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Mefyrx

is a S-Type Racing Sloop realy a Freighters and Transports?

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It is

Silhouette: 3

Encumbrance Capacity: 20

Passenger Capacity: 2

 

and the description says:

 

The Nubia Star Drives S-type Racing Sloop is one of the latest racing vessels created by the design collective and offered to discriminating buyers.  Built entirely for interstellar racing, these ships have nevertheless found a valuable niche as couriers for sensitive messages and high-value, extremely compact cargos.  These ships feature long, narrow, and blocky hulls that sweep backwards into large engines built into the hull above and below the inset cockpit.  The cockpit holds a pilot, navigator, and can also carry two passengers in foldable jump-seats (although this space is often used by experienced racers to store food or supplies).  The entire living space is horribly cramped, and traveling long distances quickly becomes an ordeal.  In tandem, the engines can accelerate the vessel to incredible speeds.  However, this stretches the Racing Sloop’s power plant to the maximum, little remains for shields, and none for weapons.

 

IT feels like a starfighter/shuttle rather than a ......transport...

Edited by Mefyrx

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In Civilian teams a sloop is typically a small boat usually intended for racing. If a racing boat is a "transport" or not depends on how much a ship has to be able to transport to be considered a transport. A medical courier is still a "transport" even though it's cargo is only a single human heart...

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2 hours ago, Mefyrx said:

It is

Silhouette: 3

Encumbrance Capacity: 20

Passenger Capacity: 2

 

and the description says:

 

The Nubia Star Drives S-type Racing Sloop is one of the latest racing vessels created by the design collective and offered to discriminating buyers.  Built entirely for interstellar racing, these ships have nevertheless found a valuable niche as couriers for sensitive messages and high-value, extremely compact cargos.  These ships feature long, narrow, and blocky hulls that sweep backwards into large engines built into the hull above and below the inset cockpit.  The cockpit holds a pilot, navigator, and can also carry two passengers in foldable jump-seats (although this space is often used by experienced racers to store food or supplies).  The entire living space is horribly cramped, and traveling long distances quickly becomes an ordeal.  In tandem, the engines can accelerate the vessel to incredible speeds.  However, this stretches the Racing Sloop’s power plant to the maximum, little remains for shields, and none for weapons.

 

IT feels like a starfighter/shuttle rather than a ......transport...

Technically, yes, it's a "transport", albeit a small one. A "transport" is any vessel designed to transport passengers or cargo over long distances. Since the sloop is designed to carry up to two passengers, as well as be used as a courier vessel (small cargo), rather than combat, it is considered a transport. For the record, a "shuttle" also falls under the "transport" umbrella. However, the term "shuttle" usually denotes short range travel, such as within an system, or from surface to orbit. 

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Following this logic, the "Curich – Class Shuttle" should be under "Freighters and Transports", not "Starfighters and Shuttles"?

Answering myself I guess: In Desperate Allies book, there weren't any sections....but the name Shuttle seem to mean that it was a Shuttle....although the description says Transport.... so yeah that would be a transport

Edited by Mefyrx

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9 minutes ago, Mefyrx said:

Following this logic, the "Curich – Class Shuttle" should be under "Freighters and Transports", not "Starfighters and Shuttles"?

Answering myself I guess: In Desperate Allies book, there weren't any sections....but the name Shuttle seem to mean that it was a Shuttle....although the description says Transport.... so yeah that would be a transport

That also follows for the Lamda Class "shuttle" as well, given that it's hyperdrive capable. But, as I said, a shuttle is a type of transport. 

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I understand....

 

Maybe they should have made the "Freighters, Transports and Shuttles" category and "Starfighters" apart in the books .... not that it matters much....

 

or maybe get "Starfigthers and Patrol Boats"

 

Edited by Mefyrx

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10 minutes ago, Tramp Graphics said:

That also follows for the Lamda Class "shuttle" as well, given that it's hyperdrive capable. But, as I said, a shuttle is a type of transport. 

I guess you've seen the work I've done thus far....

 

Maybe I should divide those categories.... 

Starfighters

Transport/Shuttle

Freighters....

 

Now the question should be, the freighter and transport have a similar purpose...what would be the defining factor...

