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Darth Meanie

A New Type of TIE?

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On 11/12/2018 at 11:30 AM, Forgottenlore said:

See, I distinctly DON’T want non-tie fighters for the Empire, they define the look of the faction. I hate that the gunboat got made. 

Though I do agree we are running out of viable TIE variants. We aren’t there yet, but close. 

So do you not like the Lambda shuttle? Or the Decimator? Only TIES for the Empire in the X-Wing miniatures scale?

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30 minutes ago, Koing907 said:

So do you not like the Lambda shuttle? Or the Decimator? Only TIES for the Empire in the X-Wing miniatures scale?

For small fighters, yeah. Larges are a different class and so have different rules.

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46 minutes ago, Forgottenlore said:

For small fighters, yeah. Larges are a different class and so have different rules.

I think the Gunboat is one of the few EU ships that looks Empire-ey without being a TIE knockoff. It's got a design similarity to the Lambda shuttle, and so fits in next to it as a heavy fighter chassis from the same designers.

Most of the TIE variants look pretty goofy to me. The Defender has grown on me since FFG made it for the game, but up until then it was the TIE with a bunch of extra panels stuck to it, and ridiculous OP stats from the TIE Fighter game. Really FFG have saved a lot of the EU designs, in my opinion.

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13 hours ago, Koing907 said:

I think the Gunboat is one of the few EU ships that looks Empire-ey without being a TIE knockoff. It's got a design similarity to the Lambda shuttle, and so fits in next to it as a heavy fighter chassis from the same designers.

Most of the TIE variants look pretty goofy to me. The Defender has grown on me since FFG made it for the game, but up until then it was the TIE with a bunch of extra panels stuck to it, and ridiculous OP stats from the TIE Fighter game. Really FFG have saved a lot of the EU designs, in my opinion.

I'm the other way around. I have loved the defender from the first moment I saw it, but the gunboat HAS grown on me a bit. I'd still rather all small imperial ships be TIE variants (but good ones, there are a bunch of REALLY stupid looking ones out there), but that ship has sailed.

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Posted (edited)
16 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

The TIE/rb seems like the best option:

  • I wouldn't mind droid TIEs but with the seperatists I don't want to tread on their 'thing' so quickly
  • It's still a calculate-using ship - something the empire currently doesn't have
  • It tactically replaces the TIE/sf which is now first order.

Oh, the TIE/rb will be the next Imperial ship, I have no doubt.

And I do agree that CiS should be allowed to have the droid fighter as their shtick for awhile.  But someday, it's a ready-made mechanic ready for sharing.

OTOH, what if I built a CiS Vulture droid list and then made it look like an Imperial fleet. . .

Edited by Darth Meanie

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I guess I am in the minority thinking that most of the EU stuff is flaming dumpster fire garbage.

It boils down to

"Can I copy your home work?"

"Sure just change it around a little so nobody notices"

So we get countless stories of oddly named mercs against Imperial superweapons and a new version of the TIE fighter with different wing panels.

 

Can we get something that actually fills a role that Naval aviation would have?

Fighter

Fleet defense

Interceptor

Attack

Recon /Early warning

Transport

 

Those are pretty much it. Anything new needs to fill one of those roles in a specific way that has not already been filled. I like the Heavy (Brute) TIE.

I would like to see a variation on the Punisher with a big flat radar dish on the top of it like an E2 Hawkeye.  Medium base with Coordinate and Jam. Cheaper than the Shuttle and more maneuverable.

  

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TIE Brute, TIE Scout, would both be great options. There is the dreadful TIE Hunter and there's also the TIE Oppressor. Really there are still a few models of EU TIE out there, but past Scout and Brute it's scraping the barrel for things that are actually unique.

Though the TIE Oppressor would be an interesting bomb dropper.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, GringoFett said:

Can we get something that actually fills a role that Naval aviation would have?

Fighter

Fleet defense

Interceptor

Attack

Recon /Early warning

Transport

Those are pretty much it.

Sure.  Just as soon as we get Epic back up for Fleet Defense.

And a game with Missions that might require Recon.

And atmospheric/planetary scenarios for Attack.

