Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
CDP 2000

Device Drop Limits per Ship per Round

Recommended Posts

Is there a limit to how many devices a ship can drop per round?

I.e, can a Firespray, during the system phase, drop both a proton bomb and a seismic charge at the same time?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does this rule impact cards that allow you to drop a device, like Deathfire or the unreleased Paige Rico?

Can they only use the device part of their abilities if they did not deploy a device in the system phase? 

(After you perform a primary attack, you may drop 1 bomb or rotate your [Turret]. After you are destroyed, you may drop 1 bomb.) 

(After you are destroyed, before you are removed, you may perform an attack and drop or launch 1 device.) 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, player2072913 said:

Does this rule impact cards that allow you to drop a device, like Deathfire or the unreleased Paige Rico?

Can they only use the device part of their abilities if they did not deploy a device in the system phase? 

(After you perform a primary attack, you may drop 1 bomb or rotate your [Turret]. After you are destroyed, you may drop 1 bomb.) 

(After you are destroyed, before you are removed, you may perform an attack and drop or launch 1 device.) 

 

Yeah that would be kinda crappy to turn off their abilities when destroyed because they already dropped that round. :( On the other hand, since one of the abilities includes dropping after attacking, I don't see allowing three drops in one round...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, ObiWonka said:

Yeah that would be kinda crappy to turn off their abilities when destroyed because they already dropped that round. :( On the other hand, since one of the abilities includes dropping after attacking, I don't see allowing three drops in one round...

Another thought - 

Genius specifically calls out not having deployed a device this round as a condition for its ability. 

 

(After you fully execute a maneuver, if you have not dropped or launched a device this round, you may drop 1 bomb.) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The base rule of only dropping/launching one device per round seems pretty clear.

For Deathfire he can, when destroyed take a shot or, if he hasn't deployed a device this turn, drop a bomb. 

The other pilot ability is new to me but I'd think it works the same way; it opens up another timing window for your device deployment and has an alternate option should you have already used yours this round. I suspect the "after you are destroyed you may drop a bomb" part of her card is designed for if you planned on deploying a device after your attack but are destroyed at a higher initiative. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No where on deathfires card does it state he cannot drop if he has already done so this round. 

As with most pilot abilities it's an exception to the rule.  What if he has already attacked, are we now saying he can't attack when he dies?

His exception is that he goes out all guns blazing. 

Thoughts?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, GeneralZod217 said:

No where on deathfires card does it state he cannot drop if he has already done so this round. 

As with most pilot abilities it's an exception to the rule.  What if he has already attacked, are we now saying he can't attack when he dies?

His exception is that he goes out all guns blazing. 

Thoughts?

My thoughts are no.

His ability does not say he can break the rules. It just says you can do it then. not "you can drop a device even if you already have this round"

In order for a card to break the rules... it has to you know tell you that it can break the rules.

There is nothing in the rules that say you can't attack more then once in a round (limited to 1 bonus attack a round) so if he has only done his normal attack he can still attack just fine when he dies.

Edited by Icelom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, GeneralZod217 said:

 It does clearly say you can break the rules by using the term "you may". 

Something that says "you may preform a focus action" does not let you do that while you are stressed, because you can't perform actions while stress. It would say "you may preform a focus action even while stressed" (afterburners is a quick example of the top of my head)

deathfire is telling you that you can break the rules by dropping the device outside of the normal timming window, it never says you can break the rules about dropping devices more then once in a round. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, GeneralZod217 said:

Ok 

so if he has already attacked this round can he not attack again when destroyed?

Yes. The only limit on attacks per round is one bonus attack per round.

So if he attacked in the normal engagement phase allready he can attack again when he is destroyed. (He can't if he got another bonus attack from somewhere else that round).

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Icelom said:

Yes. The only limit on attacks per round is one bonus attack per round.

So if he attacked in the normal engagement phase allready he can attack again when he is destroyed. (He can't if he got another bonus attack from somewhere else that round).

 

Thanks for the reply. Can you give me references for this so I know where to look?

Thanks. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What about this point from the rules reference?

GOLDEN RULES

If a rule in this guide contradicts the Rulebook, the rule in this guide takes precedence.

If the ability of a card conficts with the rules in this guide, the card ability takes precedence. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I saw someone use this example: if someone gives you a free action, and you're stressed, you don't get to still use the action. The free drop can break certain rules, not all of them. Nothing says he can drop twice in a round; he is simply given an alternate timing window to drop, without increasing his once per round limit.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But surely this still comes down to a case of the card conflicting with the rules. The card should take precedence. 

The text is very clear. It tells you what you can do when you are destroyed.  There are no ifs or buts included and no reference to what you have done previously. 

As with most pilot abilities it is giving you the option to do something special. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Icelom said:

Yes. The only limit on attacks per round is one bonus attack per round.

So if he attacked in the normal engagement phase allready he can attack again when he is destroyed. (He can't if he got another bonus attack from somewhere else that round).

 

I'm also unsure about this. His ability makes no reference to it being a bonus attack as do other pilot abilities. There is so much talk on here about RAW, I don't understand why that's no applied here. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, GeneralZod217 said:

I'm also unsure about this. His ability makes no reference to it being a bonus attack as do other pilot abilities. There is so much talk on here about RAW, I don't understand why that's no applied here. 

There is a rules clarification which states (paraphrased), "if an effect allows a ship to perform an attack other than its normal engagement, that is a bonus attack."  And since Bonus Attacks are limited to one-per-round (per ship), if he's already performed a bonus attack (for example, via Cluster Missiles), he won't get a third shot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, emeraldbeacon said:

There is a rules clarification which states (paraphrased), "if an effect allows a ship to perform an attack other than its normal engagement, that is a bonus attack."  And since Bonus Attacks are limited to one-per-round (per ship), if he's already performed a bonus attack (for example, via Cluster Missiles), he won't get a third shot.

Where can't this be found?

Also deathfire's ability is not described as a bonus attack. 

Cards such as VTG make a clear statement as to what is a bonus attack. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, GeneralZod217 said:

Where can't this be found?

Also deathfire's ability is not described as a bonus attack. 

Cards such as VTG make a clear statement as to what is a bonus attack. 

 

Page 23 of the rules reference.

Q: Is Han Solo's additional attack a bonus attack.

A: Yes. Anything that permits an attack outside of the standard attack allowed to a ship when it engages is a bonus attack.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok. 

Thanks for bearing with me, I'm getting there. 

Final question  

If deathfire does drop a bomb when destroyed when would it detonate? At the end of the next activation phase?

Edited by GeneralZod217

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/10/2018 at 6:42 AM, MockingBird ME said:

For Deathfire he can, when destroyed take a shot or, if he hasn't deployed a device this turn, drop a bomb.

Deathfire is an "and" not an "or" and so may actually preform an attack and drop a bomb both when destroyed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, GeneralZod217 said:

Ok. 

Thanks for bearing with me, I'm getting there. 

Final question  

If deathfire does drop a bomb when destroyed when would it detonate? At the end of the next activation phase?

Yes, it would detonate the next time it was triggered, so end of next activation phase, for a bomb, or when it is overlapped for a mine.

Worth noting therefore that if he's on 1HP, it might well be worth running him over a rock to see if you can get him killed during activation, to get the free bomb off where people will have less chance to dodge.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...