroat, dialed in a few more 1-straights (that's something an A-Wing can't do...).  I'm still planning on taking the 4xOmega + Optics + Gunner sometime, just to see how that feels, but there's totally potential in the 5 SF list.

I feel like there's four minor variants of Optics SFs to consider:

• 5x Omega:  Initiative 3 feels like it matters more these days than it used to.
• 5x Zeta + 10 point bid: This list feels like it'd enjoy moving first.  You don't want to get blocked and caught without focus, and you'll be really good at setting up blocks of your own.  The bid makes the inevitable MOV loss a bit lower, only 19 points per half-ship.
• 5x Zeta, one with Hotshot Gunner:  Good blocking, but an ugly asymmetry that also makes you acutally think about where one ships points it's guns.  Hotshot also ensures that a target only has one chance to spend a Focus token when defending against the swarm.  Not bad, I guess.
• 4x Zeta + Backdraft (however BD gets built): A stray Init 4 with an extra red die isn't quite L'ulo in terms of ability to punch up, but gist of it is there.

I guess there's also non-optics versions.  A lot of my ships spent a lot of time un-shielded, actually.  Fanatical might not be too bad.  But I love the plain consistency of Optics.

[Magnus Grendel 11,679]

I'd be hesitant in a 5-ship squad to field one ship that's detectably better unless that ship is either (a) able to arc dodge (e.g. TIE swarm and Soontir) or (b) detectably tougher (e.g.  Countdown).

The hotshot gunner seems likely to be the first ship to get wasted without ever giving you much payback.

A bid isn't as silly as it sounds, but I think fire control might be worth a thought, too. without Special Forces Gunner, you're stuck trying to nibble targets to death, so requiring multiple turns of fire to kill anything big....heck, even a decent-weight heavy fighter like a T-70...is not unreasonable, and with guns akimbo fore-and-aft you've a decent chance of getting a turn where one or more ships can lock without being shot at. 

Meanwhile, the I3 of omegas is never a bad option. I've used Ruthless Black Squadrons en masse, and it's surprising how often the I3 is actually a benefit.

[theBitterFig 11,598]

5 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

I'd be hesitant in a 5-ship squad to field one ship that's detectably better unless that ship is either (a) able to arc dodge (e.g. TIE swarm and Soontir) or (b) detectably tougher (e.g.  Countdown).

The hotshot gunner seems likely to be the first ship to get wasted without ever giving you much payback.

A bid isn't as silly as it sounds, but I think fire control might be worth a thought, too. without Special Forces Gunner, you're stuck trying to nibble targets to death, so requiring multiple turns of fire to kill anything big....heck, even a decent-weight heavy fighter like a T-70...is not unreasonable, and with guns akimbo fore-and-aft you've a decent chance of getting a turn where one or more ships can lock without being shot at. 

Meanwhile, the I3 of omegas is never a bad option. I've used Ruthless Black Squadrons en masse, and it's surprising how often the I3 is actually a benefit.

FCS just doesn't excite me.  The expected damage loss from taking and not spending a lock is enough that it'll take like 2 more turns of shots with focus/fcs to get back to where you'd be with just using AdvO each time.  I guess FCS frees you up to do something like Evade every turn, which can be nice.  If a goal is to switch to Evades, going for Fanatical/FCS Omegas might make more sense than Optics/FCS Zetas.  That could easily be pretty good, too.

As to one-different-ship, I kinda get it.  But these are also ships which don't hate being chased.  With a 5-straight and rear guns, having Backdraft or a HSG Zeta running away doesn't seem too terrible.  The rest of your squad might get better position this way.

//

I suppose I ought to bring it back around to 4xT70, though.  I guess the Init 3 thing is why I kinda like the thought of Predator Reds over HLC Blues.

[Magnus Grendel 11,679]

1 hour ago, theBitterFig said:

I guess the Init 3 thing is why I kinda like the thought of Predator Reds over HLC Blues.

Agreed. The more I think about that particular comparison, the more I'm inclined to side with the Experts:

• The loss of damage is only about 40% of an attack die - because you'll get a blank on 3 dice about 60% of the time, and if you've been forced to spend your focus by being shot at, you'll get to use the reroll nearly 90% of the time (and if you don't, it's because you rolled 3 hits or criticals and have absolutely no grounds to complain about your dice... )
• The place where lining up bullseye shots is easiest is at range 1 - where the heavy laser cannon cannot fire but predator gives you 4 dice and a reroll.
• As noted, initiative 3 is broadly a good thing whether you get a bullseye or not, but it also makes lining up said bullseye a darn sight easier, especially given the T-70's access to Focus/link/Barrel Roll.