And I'll bet players will have a hoot playing a defenseless Transport that takes VIPs nowhere. 

Otherwise I really don't see the point of worrying about "duplicate design space" and "roles" in a game that is "kill them all" followed by a rousing game of "kill them all" leading to a brilliant finale of "kill them all."

Edited by Darth Meanie

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16 hours ago, Darth Meanie said:

Sure.  Just as soon as we get Epic back up for Fleet Defense.

And a game with Missions that might require Recon.

And atmospheric/planetary scenarios for Attack.

And I'll bet players will have a hoot playing a defenseless Transport that takes VIPs nowhere. 

Otherwise I really don't see the point of worrying about "duplicate design space" and "roles" in a game that is "kill them all" followed by a rousing game of "kill them all" leading to a brilliant finale of "kill them all."

Wow....

 

Fleet Defense is the Tie Defender

Attack is the TIE Bomber and Punisher 

Recon the Shuttle had the ability to be configured as a AWACS in 1.0. Jendon and the title allowed you to get target locks beyond range 3 and spit them out to your buddies......like an AWACS does in real life.

Transport the Bomber Shuttle did this.

 

So basically everything I pointed out already existed in the game, which was the point of my post. Maybe if you actually understood naval aviation you would have understood what I was saying there so I will give you a pass on it maybe you have spent your entire gaming experience playing Sci-fi games and have no real world frame of reference. 

Read some military history, specifically WW2 and the carrier war in the pacific. Maybe read some Vietnam history or Cold war history and again specifically carrier aviation. Play a few games of Harpoon and focus on building strike packages. Might open your eyes to the possibilities this game can provide.

Then you might be able to put together some games that are not just "kill them all"..

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8 minutes ago, GringoFett said:

Then you might be able to put together some games that are not just "kill them all"..

Well, my point was that there are no capital ships to defend, no installations to bomb, and no hidden bases to scout.  Everything is just a non-dogfighter tricked out to do dogfighting with an atypical mechanic.  

Until this game officially moves past Standard play, I just might try out your suggestion. . .

 

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19 hours ago, GringoFett said:

I would like to see a variation on the Punisher with a big flat radar dish on the top of it like an E2 Hawkeye.  Medium base with Coordinate and Jam. Cheaper than the Shuttle and more maneuverable.

You want the TIE Reaper. 

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1 hour ago, Darth Meanie said:

Well, my point was that there are no capital ships to defend, no installations to bomb, and no hidden bases to scout.  Everything is just a non-dogfighter tricked out to do dogfighting with an atypical mechanic.  

Until this game officially moves past Standard play, I just might try out your suggestion. . .

 

Yeah I see what you are saying. 

I think this contributes to people being confused or dissatisfied with certain ships in the game. For example Bombers. People cant understand why the bomber is not more capable. Well to your point its a dog fight game and bombers are not supposed to be dogfighting. 

That's the limitation on tournament play and that format driving the way people think about the game. 

I never let that decide things for me.

I have always looked at the game as being a way to play "air" games in the Star Wars universe. 

So I can do a mission with fighters escorting bombers or a transport or set up a station that the bombers need to attack and have one player defending that station. Even if you cant depict something directly on the table you can play out some aspect of almost any mission.

My gaming group very rarely plays the standard format game.

Last week for example we did an escort mission. It was 600 points per side with 5 players 2 Imperial/ scum and 3 rebel. The Imperials had to escort a large base ship down the length of a 3 x 6 mat. The large base ship could move any move on its dial but it got no actions and could not shoot. It was a transport with a High Value Rebel agent on board being taken into captivity. We gave it 16 hull points and the rebels had to take all those hull to disable it and rescue their agent.

Awesome game that came down to the last roll on the last turn. The Imperials won because of that evade roll!    

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, GringoFett said:

Last week for example we did an escort mission. It was 600 points per side with 5 players 2 Imperial/ scum and 3 rebel. The Imperials had to escort a large base ship down the length of a 3 x 6 mat. The large base ship could move any move on its dial but it got no actions and could not shoot. It was a transport with a High Value Rebel agent on board being taken into captivity. We gave it 16 hull points and the rebels had to take all those hull to disable it and rescue their agent.