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5 minutes ago, Mefyrx said:

What would be the difference between a Freighter and a Transport/Shuttle?

The only real difference between a "freighter" and a "transport" is the primary focus. A transport is a general category that covers everything from dedicated passenger ships, to those which handle a relatively even mix of passengers and cargo. A "Freighter" as the name implies, is optimized for carrying freight, rather than passengers, and thus, usually aren't capable of handling a lot of passengers, if any at all. For example, the YT-1300 is pretty much a dedicated freighter. It has a relatively large cargo hold for its size (up to 100 tons), but can carry only a small handful of passengers (6) in relatively cramped quarters. By comparison and contrast, a "transport" is more general purpose.  The YZ-900 Transport can also hold a pretty large amount of cargo (500 tons), but can carry far more passengers as well (14) in comfortable staterooms no less. It's designed specifically to carry both freight and passengers comfortably. Yes, you can reconfigure a YT-1300 to carry more passengers at the cost of cargo space, but they'd still be cramped quarters, simply because the ship is primarily designed as a cargo ship. That's the difference. 

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Question for you while were on the subject.....

We are on a mission at the moment, I may take over as a GM soon .... but we are on a planet with lots of people that we would like to evacuate... having a YT-1300 it says that I can carry 6 passenger and 165 capacity...

Could we stack people in the encumbrance capacity and if so how much .....how would that translate into people .... 10 capacity = 1 person?   and what downside would that give as it isn't optimize for that?

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2 minutes ago, Mefyrx said:

Question for you while were on the subject.....

We are on a mission at the moment, I may take over as a GM soon .... but we are on a planet with lots of people that we would like to evacuate... having a YT-1300 it says that I can carry 6 passenger and 165 capacity...

Could we stack people in the encumbrance capacity and if so how much .....how would that translate into people .... 10 capacity = 1 person?   and what downside would that give as it isn't optimize for that?

By canon? Yes.  BY RAW? No, not that I know of. There are no official rules yet for converting passenger and cargo space back and forth from one type to another. There are, however a variety of home-brewed house rules for it.  

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Encumbrance capacity is intentionally vague - allowing the GM and players to use apply some common sense rules to the enc of, say, a cargo container full of x-wing parts without being too prescriptive or requiring a lot of reference.

As far as I know, there's nothing in RAW that prevents transporting people in the cargo hold. The issues are more likely to be: space, life support and supplies. And to me, that's just a case of potentially supplying potential fodder for the next interesting situation. Probably, you'd only transport people a short distance in these circumstances or you might find yourselves in an emergency situation! "Life support's overloaded and you're living on scraps! You need to pull in for repairs soon and find something to do with these people but the only port inrange belongs to the Black Sun."

Edited by SanguineAngel

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31 minutes ago, SanguineAngel said:

Encumbrance capacity is intentionally vague - allowing the GM and players to use apply some common sense rules to the enc of, say, a cargo container full of x-wing parts without being too prescriptive or requiring a lot of reference.

As far as I know, there's nothing in RAW that prevents transporting people in the cargo hold. The issues are more likely to be: space, life support and supplies. And to me, that's just a case of potentially supplying potential fodder for the next interesting situation. Probably, you'd only transport people a short distance in these circumstances or you might find yourselves in an emergency situation! "Life support's overloaded and you're living on scraps! You need to pull in for repairs soon and find something to do with these people but the only port inrange belongs to the Black Sun."

Yeah, that's the key point. I don't have the EotE core rule book, I have the F&D one, but the Vehicle and Starship rules are identical, and I haven't been able to find anything on the rules for exceeding passneger capacity, though I know there are some. 

 The passenger capacity of the ship covers more than just the number of bunks or cabin space the ship has. It also covers the life support and consumables. You might also want to check out the fan supplement, Operational Costs.  There's also Free-Traders and Freebooters

Edited by Tramp Graphics

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1 hour ago, Mefyrx said:

I guess you've seen the work I've done thus far....

 

Maybe I should divide those categories.... 

Starfighters

Transport/Shuttle

Freighters....

 

Now the question should be, the freighter and transport have a similar purpose...what would be the defining factor...