I think Blues with R2 Astromechs for a heavy defensive build is still worth a look, but for an offensive build I think it's a balancing act between the Predator Reds and the Advanced Optics Blues.

[Vespid1311 122]

Hi, long time lurker, first time poster.
I have been following this post and similar ones (like the Strikers and 5 RZ-2 A Wing threads in the Battle Reports section, or Reapers and Afterburners thread in the general section) for a while and enjoy reading them. Getting some useful insights and ideas.

Specific to the Blue T70s, I started with the Heavy Laser variant and have found it a little lacking.... though that was before I started really considering the Blue T70s and formation flying seriously, so I may need to go back.
What the Heavy Lasers were good for, though, is waving a long "don't fly here" stick around the board. Aces get a little twitchy with four of those magic wands on the board.

Since the points update, I have been flying almost exclusively Blue T70s with R2s and it has been.... interesting. I took it up after the discussion on Page 2 by Bitter Fig and Magnus, particularly the point about disengaging one ship and still having three threatening, and I have found it to be not bad at all.
Unfortunately, I have only sporadic play time (shifts willing), but I am currently at about 9 Wins and 5-6 Losses with it (or there abouts... wasn't keeping track at the beginning of testing), which is pretty good for me (I am normally 50-50). I have found over recent months that I am having much more success with less complicated lists. Turns out that I am not much of an ace player and/or I am better at multiple generics and/or these sort of lists are a semi-counter to some of what I see in my local area (tends to be mostly named pilots) and/or I am getting better.

Some general thoughts about the R2 Blues:
- People don't like to line up against four X-Wings. Seems obvious, but it bears noting because it means that you can use them to bully others around the board.
- Boost is really useful to get in to aggressive positions and either chase something around the board that was never going to engage you anyway (Lulo or a Striker/Reaper starting in front of you, for example) or to give yourself the opportunity to threaten an opponent a little earlier than they would like. If you can threaten an opponent's ace in the next turn by pointing vaguely in their direction and their other pieces are not set to give you a good thumping, I have found people are reluctant to throw the ace in. Boost is also useful for getting into uncomfortable angles for your opponent.
- However, overusing Boost leaves you with no modifications and at the whim of the Dice Gods... they are fickle.
- Focus is your friend. Target Locks only if you are certain that you are not getting shot at this turn.
- T70s with Regenerating Shields are remarkably tanky, and four of them are a slog to chew through. They can come apart if there are three or more 4 Dice attacks with modifiers.... but doesn't pretty much everything?
- This List Loses Well. I am yet to lose all of them in one game, and I have generally felt like I have been competitive in all of my losing games, short of a stupid mistake or not having Mods on defense/attack because I was over-aggressive with the Boost. I am rarely losing by more than 50 points.
- They lack spike damage at the start unless you catch someone napping.... but there are four of them and so it racks up. Again, this means that you can force an opponent to fly more defensively than they otherwise want to.
- There is a minor art to learning when to disengage a partially damaged ship, and when to attempt to use it as a blocker, when Regenerating. For me, the sweet spot feels like it sits between 1 Shield remaining and 3 Hull Remaining. If you are disengaging with two shields remaining, you probably are doing it wrong. If you are regenerating but would otherwise have had a shot, you probably have made a mistake. If you are regenerating and fail a block with less than 3 Hull, you probably won't see another regeneration turn... but a genuine disengage seems to be more likely to get you that second regeneration. If the opponent chases a Regenerating ship, and you have ships able to capitalise on that, Great!
- I have a tendency to start as a wedge block (Finger Four type) formation and then consider breaking them in to two groups of two to run flankers or to chase something that doesn't want to be chased. It has been useful in most games because it generally will allow you multiple engage/disengagement options.
- If an opponent is only firing a couple of Primary attacks at Range 2+, they are really hard to significantly damage. This then usually leaves that ship with some nice blocking/regenerating options or disengage/regenerate. Either way, it tends to make the opponent's life a little harder if they do not finish off a ship in one turn.
- Seems to be obvious, but try not to engage at Range 1 in the first engagement unless you are facing Primary 2 Attack ships that would otherwise be throwing Range 2-3 Ordnance at you.
- I have suspicions that, with the rise of Rebel Beef and the Veteran Turret Ys, the I1 of the Blues is an issue due to those lists having a Lot of I2s that also don't care too much about Initiative, but the fact that they actually out-Initiative me is a bonus for them. It is not that the Blues do not have a chance, but you have to be super sure that you are getting the engagement you want. Today's game was against 5 Ys (4 Gray Veteran Ion Gunners, one without the Veteran). I was unable to correctly line up a Range 3 opening engagement with all of my ships (was out by maybe a quarter of a base length with two of them). This meant that the next turn, regardless of any blocking or disengaging I could do (of which I was limited due to congestion), I would always probably be taking ionisation on at least one without having dealt significant damage. Turns out that two Blues would take Ion... and Ionised R2 Astromechs are Sad R2 Astromechs, as there is no dial reveal and therefore no regeneration possible. They did, however, soak up more than one round of fire and the positioning of the obstacles meant that the opponent was not able able to get all in behind me. Game ended at 100-41, with a narrow missed arc meaning I would not be able to half-points one ship, and a bit of a Hail Mary shot fizzing on another, whilst I took the required amount of damage to drop a second ship to half (after losing one T70 earlier).
- Against anything that throws 3 Proton Torpedoes, again, I am concerned... but less so if they do not have easy access to double modifiers (Poe, Rebel Synergy type lists). Again, you are trying to bully the opponent into not getting all of their ships into Range/Arc of one ship in one turn. More than happy to have two ships share the damage here (or have only two shots against me).
- Seems to shine better against Hyperspace Legal lists than against some of the Extended shenanigans.... but they do tend to do well against 3 Ship builds of all sorts. Need more testing against a genuine Extended Aces list.

