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Matsu Berserker starting Kata

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The Matsu starting kata don't make sense to me.  The traditional Matsu weapons in the past have been spears, polearms, no-dachi, and katana.  Their starting kata emphasize two weapon fighting and blunt weapons.  The Matsu can't even take a blunt weapon in their starting equipment and as a very traditional family have never been associated with two weapon style fighting.  Not saying a Matsu wouldn't ever use a blunt weapon or two weapon fighting, but having them as core starting techniques seems weird to me.  Are these misprints?

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for Matsu Zerker: I can understand the [Spinning Blade Kata] they get. Its ok to do a dual wield matsu zerker, it is thematic. But, the [rushing avalanche] really doesnt make sense to me... considering they get nodachi as starting equipment. I definitely think this should be errata (and will do so in my game): replace [rushing avalanche style] by [striking as fire] (which is much more suitable for them and is not in their advancement chart).

for  Mirumoto Two Heavens: I am ok with them not getting [spinning blade style]. They should use their dual sword with more grace and more for duel, that is represented in their school ability/mastery and the iaijutsu cut in their advancement chart. To me [spinning blade style] is more "berserker/wild" and Two Heavens is more like Kakita but with two swords.

for Hiruma Scout: They also shouldn't get [rushing avalanche style] doesn't work for them, I'm starting to think at some point in development that [rushing avalanche style] was not only for blunt weapons... but for all two-handed weapons. I'm not against the fact that it stays only for blunt weapon though, but for Matsu Zerker and Hiruma Scout it needed revision. For Hiruma Scout i'm thinking replacing it with [iron forest style].

Edited by Avatar111

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I get the feeling we maybe needed another rank 2 kata or two to help differentiate the schools. Matsu getting a no-dachi in their starting equipment is just highlighting a common choice of Matsu player characters. In the fiction it is usually a spear or a the katana, but I feel the no-dachi is an appropriate choice for them. Rushing Avalanche Style working with any two-handed  weapon would have been a good choice, and would have fit a couple of styles, both Crab and Matsu. More reason to two-handed grip a katana or go for the heavier weapons. I agree Matsu would been better with RAS (if all two-handed weapons) and IFS as their choices, but as said above there is precedence for Matsu using two weapons though it is rare, and the no-dachi and kick is a good strategy. As a counter, I think we needed a Rank 2 kata that worked with wielding a one-handed weapon and an open hand. Maybe it could just flat out give your main weapon the snaring quality to represent keeping using your off hand for locks and grappling. There is even sword and hand techniques in the fiction, as well as a Lion martial art based on it in second edition.

Another idea would be to change up the Akodo and Matsu schools a little. Striking as Fire and Striking as Earth are also good Matsu choices, with Lord Akodo's Roar as their privileged starting rank 2 technique. But that is extremely similar to the Akodo school. In that case, I would make Stirring the Embers and Iron Forest Style the Rank 1 Matsu choices, then for Akodo exchange LAR for Tactical Assessment, with Lord Akodo's Roar in place of Iron Forest Style on the Rank 1 chart. Lord Akodo's Roar is a pretty good approximation of the Matsu roar ability all the way back to the Way of the Lion book. Tactical Assessment is a pretty good commander style technique, and then an Akodo can pick up the Roar during Rank 1.

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Rushing Avalanche IMHO should work with any Cumbersome weapon. Cumbersome is such a painful perk that needs some support similar to Razor Edged - ways for specialists to leverage it to their advantage, while little courtier babies are having troubles dealing with the drawback to be competent.

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57 minutes ago, WHW said:

Rushing Avalanche IMHO should work with any Cumbersome weapon. Cumbersome is such a painful perk that needs some support similar to Razor Edged - ways for specialists to leverage it to their advantage, while little courtier babies are having troubles dealing with the drawback to be competent.

Also a good solution probably. But maybe you could stack too much on some polearms (that already have their kata iron forest style). So im ok it stays for blunt weapon (and maybe axes). Its only the 2h swords that gets no love, but maybe they dont need it considering no major drawbacks and ok deadliness.

hiruma scout is much better served with iron forest style, both thematically and logically.

And matsu with striking as fire. Since i feel iron forest style is too defensive for them. Striking as fire seems solid with their stats and good kata for nodachi or polearm users who wants to chop off limbs.

Thing is, there is NO doubt in my mind that the devs made a mistake giving Rushing Avalanche to matsu zerker and hiruma scout. If they meant it to be blunt weapon only that is.

Edited by Avatar111

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2 hours ago, WHW said:

Rushing Avalanche IMHO should work with any Cumbersome weapon. Cumbersome is such a painful perk that needs some support similar to Razor Edged - ways for specialists to leverage it to their advantage, while little courtier babies are having troubles dealing with the drawback to be competent.

 

2 hours ago, Avatar111 said:

Also a good solution probably. But maybe you could stack too much on some polearms (that already have their kata iron forest style). So im ok it stays for blunt weapon (and maybe axes). Its only the 2h swords that gets no love, but maybe they dont need it considering no major drawbacks and ok deadliness.

hiruma scout is much better served with iron forest style, both thematically and logically.

And matsu with striking as fire. Since i feel iron forest style is too defensive for them. Striking as fire seems solid with their stats and good kata for nodachi or polearm users who wants to chop off limbs.

Thing is, there is NO doubt in my mind that the devs made a mistake giving Rushing Avalanche to matsu zerker and hiruma scout. If they meant it to be blunt weapon only that is.

Rushing Avalanche Style working with cumbersome is also a good idea. Looking at the techniques a little more, Spinning Blade Style doesn't need a counterpart since it works with every attack mode: Two handed weapon and kicking (or biting if there is a second opponent very close in), a one handed weapon and an open hand, two different one handed weapons. Though I could see a space for a technique that works if holding two different weapons, and one that works holding two identical weapons, as a counterpart to RAS working with two handed weapons. I also noticed that most of the weapon specific techniques create a new action, other than RAS which creates an opportunity like SBS. Just some thoughts. Too bad I didn't have these back during the beta!

Giving Matsu Berserker the Striking as Fire is very thematic, but every School starts with a Rank 2 and a Rank 1 technique. That is why one suggestion I had in my previous post was changing up the Akodo and Matsu schools to accommodate them both having Rank 1 Striking as XX kata choices. Lord Akodo's Roar is very thematic for Matsu and fits previous edition techniques.

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oh i didnt see every school start with a rank 1 and a rank 2. so then, yeah, will double check what to replace Rushing Avalanche with for the Matsu. I want to modify the least possible, so changing Akodo Commander is not something i'd like to do.

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1 hour ago, GM81 Protocol Droid said:

Looking at the techniques a little more, Spinning Blade Style doesn't need a counterpart since it works with every attack mode: Two handed weapon and kicking (or biting if there is a second opponent very close in), a one handed weapon and an open hand

What is this lately with FFG's push for Lion unarmed fighting? 

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