Why are you expecting logic and accuracy from a system for sorting ships in an RPG? There isnt logic and accuracy in the sorting systems in real life.

:)

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Someone else asked a similar question over on Reddit about moving people as "cargo."

Roughing out the numbers and rounding off to keep it easy it came out that, for food and water, it's rough 10 enc of food and water items to keep someone fed and watered for a little over 3 days. 

You can get into the weeds with things like Operational Costs, which also gets into overloading your air processor and carrying extra passengers in addition to a full load of cargo, but I think given this systems fast and loose concept just rounding off and calling it good enough will be ok I'm most cases.

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36 minutes ago, korjik said:

Why are you expecting logic and accuracy from a system for sorting ships in an RPG? There isnt logic and accuracy in the sorting systems in real life.

:)

well, first because they did in the books, although i do agree that in the books, it is rarely used... it is mostly refered as starship for space stuff and vehicle for ground stuff for the modification....

 

it is nice though to have them sorted into folders for the appropriate need.... as i do there

 

 

note that i might change the sorting accordingly to this dicussion

Edited by Mefyrx

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According to the S-Type Racing Sloop page, this vessel is a 'Racing Vessel' rather than a 'freighter' or 'transport.'  In fact, it is the only vessel of this hull type on the site (though it may be a bit out-of-date).

Basically, it's a starfighter sized vessel that is little more than sublight engines, hyperdrive, and a little space for the crew. 

Visually, I'd think something along the lines of Naboo's starfighters, only widened for the extra crew and with bigger/additional engines.  There's little backup for this image, but those fighter had a real 1930's racer/fighter vibe to them.

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2 hours ago, Ghostofman said:

Someone else asked a similar question over on Reddit about moving people as "cargo."

Roughing out the numbers and rounding off to keep it easy it came out that, for food and water, it's rough 10 enc of food and water items to keep someone fed and watered for a little over 3 days. 

You can get into the weeds with things like Operational Costs, which also gets into overloading your air processor and carrying extra passengers in addition to a full load of cargo, but I think given this systems fast and loose concept just rounding off and calling it good enough will be ok I'm most cases.

Put them in Specimen Containers. For 5 EC you get a container that holds 15 EC (1 or 2 people) in stasis with life support built in.

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47 minutes ago, Sturn said:

Yeah, this isn't easy but nice work there

I like the general idea, although I'm not sure I'll be looking at each ship to see what is their exact size to fit them into a category or divided them into multiple categories like you did...

So far, Landspeeder, Airspeeder, Walkers, Wheeled and Tracked Vehicles, Submersibles (even though some speeder are submersible as well), and Space Stations are fairly easy.

Then if I just put Starfighters and Patrol Boats together, that feels to regroup ship of the same size and purpose (beside the Imperial Customs Frigate and A-Type Stiletto)

Then I think I'll regroup all Barge, Shuttle, Yatch under the Shuttle banner (include the A-Type Stiletto in there as well as the only explorer, the Pathfinder Scout Ship)

Gunship, well there is only two of those which is a category that seem useless but I'll leave as is...

 

The biggest issue comes with the Transports and Freighters...

Freighters is more freight stuff ...there are small one and bigger one...

While Transport is more about personnel and maybe vehicles...

These 2 lines seem to work for me...

It's just that stuff like the "Space Master Medium Transport", the "YZ-775 Medium Transport" and "GR-75 Medium Transport" seem obviously to be Freighters and not Transport as described...

Also where to draw the line when it seems 50/50 like the "Mobquet Medium Transport"...

Maybe I should end up using your 100 meters rules which makes somewhat more sense....

 

Cruisers, Capital Ships and Battleships seem to be very similar....where their purpose/and size might matter more ........although a "Assertor – Class Command Dreadnought" described as a Cruiser seem more to me like a Capital Ship....or Battleship for that matter...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Mefyrx

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1 hour ago, Mefyrx said:

Yeah, this isn't easy but nice work there

I like the general idea, although I'm not sure I'll be looking at each ship to see what is their exact size to fit them into a category or divided them into multiple categories like you did...

