A Slight Reimagining of The Last Jedi

[MasterShake2 5,184]

Re imagining the Last Jedi

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I didn't hate the movie as much as most, but it's definitely got problems, so we're basically going to try to turn it into something more watchable, but, to be honest, I don't hate many of the ideas of the narrative, I just feel it was very clumsily told.

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Let's start with the entire opening battle. Instead of a really long winded exchange between Poe and Hux, instead we get this exchange

"I'm here for the terms of surrender"

"The Resistance will lay down it's arms, submit to the first order and kneel before our might as our glory is spread across the galaxy!"

"Wait, you think I'm offering to surrender?" *checks gauge and sees the booster is charged* "Nuts!" *Engages booster*

-

Seriously, a 1 minute exchange tops with a brief punchline and get on with our lives. The battle in the movie focuses way too much on Poe and how great of a pilot he is, but to be honest, most of these scenes just feel recycled or generic. How about instead of several minutes worth of Poe gunning down every last turret when we all know he's going to do it anyways, we flash the camera to a very anxious bomber crew as the captain calls out Poe's success and the gunner's scan the stars for contacts. In this version, Poe and the entire Resistance fleet isn't going against orders, this is their mission. Instead of more dogfighting, we take this opportunity to get back to the franchise's roots and use WW2 era footage of German fighters attacking allied bombers, making shallow passes and following the gunners as they try desperately to track incoming targets. As casualties mount, Leia gives the order to call the bombers back, but Poe beckons 1 of the bombers saying, they gotta do this now! The bomber wades through enemy fighters as a handful of escorts try to keep them at bay, but is so critically wounded that it can't deliver it's payload. Everybody looks dejected, but the captain of the bomber nods to his crew and noses in on the dreadnought. Poe tries to call them off of the suicide run, but it's too late. It disappears into the hull of the dreadnought in a massive ball of fire.

-

The Resistance fleet safely jumps to hyperspace, but shortly after they jump, the first order is hot on their heels. They're being tracked, but without knowing how it's too risky to jump again. The massive first order fleet can't quite catch the Resistance ships, but start sending waves of TIE's on bombing runs as they bombard the flagship. At first the resistance pilots score easy successes, but soon it becomes apparent this won't be enough. Again more, WW2 inspiration, the Battle of Britain. A small number of pilots are all that stands between the last light of hope against fascism in the galaxy. Almost as soon as pilots lay their heads down for a nap, the siren sounds again and they have to scramble for another sortie. After a few days, the remaining pilots are ragged and exhausted. The flight crews are scavenging parts from wherever they can to keep ships running, even going so far as to cannibalize non-critical ship systems. It's painfully apparent to everyone that the resistance is teetering on the edge of oblivion.

-

It's here that Poe concots a plan to send out a small team led by Finn to Canto Bight to find a slicer that can potentially send a team through the shield of the First Order's super vessel. On Canto Bight, they find the slicer, but he immediately balks at this plan. What they propose is simply suicide. He won't agree to go a long, but he puts them in touch with a local smuggling ring that's sympathetic to the Resistance ever since First Order crackdowns in the area. They offer their services to move what supplies they can to the Resistance fleet.

-

More WW2 inspired plot points, the evacuation at Dunkirk. The Resistance stumble across the old Resistance base of Crait, a stopoff on the route they took to elude the first order. It's decided that the fleet can't reach a refueling point to escape and their best chance is to flee to the old base. The crews of the ships are slowly evacuated, waiting in line for their turns. It doesn't look like they'll be able to complete the evacuation in time until the smuggling ships jump out of hyperspace. After a breif exchange, the heavily modified freighters dump their cargo and use their souped up engines to move personnel planteside. All the while, the last few fighter pilots are staving off absolute exhaustion to continue flying sortees to protect the fleet and transports, but suffering increasing losses as the TIEs enjoy more and more freedom to harass the evacuation ships.

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Finally, as the last crews are evacuated, a select few draw straws. The last capitol ships have to buy time. A few tense scenes of individual crew members manning empty decks to prepare for a rearguard action. The Raddus and her escorts turn into the first order fleet, guns blazing, running full speed into the First Order formations firing in all directions. When the Raddus hereself has suffered critical damage, the captain gives the order, they set the self destruct and lay in a course for the First Order Flagship.

