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paganeagle2001

Can these be used for keys?

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By the way, the numbers on the dice mean nothing. The bases are unforged, when a key is forged I just put in a dice. The pips don't represent anything, it doesn't add Amber totals, dames ge,  stuns or +1's etc.

they are purely a representation of a forged key.

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By the way, the numbers on the dice mean nothing. The bases are unforged, when a key is forged I just put in a dice. The pips don't represent anything, it doesn't add Amber totals, dames ge,  stuns or +1's etc.

they are purely a representation of a forged key.

and what if I colour in the pips?

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Technically, the tournament regs state "NOTE: The use of dice of any kind is not permitted in KeyForge Organized Play."

But it you want to delve into the spirit of the rule, the idea is that dice cannot be used to count things. So, no dice for damage, or amber, or shields, or power, stuff like that. But in a case like this, where the number is immaterial and you're just using it as a colored cube to represent a single thing, I'd call it ok. But that's only my opinion.

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You should be fine, even with the dice.  In several interviews the devs joked that you could use dice if you just wanted to use them as tokens.  But you could not use them in in a way in which the facing mattered, to avoid conflict ig the die gets moved on claims of what the number should say.  

But if you find yourself going to a premier event I might bring something else.  Just in case you get a serious rules lawyer Judge or marshal.  

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There are a few different views on this topic, and I expect there to be some official clarification of this topic down the road.  As for now (without clarification), I would default to what Fantasy Flight has said.  This becomes a bit difficult.  What they have listed in rule books, is different than what they have specifically addressed.  

Here is a video from FFG that is a bit of a FAQ about OP play.  In it, they say that you could use dice, as long as the dice was simply a token.  This is how you are viewing your dice.  You might want to see if the white pips can be scratched off of those dice.  On some they can, giving you a better final appearance.  The video explains the nature and reason behind the no dice rule.  It is so that values are not held on a dice, which can get bumped to an incorrect value.  

The following information is evidence as to why the video should be viewed as correct over the rule book:

The same misinformation applies to being able to see your opponent's deck list in Sealed play.  If you go by the tournament rule book, you can view the opponents list only 2 minutes just before the match.  If you listen to the video, they clearly say that in sealed the deck list is hidden.  This is more evidence of incorrect rule books.  I am making the claim that the tournament rule book is incomplete, due to prevalence of evidence.  First, they talk about this exact topic on November 6th's youtube video.  The rule book seems to be from November 18th (but was it created much earlier i.e. which has precedence?).  I propose that the video is correct and more current information, because it also complies with what the keyforge website itself says about sealed tournaments on this page https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2018/10/15/how-does-this-thing-work/ This was one of the "Vaults" of information that was available on fantasy flight's main keyforge page https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/op/keyforge/

Formats and Variants

There are two formats: Archon and Sealed.

  • In the Archon format, you choose the deck or decks you bring to an event.
  • In the Sealed format, you open one or more decks at the event and play with no advance knowledge of your deck's strengths and weaknesses—nor may you see your opponent's deck list.

 

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Hi

I am a budget player in all the games I play so I been using all my 20dice from MTG, I got so many of them and I don't have 70$ for those unique counter packages being offered by FFG, I want one but 70$ dollars CAD!?!?! make that cheaper please... I've had no issues with any players since I just tell them it is colour coded: White is amber, Red is damage, Black/Green is stun/miscellaneous. Also when I make a key I just put the Green/Black 20d dice on it's insignia on one of the houses on my archon card, this probably won't work for everyone though but the players I have played with thus far have all liked my set up despite some of them even using the cardboard amber counters and stuff just because it is more efficient and easy:P

Another option I have considered is LEGO. The Lego pieces are all the proper colours and there small, click together for easy use and portability and you won't probably care if you lose any. I'll probably just switch to Lego when I got some time to order the bits I need when I join a tournament LOL.

In conclusion I personally prefer using my 20d casually since it takes up less space and seems more practical especially when I am playing in a mall on FNM.

cheers

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1 hour ago, player3686594 said:

Hi

I am a budget player in all the games I play so I been using all my 20dice from MTG, I got so many of them and I don't have 70$ for those unique counter packages being offered by FFG, I want one but 70$ dollars CAD!?!?! make that cheaper please...