So far, Landspeeder, Airspeeder, Walkers, Wheeled and Tracked Vehicles, Submersibles (even though some speeder are submersible as well), and Space Stations are fairly easy.

Then if I just put Starfighters and Patrol Boats together, that feels to regroup ship of the same size and purpose (beside the Imperial Customs Frigate and A-Type Stiletto)

Then I think I'll regroup all Barge, Shuttle, Yatch under the Shuttle banner (include the A-Type Stiletto in there as well as the only explorer, the Pathfinder Scout Ship)

Gunship, well there is only two of those which is a category that seem useless but I'll leave as is...

 

The biggest issue comes with the Transports and Freighters...

Freighters is more freight stuff ...there are small one and bigger one...

While Transport is more about personnel and maybe vehicles...

These 2 lines seem to work for me...

It's just that stuff like the "Space Master Medium Transport", the "YZ-775 Medium Transport" and "GR-75 Medium Transport" seem obviously to be Freighters and not Transport as described...

Also where to draw the line when it seems 50/50 like the "Mobquet Medium Transport"...

Maybe I should end up using your 100 meters rules which makes somewhat more sense....

 

Cruisers, Capital Ships and Battleships seem to be very similar....where their purpose/and size might matter more ........although a "Assertor – Class Command Dreadnought" described as a Cruiser seem more to me like a Capital Ship....or Battleship for that matter...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The problem with the YZ-775 stats is that, FFG decided to make them incapable of carrying passengers, when, canonically, and in previous sources, they could carry 14 passengers comfortably in staterooms. The original stats for the ship from Star Wars Gamer #2 for SW D20, had the YZ-775 capably of carrying 400 tons of cargo and 14 passengers, along with a crew of 8. 

Quote

52 meters

Maximum atmospheric speed

950 km/h

Hyperdrive rating

Class 1.0

Backup Class 12

Shielding

Equipped

Navigation system

Equipped

Armament

Turbolaser cannons (2)

Twin laser cannons(2)

Proton torpedo tubes (2) (or concussion missiles)

12 torpedoes each

Crew

Captain (1)

Pilot (1)

Co-pilot (1)

Engineers (2)

Cargo master (1)

Gunners (2)

Minimum crew

1

Passengers

14

Cargo capacity

400 metric tons

Consumables

6 months

Other systems

2 escape pods

Using these numbers, yes, the YZ-775 is a transport. However, given that Corellian ships are notoriously customizable, it isn't hard to reconfigure it to a dedicated cargo ship. 

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37 minutes ago, Tramp Graphics said:

Oh, and here is the Wookieepedia page on Transports, if you're interested. It's taken from the New Essential Guide to Vehicles and Vessels

Here it says

Transports came in a wide variety of sizes, from small light freighters like the Corellian Engineering Corporation YT-1300 to massive transports that could contain thousands of tons of cargo.[2] Transports such as freighters and passenger liners were not designed for military encounters and were normally unarmed and slow-moving

So basically, a transport would be the main folder containing the freighters, shuttles and every other type of transport....  such saying a combat vehicles would include all the starfighters, gunboats, battleships etc

So transport would be a general term....from my understanding....although I don't want to dump all the transport under the same folder....what would be a good way to divide those....

Shuttle seem obvious ..... but then you have those little carrier ....sur the YT-1300 ....which seem more like a multi purpose ...how to divide from the others....

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Mefyrx said:

 

Here it says

Transports came in a wide variety of sizes, from small light freighters like the Corellian Engineering Corporation YT-1300 to massive transports that could contain thousands of tons of cargo.[2] Transports such as freighters and passenger liners were not designed for military encounters and were normally unarmed and slow-moving

So basically, a transport would be the main folder containing the freighters, shuttles and every other type of transport....  such saying a combat vehicles would include all the starfighters, gunboats, battleships etc

So transport would be a general term....from my understanding....although I don't want to dump all the transport under the same folder....what would be a good way to divide those....

Shuttle seem obvious ..... but then you have those little carrier ....sur the YT-1300 ....which seem more like a multi purpose ...how to divide from the others....

 

 

Yes and no. "transport" also refers to a general purpose transport, rather than a dedicated single purpose vessel. 

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