-

In Crait, a bright explosion in the sky elicits cheers from the Resistance on the ground, but then the realization sets in. It wasn't enough, none of it was. They grimly set to their duties of preparing the defenses on what most have accepted will be their graves...on to Episode 9

[Marinealver 8,073]

Anything would have been better than the Casino planet scene. 

[That Blasted Samophlange 6,923]

So..   not to be completely flippant, but if you feel this strongly about it, why don't you make it?   

After a year of these types of thread, I'm really in the ‘get up or shut up’ mindset.   Too many just sit in a chair and post in the internet rather than go out and try to make a better movie, I mean Rian Johnson was a total hack right?   It should be EASY to get your screenplay made. 🙄

If you are seriously bothered by the movie, and not just calling out @MasterShake2 here, but all those still griping, get together and remake the movie yourself!

 

Edited December 12, 2018 by That Blasted Samophlange

[MasterShake2 5,184]

1 hour ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

So..   not to be conpletely flippant, but if you feel this strongly about it, why don't you make it?   

After a year of these types of thread, I'm really in the ‘get up or shut up’ mindset.   Too many just sit in a chair and post in the internet rather than go out and try to make a better movie, I mean Rian Johnson was a total hack right?   It should be EASY to get your screenplay made. 🙄

If you are seriously bothered by the movie, and not just calling out @MasterShake2 here, but all those still griping, get together and remake the movie yourself!

 

Because I lack the funds? I mean, if someone is willing to sponsor it and Disney doesn't slap me with a lawsuit, I'm 100% on board with this idea.

[ViscerothSWG 3,940]

Rey shows up on Luke Island and tells him what's up.

Luke meditates and waits with his ghosty projection watching for the first order leadership to all stand outside.

They all stand outside.

Luke and Yoda call down the lightning and kill them all.

Conflict over.

Rey starts an unjedi balance oriented school and all the graduates earn the title Skywalker the way Sith earn Darth. They all wear a jagged looking white S on their robes. The S stands for Hope. The jagged white font stands for Lightning. They all do lightning now.

Peace throughout the galaxy.

[redxavier 238]

It feels you're cramming too much into this (you've got days and days of space battles). And ultimately what you've done is replace one set of questions/issues with another fresh set.

[BlodVargarna 4,041]

Not to mention the best part of the movie was the interaction between Luke / Rey and Rey / Kylo. Where does that fit in your reimagined version? 

 

(Admittedly some of those ideas are solid). 

[MasterShake2 5,184]

Glad you ask!

-

Part 2

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So, the Last Jedi is really 2 seperate arcs, one following the broader resistance and one following Rey training, so let's look at the latter.  In the movie, we get a frankly ridiculous opening to the Jedi training.  Luke dismissively tosses his lightsaber away (seemingly for a cheap laugh), then proceeds to Island of the Blue Dolphins for a frankly unbearable amount of screen time, seemingly without realizing who Rey was or what she was there for.  There's a small problem though, in that Luke should be able to sense a force user on the level of Rey that doesn't know how to control their ability.  He's been shown to be one of the most intuitive force users in cannon and even later in this movie, going so far as to catch himself with the force when he falls.  Let's just redo this intro.

-

*Luke stares down at the lightsaber, then looks suspiciously at Rey*

*He pauses for a moment and realization seems to hit him, a familiarity*

*His mechnical hand, holding the lightsaber, drops to his side*

"I'm sorry, but the Jedi Master you're looking for is no longer here"

*The lightsaber slips out of his hand and he starts to walk awy*

Rey pleads with him to train her, but he shakes his head and walks back into hut.  After a few moments of meditating, he hears a familiar voice.

"Train her, you should, powerful she is"

Luke looks over to force ghost Yoda and gives a half-hearted smile, "I failed my last apprentices...Ben, most of all"

"When we met, hiding from my own failures, I was.  Seduced to the dark side, my own apprentice was.  But train you, I did and a mistake, it was not"

*he pokes Luke with his cane*

Luke medidates for another moment before heading back outside and sees Rey as soon as he opens the door.  Training ensues.  While we have some paralells with Dagobah i.e. force ghost arguing for master to train pupil, the tone is different.  Yoda is trying to both instill that mistakes happen and reinforce his faith in Luke.  We also cut a lot of the filler time you have in the TLJ with Luke going about his day-to-day routine, something that doesn't have bearing on the broader plot, or even really characters.