I am satisfied that, although not exactly top tier, a squadron of R2 Blues definitely have something going for them.
I have considered trying something similar on the T65s, but the extra Shield and native Boost do so much work here that I really don't think that it is feasible. The T70s are just flat out Better for this style of play.

***

My next testing of T70s (before the Strikers re-release anyway) is probably going to be the Red Predators or Red Cracks.
Having got the hang of formation flying, I want something that can out-Initiative a generic swarm/beef/Y list. I think that they will have better chances than the Heavy Laser Blues, for the reasons posted above by Magnus above, though I am not certain about them being better than the R2 Blues. Now that I am better at corralling an opponent into lanes, the Bullseye abilities seem like something I can toy with.
Advanced Optics Blues feels like a lesser choice, though my limited experience of Advanced Optics comes from me trying to test it out on Ello Asty in my Triple T70s build (Bastian/Ello/Nien). It rarely seemed to trigger.... but, then again, that list tends to be firing first and have to consider holding on to Focus for defense. Maybe there is something in having Advanced Optics on the Blues because they fire last (something that came up in the 5 RZ2s thread).
The BB Blues seem kinda fun too. I come from a Quad Phantom background.... It's not the 'Decloak 1 Hard', but 'Barrel Roll, 1 Soft Turn' Kill Boxes seem pretty enticing, and on a tougher base too.

[Vespid1311 122]

Story Time!
Wall of Text Warning!

Two tournaments this weekend, with numerous lessons, musings and dice hilarity.

The TLDR Version:
- Threatened Kill Zones can be a good defense. Of course, Actual Kill Zones also usually make for a great Offense too.
- If you are running to Regenerate, check where you are running to. Open moves are good moves, closing your options lead to mistakes or dice nature taking its course.
- M9G8's Lock on double-tapping ships is Pretty Good.
- Can't Regenerate when you are dead. Try to not die immediately.
- Focus. Focus. Focus.
- When in good health, reform (if necessary) and Stay On Target. More Tank, More Firepower, More Points. Even Concordia Face Off and Arc Dodgers have difficulty with that.
- Blocking Big Ships with a low action economy is a relatively easy way to keep them out of the game whilst the rest of your list does its thing (whatever that thing is).
- Know when to change target priority.
- A good pilot will usually see a block coming and work around it.
- If a ship is very likely to disengage with little/no recourse in the near future and other dangerous ships would be in position to chase you, consider reframing the Kill Box to the chasing ships.
- Don't Panic
- If you can not afford to Joust straight up, set up in such a manner that you don't have to do something strange (like Three Hard, Boost towards your own edge) in order to avoid being flattened upon entry.