If you're buying custom game components from places like Etsy, yeah, they're going to be pricey.

However, for $40, you can get two decks, AND all the tokens you need to play. In a starter box. Assuming you can find one, that is.

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On 12/7/2018 at 5:13 AM, Duciris said:

Use the disease cubes from Pandemic.  They're maybe 5mm^3, but identical colors to blue, red, & yellow (& black).

 I use pandemic cubes for +1 power stun and chains.

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On 12/7/2018 at 12:45 PM, player3686594 said:

Hi

I am a budget player in all the games I play so I been using all my 20dice from MTG, I got so many of them and I don't have 70$ for those unique counter packages being offered by FFG, I want one but 70$ dollars CAD!?!?! make that cheaper please...

Is it possible that you are confusing this with a third party developer of tokens? I've been looking into cool tokens a bit and the only token set I know of near that price is from Team Covenant's website.

As far as I know official tokens only come through from a purchase of a core set. That's only $40 and half of that cost is two decks. :)

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I've been using Yellow and Red glass bead from an old Pente game set as Amber and Damage.  And some clear ones to track damaged armor.

I've seen people use Red and Yellow Pokémon energy as +1power and Stun cards. 

So then the only thing to track is chains. Someone was tracking those with pennies.

There are tons of cheap options that do not include 3d printing, Etsy, or Dice.

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I'm wondering about this too, because we have lego dice and I made them into keys. I have opaque singles on one side for forged, and semi=transparent on the opposite side for unforged.  All of the tokens are also lego pieces, I really like the set.

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On 12/7/2018 at 9:45 AM, player3686594 said:

Hi

I am a budget player in all the games I play so I been using all my 20dice from MTG, I got so many of them and I don't have 70$ for those unique counter packages being offered by FFG, I want one but 70$ dollars CAD!?!?! make that cheaper please... I've had no issues with any players since I just tell them it is colour coded: White is amber, Red is damage, Black/Green is stun/miscellaneous. Also when I make a key I just put the Green/Black 20d dice on it's insignia on one of the houses on my archon card, this probably won't work for everyone though but the players I have played with thus far have all liked my set up despite some of them even using the cardboard amber counters and stuff just because it is more efficient and easy:P

Another option I have considered is LEGO. The Lego pieces are all the proper colours and there small, click together for easy use and portability and you won't probably care if you lose any. I'll probably just switch to Lego when I got some time to order the bits I need when I join a tournament LOL.

In conclusion I personally prefer using my 20d casually since it takes up less space and seems more practical especially when I am playing in a mall on FNM.

cheers

Well, the good news is those are just polyhedral spin-down counters and not actually dice, so they should be perfectly legal. 

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21 minutes ago, WonderWAAAGH said:

Well, the good news is those are just polyhedral spin-down counters and not actually dice, so they should be perfectly legal. 

They’re not. Not interested in rehashing that whole thread, but in the interest of new people seeking information: spin down counters will not be legal in anything above store level. At your store check with the TO beforehand, most will follow official tournament rules and not allow them, but some will.

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FFG may or may not choose to rule that way, eventually, but as of right now there's nothing absolute or definitive about spin-down counters in the tournament guide. I would still talk to the TO first, just to make sure they understand that they're not actually dice. 

Edited by WonderWAAAGH

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7 minutes ago, WonderWAAAGH said:

FFG may or may not choose to rule that way, eventually, but as of right now there's nothing absolute or definitive about spin-down counters in the tournament guide. I would still talk to the TO first, just to make sure they understand that they're not actually dice. 

I can never remember if you are the troll making fun of the guy who thinks calling them 'spindown counters' makes them functionally different than dice, or the guy who actually thinks they are going to get away with using a 20 side die by calling it something else.  

If you are the latter, give it up.  All you have to do is hear their reasoning for not allowing dice to know they aren't going to let you use your 'spindown counter'

Edited by xbeaker

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I am an Ork, sir, not a Troll. We space-fungoid types have very different senses of humor, but in this case I'm being quite earnest. Calling them something different is well and beside the point, since they are functionally different. Or do official Magic tournaments bar them from use for no good reason? 

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