-

Much of the rest of the training segments will be the same, becuase, outside of some filler moments that could be cut, most of it is actually pretty well done.  In particular, the Kylo/Rey scenes.  The cave scene is fine, even if it's not what the audience is looking for.  It fits Rey at this point in the story narratively, with my only gripe being that it drags on a little too much for a scene that won't have any payoff until far later when Kylo references her being nothing, but not to him.  It's useful, but since it doesn't have immediate impact other than putting Rey in a more vulnerable headspace, we don't need to spend as much time on it.

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Then, during Rey's training she starts to sense the problems in the Resistance fleet.  She's talked enough with Kylo that she thinks she can end this once and for all.  She asks Luke toi go with her.  Remembering his own experience on Bespin, he reaches out with his robotic hand to grab her shoulder, "It's not going to end how you think it will.  I know, I've been there."  She brushes him off.  Much like he did in Empire, she can't just ignore the suffering.  Chewie drops her off in this version, much like in TLJ, but here, he doesn't just piss off for no reason, he sees the evacuation in the resistance fleet underway and uses the Falcon to help transport crew planetside.  The encounter with Kylo and Snoke goes exactly like it did in the movie proper.  As the evacuation is wrapping up and Chewie sees the Raddus and her escorts turning into the First Order fleet, he knows this is the best chance to get Rey.  In the ensuing battle he lands in one of the hangars and starts searching.  In the lightsaber explosion/Raddus self-destruct ram, both Kylo and Rey are knocked out.  Chewie finds the throne room, but is being chased by First Order troopers.  He looks at Kylo's unconscious body and growls angrily and back to Rey.  He knows what he wants to do, but also knows what he has to do, and picks up Rey, carrying her out through a storm of blaster fire.

-

Then, waiting for him at the Falcon, is Captain Phasma.  Standing not as person, but as a symbol of the seemingly inexhaustible and undefeatable First Order.  A fight ensues, but Chewie quickly realizes he's underestimated this person.  Even after delivering a few good blows, including one that damages her helmet, Phasma still fights with fanatical zeal, seemingly unphased by the hits.  She lands a series of telling blows with one of the first order's riot control weapons.  As a small contingent of Storm troopers show up, happy to watch the fight, Chewie realizes that he needs to leave before it gets worse and summons a last gasp of energy, picks up Phasma while she repeatedly hits him the stun weapon, and throws her into the stormtroopers.  He runs to grab Rey and board the falcon, visibly limping.  Phasma pulls herself to her feat and just calls on the radio "A ship is leaving the main hanger, shoot it down"

-

Chewie flees from the First Order fleet being harassed by TIEs, but with no crew to man the weapons.  He calls the Resistance for help.  We then show Poe on Crait, asleep in the cockpit of an X-Wing with a patchwork of mismatched parts.  Leia is on the access ladder next to him and gives him a gentle nudge, "Do you have one more in you flyboy?"  Poe gives a half hearted grin, "For you, general".  Poe races to meet Chewie and clean the TIEs off, but his flying is visibly sloppy and he suffers several hits that BB-8 has to repair.  After a short running fight, they get within range of Crait's air defenses and the TIE's disengage.  Upon landing, Poe splashes some water on his face.  He sees an ad-hoc memorial of identification tags in the hangar bay.  He stumbles his way to Leia, "What are even doing this for?  What do we even have left."  She puts her hand on his shoulder, "The same thing  we've always had and, sometimes the only thing you have left, hope."  The camera moves across the Resistance soldiers preparing their defenses and the ship crews being issued and trained on weapons.  Then we make a move to Kylo on the Supremacy looking through the main hangar window at Crait as First Order walkers are loaded onto landing bargesin the background.

-

So, to clarify a few things, the symbolism with the British empire in the battle of Britain and Dunkirk evacuation are very intentional.  It was a time in history where Britain seemed to be last hope for Europe and that hope looked like it could fade any day.  It draws an easy parallel to the Resistance in this installment.  We have a series of incomplete or Pyrrhic victories.   The good guys are able to move forwards, but always at a great cost.  This is also why we're ending the movie at the build up to Crait, since the battle doesn't match the rest of the movie thematically for a number of levels and is a relatively flat encounter with some ex-machina action.  That's fine for the intro of the next movie, but doesn't quite jive with the note we want to end on here. 