Regenerating Blues tend not to flatten people, but also tend not to be flattened.
This is a Grind List. Expect to run to time most of the time. Expect your day to be Long.

Advanced Optics is... a consideration... Maybe?
See the post after the battle report for details.

***
Yesterday had a mini round-robin (sort of.... we only managed 6 players, four rounds) with the R2 Blues.
I went 1 W 3L, but felt a little unlucky at times, and lucky at others.
There is a Twitch stream of the first two games (we were playing King of the Hill for the stream, my first opponent wanted to be on stream). Search for Wired Unplugged.

Might post the cleaned up individual videos when they eventually get done. (mostly family friendly)

Round 1 was against one of our region's best players, with Boba (Trick Shot, QiRa, Slave One), Fenn (Predator) and Seevor (Trick Shot).
Rocks and debris were set up in a relatively close hexagon in the middle of the board. I set up in one corner, whilst he spread his across the opposite half of the board. My plan here was to force difficult choices on whether or not to bring Fenn in by threatening to turn for an engagement at R2-3. This sort of worked, as Fenn spent the first engagement or two not shooting, whilst I took Seevor (who K Turned the previous and had no real place to run to) and damaged Boba. A bit more pressure on Fenn saw him dive in and take a chunk out of an X with limited return shots. A few more turns of dancing and I had managed to plink both Boba and Fenn to half whilst losing only one and a half Xs.
113 - 75 Win. Regeneration helped a bit, and I feel that I may have gotten with my dice (attack and defense) after the initial Engagement Phase.
Learnings: After the game, he acknowledged that Fenn probably should have turned in earlier, but there were too many arcs to consider, and some of them were at Range 2-3. Vowed that would not happen in future games.
He also thought that he did not really get much value out of Seevor... which was mostly true, but sticking him into a kill box (originally intended for Boba or Fenn) probably did not help.

Round 2 was against Poe (Outmanouevre, Black One, R4), Nien Nunb (Pattern Analyser, Elusive) and Bastian (M9G8).
This was a real gritty game in which the dice were mostly laughable. For this one, I set up in my block whilst my opponent set up half way across the back board edge (Poe as far away as possible, Nien and Bastian together-ish closer to me). First round of attack saw my leading ship lose all three shields at R2-3. My entire block unloaded at R2-3 Bastian... for 0 damage. Despite getting mostly hits and crits. Super Unhappy about that. However, the sneak move was in play, as I could feasibly get 3, maybe 4 XWings to point at Poe's likely location next turn by Tallon and Hard turns. The damaged X decided to go and lick its wounds (missing a block on Bastian, but outside of fire) whilst the rest of the Xs did the surprise pounce. Poe, having only dialed in a 2 Move chose to attempt a Barrel Roll out of Arc (didn't) and push to Focus. 3 shots later, Poe is down his shields for the loss of shields on a different ship. This time, lack of mods hurt (a Tallon Roll and a slight nudge from a misjudged 3Hard leaving 1 R1 and 1 R2 shot with no modifiers). At this point, my forces split, with the newly damaged ship playing regenerating blocker and the rest of my guys not in a particularly good position to do anything much. There was not a lot going on, with my ships all playing Regeneration games without taking or dealing substantial damage in return, and there were still no points on the board until the last turn of the game, when I did a mostly-dumb move of 4K from a ship that had fully regenerated. I suspected Bastion had Talloned or K Turned.... but, instead, he had done a soft 1 towards the direction I had KTurned to. That ship went to half points after Nien took a long range Pot Shot and Bastian did his thing. The dumb move, however, was not the KTurn (though it was a bit of a Hail Mary) but the turns before it where I had pointed towards that corner rather than turned towards the other board edge/corner with a lot more open space and potentially less opponents to shoot at me. On the opposite corner of the board, I did not manage to block Poe, so he SLAMmed into a Tallon Roll, took the gamble to take the Ion, and pulled a shot that took an X to half points with no return fire. Time was called late in the attack phase.
50-nil, but I left with a bit of a sour taste with poor-ish positioning on my behalf, dice and the whole "just one more turn...." sensation
Learnings: If you are running to Regenerate, check where you are running to. My initial plan in running to the corner where I did was to keep safe, and I did... for two turns. Games happen with more turns in mind. Open moves are good moves, closed options lead to mistakes or nature taking its course.