You should try out Episode 2.  I've played it several times already as a stand alone.  It's a given that one of the transports is going to be lost, but the overall success is up for grabs.

Here is that mission as I was working the kinks out:

 

Edited by Darth Meanie

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Posted (edited)
39 minutes ago, GringoFett said:

Yeah I see what you are saying. 

I think this contributes to people being confused or dissatisfied with certain ships in the game. For example Bombers. People cant understand why the bomber is not more capable. Well to your point its a dog fight game and bombers are not supposed to be dogfighting. 

Heck, the few times in the films you see ships using ordinance, they are attacking static targets.  Proton Torpedoes against the two Death Stars, and  dropping space bombs on huge asteroids.

They don't seem to be intended for dogfighting, but here we are.

 

Edited by Koing907

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37 minutes ago, Koing907 said:

Heck, the few times in the films you see ships using ordinance, they are attacking static targets.  Proton Torpedoes against the two Death Stars, and  dropping space bombs on huge asteroids.

They don't seem to be intended for dogfighting, but here we are.

They're just going for the easy, 0-Agility kills.

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On ‎1‎/‎9‎/‎2019 at 1:29 PM, Darth Meanie said:

You should try out Episode 2.  I've played it several times already as a stand alone.  It's a given that one of the transports is going to be lost, but the overall success is up for grabs.

Here is that mission as I was working the kinks out:

 

I like that.

We set up the mission so that it could be either Rebel or Imperial. We just change the big base ship to suit.

I am working on a linked set of games for Imperial assault, Xwing and Armada so that will probably be our next themed game.

 

 

 

 

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Honestly, I'm set with all the TIE variants we got. I mean, we have all the mildly interesting ones already in my opinion. I think Empire ship wise is great where it's at. As long as they give more pilots and crew in the future i'll be content with the Empire faction for a long time. The only ship I think we are missing is the Sentinel Shuttle, but it would basically be a Lambda so I doubt they will add it to the game. 

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3 hours ago, Sir Orrin said:

Honestly, I'm set with all the TIE variants we got. I mean, we have all the mildly interesting ones already in my opinion. I think Empire ship wise is great where it's at. As long as they give more pilots and crew in the future i'll be content with the Empire faction for a long time. The only ship I think we are missing is the Sentinel Shuttle, but it would basically be a Lambda so I doubt they will add it to the game. 

Well,

I'd like to see the Blastboat, because I have always liked that ship.

I'd like to see the TIE Heavy because it's a movie ship.

I'd like to see the Sentinel Shuttle as sort of the Imperial Party Bus.

And in 1.0 I would not have cared about the TIE Droid, but now that droids have a unique in-game mechanic, I'd like to see them in game with a nod towards the "crazed Imperial scientist."

Edited by Darth Meanie

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6 hours ago, Sir Orrin said:

Honestly, I'm set with all the TIE variants we got. I mean, we have all the mildly interesting ones already in my opinion. I think Empire ship wise is great where it's at. As long as they give more pilots and crew in the future i'll be content with the Empire faction for a long time. The only ship I think we are missing is the Sentinel Shuttle, but it would basically be a Lambda so I doubt they will add it to the game. 

I would much rather have Director Krennic's shuttle over the Sentinel. It looks really cool, but different from current ships and there is options for game play. Maybe 2 red and 2 green with cannon slot and SLAM since it seemed very fast? A decent dial since it seemed pretty maneuverable? I don't know.

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3 hours ago, Darth Meanie said:

And in 1.0 I would not have cared about the TIE Droid, but now that droids have a unique in-game mechanic, I'd like to see them in game with a nod towards the "crazed Imperial scientist."

I agree. I would like to see the "crazed Imperial scientist" be a needed crew on a shuttle to even get access to the non standard Tie Droid. Maybe something where then Tie Droids get some bonus while in range 3 of the "Droid control shuttle" and they return to "basic programming" once they are out of range or the shuttle with the droid control scientist is dead. It makes them different from Vultures, but still a challenge to fly well. It also gives a clear strategy against them. A cheap swarm with a shuttle or decimator carrying the proper crew could be really fun. 

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