-

In terms of timing, I'd bet money this movie is far shorter even with a higher emphasis on the scenes with the fleet.  We're skipping Luke doing the Bear Grills thing on the island, the battle of Crait and most of Canto Bight.  But while this would be shorter, I'd argue the experience would be far more complete.

[BlodVargarna 4,041]

The Chewie bundling off Rey from Snoke’s ship doesn’t work IMHO. 

 

 

[FTS Gecko 24,135]

On 12/12/2018 at 3:02 PM, That Blasted Samophlange said:

After a year of these types of thread, I'm really in the ‘get up or shut up’ mindset... 

Cool, so we have someone here trying to find a way to personally enjoy ab absolute cluster**** of a film and you're having a go at them for it?

Doesn't sound very helpful to me.

TLJ is a very divisive film.  If you don't like reading people's viewpoints or opinions on it, maybe the best solution would be to just avoid looking at the topic in the first place?

[Sekac 3,506]

I honestly think most of the main issues with the movie could be solved by simply rearranging many of the scenes.

The timeline is the biggest issue. All of the Resistance evacuation, escape, Canto Bight, and the final showdown are mostly fine timeline wise.

Trying to fit Rey's training into that same timespan is just awkward, and worst of all--unnecessary. Having her training sequence mapped onto something like 2 days does nothing but undermine the believability of her training and rushes her maturing.

By changing the opening scrawl slightly, and having the movie begin where TFA left off--with her holding the saber out to Luke, you change it entirely. Have that moment up until sleeping outside of Luke's hut as the opening and you establish that her arc isn't concurrent with the Resistance escape.

[That Blasted Samophlange 6,923]

5 hours ago, FTS Gecko said:

Cool, so we have someone here trying to find a way to personally enjoy ab absolute cluster**** of a film and you're having a go at them for it?

Doesn't sound very helpful to me.

TLJ is a very divisive film.  If you don't like reading people's viewpoints or opinions on it, maybe the best solution would be to just avoid looking at the topic in the first place?

What I want is people to stop sitting in front if their screens and actually DO something about it.   Go create art!!  Don't like it, prove you can do it better.  So many people harp on Rian Johnson, heck even George Lucas, but they don't actually make anything thenselves.   

[Animewarsdude 3,639]

2 hours ago, Sekac said:

I honestly think most of the main issues with the movie could be solved by simply rearranging many of the scenes.

The timeline is the biggest issue. All of the Resistance evacuation, escape, Canto Bight, and the final showdown are mostly fine timeline wise.

Trying to fit Rey's training into that same timespan is just awkward, and worst of all--unnecessary. Having her training sequence mapped onto something like 2 days does nothing but undermine the believability of her training and rushes her maturing.

By changing the opening scrawl slightly, and having the movie begin where TFA left off--with her holding the saber out to Luke, you change it entirely. Have that moment up until sleeping outside of Luke's hut as the opening and you establish that her arc isn't concurrent with the Resistance escape.

Which is why the story group went out of their way to say that places strong in the force have magic time fields around them that changes how fast time passes in them...of course they only use this to explain away why Rey is spending 2 days on the planet while we strictly know the plot is set during an 18 hour period, or theres abouts. I mean, I could easily just accept that the planet had a different rotation speed so it had shorter days or the like.

But you are right, and it is one of my complaints about her arc too. TLJ really needed a timeskip, not only just for the film but for lore building as it would give time for others characters to have adventures while she trained.

[redxavier 238]

7 hours ago, Sekac said:

Trying to fit Rey's training into that same timespan is just awkward, and worst of all--unnecessary. Having her training sequence mapped onto something like 2 days does nothing but undermine the believability of her training and rushes her maturing.

I'd argue that's the point. She doesn't get trained by Luke and isn't supposed to. She's not on the island to get XP so that she can level up, she's there to bring Luke back to save the galaxy (and get some understanding of what's happening to her). Luke doesn't want to come back. So she goes off to get Ben to get him to save the galaxy. Her arc in the story is realising that she can be hero to save the galaxy.

