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Vykk Draygo

Organized Play going to a restricted list on Ships and upgrades?

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3 minutes ago, ForceM said:

Except i can’t believe that, since some people even here seem not to keen on the idea. And pushing sales for a very small group while losing other customers is hardly reasonable even from a business standpoint.

Maybe they dropped this on us to see the reaction.

i hope it is enough to make them reconsider.

I’m pretty sure that they are just doing this for “premiere” events. Because I’d they do this even for kit tournaments, they’re going to lose way too much support for OP. It’ll effectively be dead.

They might get away with this because most Casuals to semi-Casuals are only playing store kit events and maybe a store champs (whatever they call those now). Some of us liked going to regionals or a system open, but may need to rethink that now.

Time will tell

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1 hour ago, Koing907 said:

****, I'm biting my nails over waiting to buy the Rebel Conversion kit. I couldn't afford everything out of the gate, and have had to prioritize purchases. 

im in the same boat but with scum. waitin to buy conversion kit. this does feel like 3 strikes from my point of view.

1) 2.0 pushes much of my old 1.0 collection into the trash (i can reuse ships but need the conversion kits which are a bit hit and miss depending on what you want to fly. In some cases i need multiple conversion kits. I dont mind buying the new starter set and one conversion kit so i can keep my squads current for tournament play but there are significant gaps in the kits for upgrades i need eg. Moldy Crow in Rebel kit but not Scum) :(

2) The app is clunky and just doesnt appeal to meet my list building needs (Im using YASB 2.0) :(

3) News of a restricted format for tournament play. No matter how you slice it this format will steer tournament players towards certain ships/upgrades. Is this good for the game? Maybe/Maybe not. I'll wait to see the official news announcement but this makes me very nervous. If it forces me to buy more sh#! I don't need I'm out. ?

Edited by Da_Brown_Bomber

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32 minutes ago, ScummyRebel said:

I’m pretty sure that they are just doing this for “premiere” events. Because I’d they do this even for kit tournaments, they’re going to lose way too much support for OP. It’ll effectively be dead.

They might get away with this because most Casuals to semi-Casuals are only playing store kit events and maybe a store champs (whatever they call those now). Some of us liked going to regionals or a system open, but may need to rethink that now.

Time will tell

I think X-Wing is pretty big as a Tabletop game.

But i don’t think it has the mass of players needed to support two separate competitive formats.

I think FFG knows that, and i hope they will only take this new limited or 2.0 format as a crutch for some rare events in the beginning, for example in order to release new factions with few ships. Or maybe to celebrate and recreate a special event, like for examplethe Battle of Yavin...

But the main format in tournaments hopefully will be extended. I really hope it, because splitting up the community like this seems like a bad idea to me.

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Even GW didn't stoop to this (at least not when I was still playing 40K, pre-6th ed).  They didn't tell you, "You can only bring whatever new hawt-ness we're pimping this month, so leave that other stuff you invested in on the shelf".

Just when I think FFG has stopped imitating GW, they turn around and do them one better.

If this becomes the tournament norm, I will stop playing tournaments of any kind.

Edited by Firebird TMK

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14 minutes ago, ForceM said:

But the main format in tournaments hopefully will be extended. I really hope it, because splitting up the community like this seems like a bad idea to me.

Why can't you play both? Or will that many people really refuse to play more than one format?

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1. We don't know how "limited" it's going to be at all yet. My guess is limited so it's all balanced with the First Order and Resistance factions which to me is the "bar" to balance to. Why is that a bad thing (especially with how big Scum could get)?

2. There will still be extended events. Unknown quantity for each type of event at this point. Why not just play where you want or make your own local events you want?

3. We'll be all fine here, now...thank you...

Edited by RStan

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2 minutes ago, Firebird TMK said:

Even GW didn't stoop to this (at least not when I was still playing 40K, pre-6th ed).  They didn't tell you, "You can only bring whatever new hawt-ness we're pimping this month, so leave that other stuff you invested in on the shelf".

Did you ever hear the tragedy of Darth Squats the wise? It's not a story the Jedi would tell you.

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15 minutes ago, Micanthropyre said:

Why can't you play both? Or will that many people really refuse to play more than one format?