Round 3 was against Vennie (Proton Bombs, Tragedy Simulator, C3P0, Veteran Turret Gunner), Nien Nunb (M9G8, Black One, Heroic, Pattern Analyser) and Lulo (Heroic/Crack Shot).
I have never flown against a Star Fortress in second edition before. My gameplan was to take shots at range, absorb any bombs on my shields and plink away.
This game was a combination of a botch on my behalf, then being diced.
My opponent had not managed to turn in such a way that he had Trajectory Simulator in play on the initial engagement.
The Botch: I was mostly happy with my run in, except for the debris in my way. "No matter," I thought. "I can boost my way around it." And I did, leaving me no Focus with Vennie at R1 and Nien at R3. So... the dice. Zero pictures in defense and All Pictures in attack mean that a T70 just disappears, apparently. Statistically, I worked it out later to be about a 1 in 10 chance to have lost that ship. It was only the second time I have lost a T70 in one round. My remaining attacks all whiffed. Then he did it again a few turns later, this time with a focused T70 at R2 of Nien and Vennie. Same story, only even worse variance. Ended up Half Pointing Lulo and Nien, I think. My positioning got a bit awkward and abandoning the plan of Kill Vennie (which apparently is a bad plan to begin with) did not help, and he flew well, but... Just one of those games, maybe. Make a mistake, get brutalised by it, and that's how the cascade starts. Losing the second T70 to one round of fire was just extra In-Salt to an already Giant Injury.
Remember how I said that I had not had a 200 loss with the R2 T70s before?
Yeah... was never going to pull this one back, or even save face.
200 - 55
Learnings: M9G8 was one of my favourite cards last edition, and it definitely proved its worth on friendly ships here. You don't need Bastian or Jess to get the maximum use out of it. Anything that fires twice will like it more than any one else.

Round 4 was against two Skull Squadrons (Proton Torpedoes, Crack Shot) and Kad Solus (Outmanoeuvre, Proton Torps).
I thought I had it in the bag when my opponent flew all three more-or-less straight in to all of my guys. I took out Kad and a Skull in short order for only one half pointed T70 and felt pretty good.
By the end of the game, that other Skull Squadron earned a promotion after wiping each and every T70.
I really don't know what happened.
There was some poor positioning, with me only able to get one or two shots at most every time I could shoot.
He flew that lone Skull almost perfectly, took the risks when it mattered, got the occasional lucky roll... but nothing that was super extraordinary.
Twice in one day, I lost everything. At least this game I never felt like I had a problem with being in the fight... I just did not win it.
200 - 167
Learnings:  Stay on Target. Reform if Necessary.

***
Today was a Wave Championship type event. Extended.... so Jamming Beams for All! 15 players, four rounds.

Round One - Ketsu Onyo (Intimidation + Shadow Caster + Qi'ra + Deadman's Switch + Tactical Scrambler), Old Teroch (Fearless) and Talonbane (Outmanoeuvre)
Was confused a bit on the initial set up when he wanted a semi-joust (All mid-board, Ketsu came in on an angle, and Terry & Bane were parallel to his board edge facing towards my side).
Jumped hard up the board twice and narrowly missed Ketsu having a turret and primary in my direction. This was, I believe, a critical moment as it he was behind me, forced him to not only rotate his arc (spending an action) but also put Talonbane and Teroch right in front of a bunch of angry Xs. Bane went to half health, whilst I lost shields and half hull on one T70. That Rookie and 2 others decided that they wanted no part of another joust... but one stayed behind. This, too, proved critical as Talonbane, expecting a retreat or KTurn, did a Tallon Roll.... right in front of the remaining ship. He managed to pump an Ionisation critical through on the damaged ship, who just so happened to be pointed diagonally towards the board edge... with 2 base lengths (minus 3 mm) to reach said board edge. Ketsu, on the other hand, was not expecting the bump... and this also proved critical as she spent the majority of the rest of the game being blocked and being unable to get actions because I was travelling in the same general direction around obstacles. Halfway through the game, I had run out of regeneration on the three remaining ships. Thinking that points were tight, I changed target priority from a retreating nearly-impossible-to-hit Teroch and started pointing at Ketsu. Again, this was major.
Final turn saw me a little lucky to not lose half on one of my ships... Regeneration having saved my bacon on two ships, leaving me with only one off the board and one on half. I was unable to plink off the final hull on Ketsu....
99-75 Win.
Learnings: Blocking Big Ships with a low action economy is a relatively easy way to keep them out of the game whilst the rest of your list does its thing (whatever that thing is). Also, know when to change target priority. It paid off BIG here.