You're not going to get 'The Adventures of Master Luke and Rey'. Small rewrites aren't going to make that happen. It's fine to have wanted a whole new story entirely but arguing that key parts of the story we did get were unnecessary because they didn't conform to your ideal story isn't the right approach.

[Red Castle 3,875]

2 hours ago, redxavier said:

I'd argue that's the point. She doesn't get trained by Luke and isn't supposed to. She's not on the island to get XP so that she can level up, she's there to bring Luke back to save the galaxy (and get some understanding of what's happening to her). Luke doesn't want to come back. So she goes off to get Ben to get him to save the galaxy. Her arc in the story is realising that she can be hero to save the galaxy.

You're not going to get 'The Adventures of Master Luke and Rey'. Small rewrites aren't going to make that happen. It's fine to have wanted a whole new story entirely but arguing that key parts of the story we did get were unnecessary because they didn't conform to your ideal story isn't the right approach.

Thank you.

Thinking that Rey went to Achto-To to train as a Jedi is a big misconception that I see often. She didn't go there to train, she went there to get Luke back into the fight. When she handed Luke his lightsaber, it wasn't a symbology to say 'please, train me as a jedi for the next month or two so I can go back and become the hero the Resistance need', it was to say 'please, take back your weapon and come with me to save the Galaxy against the threat of the First Order like the legend you're supposed to be'.

But since Luke doesn't want to come back, his answer is eventually 'Alright, I won't go back, but I'll teach you so you can go and save the day'... but was he really teaching her? His lessons were more about why the Jedi order should end, he even says so. Three lessons: 1-The Force doesn't belong to anyone 2-It was the Jedi vanity that brought the Sith into power and his own that created Kylo Ren 3-(only in the book) Sometimes your actions can bring more consequences. He never teach her to be a Jedi.

 

[Sekac 3,506]

3 hours ago, redxavier said:

I'd argue that's the point. She doesn't get trained by Luke and isn't supposed to. She's not on the island to get XP so that she can level up, she's there to bring Luke back to save the galaxy (and get some understanding of what's happening to her). Luke doesn't want to come back. So she goes off to get Ben to get him to save the galaxy. Her arc in the story is realising that she can be hero to save the galaxy.

You're not going to get 'The Adventures of Master Luke and Rey'. Small rewrites aren't going to make that happen. It's fine to have wanted a whole new story entirely but arguing that key parts of the story we did get were unnecessary because they didn't conform to your ideal story isn't the right approach.

What exactly is the right approach, out of curiosity? 

If I think the biggest issues are with pacing and timelines what is the objectively correct way to approach that, if reordering the scenes is incorrect?

 

[redxavier 238]

Depends on what your goal is. The right approach would be to think of the story that's being told and to improve/enhance that, rather than propose alternatives that drastically change the themes or character arcs. When you say that the Rey storyline needs more time so that Rey can be trained properly or to mature, I take that to mean that you want to see a different story with Rey that's in opposition to the intended goals of the writer/director. That doesn't sound like a pacing or timeline issue.

[Sekac 3,506]

13 hours ago, redxavier said:

Depends on what your goal is. The right approach would be to think of the story that's being told and to improve/enhance that, rather than propose alternatives that drastically change the themes or character arcs. When you say that the Rey storyline needs more time so that Rey can be trained properly or to mature, I take that to mean that you want to see a different story with Rey that's in opposition to the intended goals of the writer/director. That doesn't sound like a pacing or timeline issue.

No, the primary issue is there's no reason whatsoever to have the FO counter attack occur immediately after TFA. None at all. No reason whatsoever other than they started their story board there and so that's what it was. 

So they made the entire movie take place over an incredibly short period of time because...well...because nothing. One of the biggest complaints of the series in general, and TLJ specifically, is how unbelievable Rey is as a Jedi-ish type. A large part of that is the fact that she receives almost no training whatsoever but is then capable of performing as if she were trained.

Her going to meet Luke wasn't for training purposes? Fine, then don't arbitrarily make her better than people who are trained.

But you can't really have it both ways. She didn't go to train, she just accidentally became trained by being there for tea time. 

They wrote themselves a very small box in which to develop characters, but there's no payoff whatsoever to have a difficult to write timespan.