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On 11/10/2018 at 5:42 PM, nexttwelveexits said:

No.

(edit) Full explanation: rules prohibit multiple bonus attacks. The rule is on page 6 of rules reference, under Bonus Attack:

 

And yet FFG cleared up that a turret ship such as YT2400 can fire twice with Roark and Han gunner - sort of killing their own rule.

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34 minutes ago, Gallanteer said:

And yet FFG cleared up that a turret ship such as YT2400 can fire twice with Roark and Han gunner - sort of killing their own rule.

That's not two bonus attacks. You engage using Roark, then perform a bonus attack using Han. One bonus attack and one standard attack during engagement.

Edited by nexttwelveexits
thanks tbf

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15 minutes ago, nexttwelveexits said:

That's not two bonus attacks. You perform a bonus attack using Han, then engage using Roark. One bonus attack and one standard attack during engagement. 

Other way around: Roark first, since Han shuts off that arc afterwards.

18 minutes ago, Gallanteer said:

And yet FFG cleared up that a turret ship such as YT2400 can fire twice with Roark and Han gunner - sort of killing their own rule.

Roark (or Heightened Perception) isn't a bonus attack because it doesn't grant an attack outside of your engagement. Rather, it changes when your normal engagement happens.

I kinda get it, though.  It's a bit awkward to say "anything which isn't normal is a bonus attack" and then have a ruling where this isn't normal.  But it's not-normal in a different way.

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2 minutes ago, xwingMinty said:

This might be a bigger question again when Resistance Chewie and FO Quiz get here 

Nope.  It's no question, the limit is one bonus (or non-bonus additional, of which Rebel Han Gunner is currently the only one) attack per round.  No matter how many times you can trigger them.

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1 minute ago, thespaceinvader said:

Nope.  It's no question, the limit is one bonus (or non-bonus additional, of which Rebel Han Gunner is currently the only one) attack per round.  No matter how many times you can trigger them.

and while I want to believe that (even though it counters the golden rule of cards being able to overrule the rule book), why did they put a Charge of Quiz's skill (so he can just have 1 bonus revenge shot per round), but not do the same on Resistance Chewie (can take an action and shoot when a friendly ship dies). Charges on bonus shooting would have put these discussions to bed, because while I understand what you're saying @thespaceinvader, it's still an argument that can rightly be had.

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6 minutes ago, xwingMinty said:

and while I want to believe that (even though it counters the golden rule of cards being able to overrule the rule book), why did they put a Charge of Quiz's skill (so he can just have 1 bonus revenge shot per round), but not do the same on Resistance Chewie (can take an action and shoot when a friendly ship dies). Charges on bonus shooting would have put these discussions to bed, because while I understand what you're saying @thespaceinvader, it's still an argument that can rightly be had.

Rules Reference Page 23: Anything that permits an attack outside of the standard attack allowed to a ship when it engages is a bonus attack.

RR Pg 6: A ship can only perform 1 bonus attack per round.

Edited by Innese
Added second point

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Then why have the golden rule on page 2 'if the ability of a card conflicts with the rules, the card ability takes precedence'

I'm not saying you guys are wrong, I actually think you are; but what I'm saying is it's not cut and dry, and with FFG about to dump 4 new factions on us I'm sure there will be many questions that will come up that don't have easy answers 

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It's plausible they could CHANGE that rule, but they would have to change it.  It's not the case the the simple existence of those abilities implies a change, because there are already a bunch of ways to get 3+ attacks in a round, including the one mentioned ITT, and they don't work.  No more will the new ones.

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4 minutes ago, xwingMinty said:

Then why have the golden rule on page 2 'if the ability of a card conflicts with the rules, the card ability takes precedence'

I'm not saying you guys are wrong, I actually think you are; but what I'm saying is it's not cut and dry, and with FFG about to dump 4 new factions on us I'm sure there will be many questions that will come up that don't have easy answers 

because a lot of pilot abilities and a lot of upgrade cards conflicts with the rules, that's kind of a large reason for them being there. the rules on the cards still follow the rules, or bends or in some cases breaks them. it's essential for good game design.

you can have several bonus attacks on the same ship - and use them all. you just can't do it during the same round, because that's what the rules say about bonus attacks.

i completely agree, there will most certainly be more questions and more confusion and hopefully a lot of more ships and upgrades. that's why this forum is here.

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Yeah I'm not just trying to be difficult, I love this game and just like it when it runs smoothly (which isn't always the case). I just hope little discussions like this are occasionally looked at by FFG (meaning in this case they could look at the wording on cards before they come out). 

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I think anyone who argues the Golden Rule can permit multiple bonus attacks is fundamentally misapplying the Golden Rule. It doesn't say "Cards Can Do Whatever You Want Them To." When a rule in the RRG is phrased absolutely, like this one:

Quote

• A ship can perform only one bonus attack per round.

Then no matter where the bonus attack comes from, a ship can only perform one, unless a hypothetical card specifically contradicts it and permits you to perform a bonus attack beyond the first.

Edited by nexttwelveexits

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2 hours ago, xwingMinty said:

Then why have the golden rule on page 2 'if the ability of a card conflicts with the rules, the card ability takes precedence'

 

You are correct, cards do override the rules, but only when they specifically contradict the rules. To take an over-argued example from another thread, Deathfire does not get to launch any device he likes with his ability just because it uses the word "launch"; he needs another effect to enable the launch first (of which there are currently none).

Similarly here, a card telling you to perform a [bonus] attack does not in and of itself contradict the rule that you can only perform one of them per round. It no more lets you break that rule than Han gunner allows you to break the once per round rule on actions if you had Focused for your standard action.

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