Round Two - Scum Lando (Millennium Falcon title, Trick Shot, ... something else), AutoPilot Escape Craft/Bomb, Old Teroch (Fearless), Fenn (Predator).
Against another good player, this was going to be tough unless I got my setup mostly right. I think I did, jumping past the obstacles whilst she gradually around and through them. The opening engagement had all four of my ships pointed into the obstacle lane that I wanted her to go through... and she obliged with Teroch leading the charge and Fenn not far behind... They plastered the front most XWing, two hull remaining after the smoke cleared, whilst Terry held on to dear life with only one hull remaining. I managed to not forget regenerate, and that was fortunate as the charged up AutoBomb detonated next turn. Went for the block on Teroch and/or Fenn and missed, taking a Fenn shot for my troubles. Managed to come through with shields down. Teroch, decided to go the opposite direction and was out of the fight for a few turns whilst the Blues went to work on Lando, who came out a little limping. Spent a turn  or two regrouping and regenerating, as Fenn and Teroch swung around for another run, taking an X as they went. As with the previous game, it came down to the final attacks after Regeneration pushed me back into the Blue. Any misgivings I had about my dice from the previous night had cleared though, as I managed to not get another ship down to half, cleared out Teroch and plinked Fenn to half.
133 - 100 Win (final roll of the dice was to take Fenn to half, which pushed my scored up from 98).
She flew well, and I got lucky. My defense dice were doing good things for the most part , and she often had to spend focus on attack for a meaningful/relevant hit.
Learning: A good Kill Box is a good defense... but a better Offense. Fangs at R1... they can absorb well. A good pilot will usually see a block coming and work around it.

Round Three... my opponent from Round Two yesterday. With the Same List!
Almost identical set up, similar starting moves, but he ran Poe in a little too hot and Bastian/Nien too straight. I put out the Kill Zone for Poe first, and he walked into it, spending Black One to try to get out, but clipped a Debris Field on the way through, so had no Focus He managed to dodge one arc and be at R3 of the others... and then didn't roll a single Dodge (but a few Focuses, just to rub it in), running on 1 Hull. I lost 1 Shield on one ship. Next up, the Kill Box formed in front of Bastian and Nien. Nien Bumped, but Bastian was just in position to take three Range One shots and a Range Two shot. That felt good. For all of this, he lost two shields. Stressed Poe got caught a turn or two later, Bastian sort of bugged out, whilst Nien did Nien things. Managed to burn down Nien to half for the loss of one T70.
110 - 50
Learning: If a ship is very likely to disengage with little/no recourse in the near future (Poe, in this case) whilst an Outmanoeuvre Ship would be in position to chase you, consider reframing the Kill Box to the Outmanoeuvre ship. It is very satisfying to set up.... even if the Dice Say No.

Round Four: Wedge/Thane/Garven (all with Crackshot) and Biggs.
It was the Aces vs the new kids on the block here. Set up in my usual formation, and my opponent did something I did not expect.... Line Up for the Joust.
This confused me. With all of the High PS there, and Crackshot (probably) lined up against me, I tried to run. hard Three Boosts across my board edge. It sort of maybe worked, but I was strung out on my own back line. I was expecting/hoping he would slow roll the first turn. He did not. The next turn was basically free shots at R3, one ship taking two damage, the other lost all shields and two hull. Dice were angry at me that turn, but made up for it the next turn, when his shots failed to do anything meaningful and he lost all shields and one hull damage on both Thane and Biggs. Turn after that saw the dice correct for that swing, after I over-thought what he was going to do (barrel rolling to block a K Turn that never happened) and losing me a ship, and two sets of half points in the process. Meanwhile, Thane at R1 against two Focused T70s took no damage. From here, I was just trying to cling on to life. I managed to drag Biggs and Garven away from Wedge and Thane.... and I would have gotten away with it too if I managed to block Thane and Wedge. As it stood, Thane stopped short, barrel rolled into the way of Wedge and I lost another ship due to lack of Focus in defense and natural Hit Hit Crits at R1. Garven got an unlucky critical (loose stabiliser) from a lucky close range Wings Closed shot that meant he would run away from the fight. End game was me desperately holding onto one of mine with 1 Hull whilst the other took a lucky long range pot shot to eliminate Biggs.
97-125 Loss.
Learning: Don't Panic and, if you can not afford to Joust straight up, set up in such a manner that you don't have to do something strange (like Three Hard, Boost towards your own edge) in order to avoid being flattened upon entry. Dice Variance.... man, I've seen some strange things....

Finished 5th out of 15.
A fitting send off to this list.

Is in the memory banks for Hyperspace Legal consideration.

[Vespid1311 122]

(Further Learning that I did not add in the last post:
Slave One is Good/Great at its current 2 point cost. Boba Loves his own title)

Much more relevant to this thread, in game Three and Four today, I kept a note of how often Advanced Optics would have helped me.
I forgot to note on one or two attack runs, but overall the tally was 7 out of 17 attacks.
Going back to BitterFig's numbers earlier, a touch better than expectations.
In theory, you are expecting one of your four attacks (probably three Focused attacks) to add a damage.... so, essentially once on the first turn and then maybe if you are lucky every engagement thereafter.

Is that Worth it compared to, say, Heavy Lasers or upgrading to Predator/Crack Shot Reds?
I really don't know. I wasn't paying attention to the rest of the game state at the time the tallies were being made...
But it feels kinda good in a Dice Variance way.

I like the idea of Advanced Optics better than Heavy Lasers.
Even though I have not really paying attention to my Bullseye, after playing the four Blues for a while, I feel that I am only ever getting one or two bullseyes per turn... and probably half of them are at Range One, where the Heavy Laser is irrelevant. I have not played a lot against Large/ Medium based ships (this weekend was the most that I have seen them), and they are easier to paint bullseyes on than most... but even so, I feel that Advanced Optics is a better alternative. numerically, a single Focused Heavy Laser shot amongst two other focused shots does not significantly improve output, when Advanced Optics (active all the time) potentially does.

How about Advanced Optic Blues vs. the Predator Reds?
There is a more difficult decision. Predator Reds throw a higher Initiative shot. If you are suspecting you are facing more Lower Initiative ships, the Predator Reds are of Much More value. Closing your wings to line up the Bullseye is a valid strategy because of how T70 SFoils work.
However, if you are in a higher Initiative and/or Ace-type region, this is not as likely to work for you and you might be better off sticking to the Lower Initiative Advanced Optics/Heavy Lasers.
I think this one boils down to how much you value Initiative 3. If Initiative 3 feels better to you, Predator or Crack Reds are probably a better Offensive Choice than Advanced Optics Blues if you feel confident with your Bullseyes.

Would I choose Advanced Optics Blues over Regenerating Blues?
Oooh..... difficult. Beef vs Potential higher attack... I would want actual testing on this.
I know and like the Regenerating Blues, the frustration the opponent faces when they don't wipe one immediately and know that they will eventually have to chase it down.
I suspect that they will be equally unpleased if they face consistent 2-3 damage to dodge per turn.
With the Regenerating Blues, I am Regenerating 3-4 Shields on average. I also tend to take as many shots to the shields as I can without spending Focus, using it to stop Criticals getting to the Hull or maybe if I roll two+ eyeballs and relying on a Regeneration Evacuation to keep the ship highly functioning. However, that ship is also not shooting offensively, effectively leaving me with a three ship list for two turns (usually).
Advanced Optics is roughly 1 Damage more per turn against 1 Agility, and about 50-50 to improve damage against 2, 3 and 4 dice defense. That might be worth it if I follow the same defensive rules as I do with the R2 Astromechs.

Maybe those Advanced Optic RZ-2 A Wing guys know something we don't....


EDIT
I must clarify a statement here:
"Advanced Optics is roughly 1 Damage more per turn against 1 Agility, and about 50-50 to improve damage against 2, 3 and 4 dice defense."
SHOULD BE
"With 3 Focused Advanced Optics Ships, Advanced Optics is roughly expecting to deal 1 Damage more per turn against 1 Agility, and about 50-50 to improve expected damage against 2, 3 and 4 dice defense (when compared to having no further Offensive Upgrades)."

Edited March 12, 2019 by Vespid1311