I will not play any limited and no more tournaments if that becomes the standard format. Except maybe a release event or some special one-time themed tournament.

The reason is that i want all the ships from 1.0 to stay in the game. I have not bought conversion kits just to let them tell me that they are not legal in the new standard format.

Just speaking for myself here of course. But i imagine i am not the only person thinking that way.

Another reason would be that i enjoy a very diverse meta with infinite possibilities, especially now that 2.0 has brought a much better balance.

2 separate standard formats would also lead to a splintering of all X-Wing communities from casual to hardcore tournament players.

Small shop tournaments might not get the necessary participation this way anymore and big tourneys would need two separate, maybe parallel events.

For all these fears and reasonings, i dislike the idea of some 2.0 only format becoming more than a crutch for selected events in the beginning of 2.0s lifespan.

Edited by ForceM

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4 minutes ago, ForceM said:

I will not play any limited and no more tournaments if that becomes the standard format. Except maybe a release event or some special one-time themed tournament.

The reason is that i want all the ships from 1.0 to stay in the game. I have not bought conversion kits just to let them tell me that they are not legal in the new standard format.

Just speaking for myself here of course. But i imagine i am not the only person thinking that way.

Another reason would be that i enjoy a very diverse meta with infinite possibilities, especially now that 2.0 has brought a much better balance.

2 separate standard formats would also lead to a splintering of all X-Wing communities from casual to hardcore tournament players.

Small shop tournaments might not get the necessary participation this way anymore and big tourneys would need two separate, maybe parallel events.

For all these fears and reasonings, i dislike the idea of some 2.0 only format becoming more than a crutch for selected events in the beginning of 2.0s lifespan.

I mean, what if there isn't a "standard" tournament format? Some big tournaments will be Extended, others will be 2.0+?

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1 minute ago, CaptainIxidor said:

I hope they find a name for it other than "restricted" or "limited"as those words have baggage for a lot of former/current TCG/LCG players.

They might just call it 2nd Edition for all we know (which I realize is opposed to my previous comment).

I agree with this. Alex seems like a cool guy and I like him, but I did get really mad at him for continually referring to the "Second Edition" format as the "limited" format in his speech at Nova.

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3 hours ago, Tvboy said:

That seems like a 1.0 mentality. The power gap was supposed to have been significantly narrowed with 2.0. There are bad lists, mostly those with too many points in the wrong upgrades, but there shouldn't be good ships and bad ships anymore. 

That remains to be seen. We already have some pilots/upgrades/lists pulling ahead of the pack. 

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I wonder if they are thinking of having a set timeline linked to a story arc.

this might involve  a campaign 'season' where ships and factions are staggered through the year.

For example. Ships from waves 1-4  (chapter 1) then waves 5-8 (chapter 2) then waves 9-12 (chapter 3) then waves 13-15 (chapter 4)

Each event could involve the rerelease of some revamped models and the event would be tied to a specific pool of upgrades (a few of which might be totally new to the game)

Edited by Da_Brown_Bomber

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56 minutes ago, RStan said:

1. We don't know how "limited" it's going to be at all yet. My guess is limited so it's all balanced with the First Order and Resistance factions which to me is the "bar" to balance to. Why is that a bad thing (especially with how big Scum could get)?

2. There will still be extended events. Unknown quantity for each type of event at this point. Why not just play where you want or make your own local events you want?

3. We'll be all fine here, now...thank you...

I understand the cautionary optimism but why the snark at the end? Their seems to be legitimate concerns from the community that I’ve read thus far in this thread, and these types of snarky responses are not helpful regardless if you’re “X-Wing” famous or not. This game is not just playing the “meta” competitive game lists, for some it’s about lists with our favorite ships, and characters (and the possibility of not be able to use those ships/pilots) is a valid concern.

Without the greater community, the less the game grows.

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4 hours ago, Tvboy said:

Good point, but none of the core movie ships are bad right now and people are agreeing that FFG is highly unlikely to ban the iconic ships that represent the franchise, so how does this format help those fringe ships which are themselves more likely to be banned then the iconic ships that are doing so well right now? Why not just give those ships the points reductions they need using the stupid app this whole entire relaunch was supposed to be based around?

FFGs goal is to sell stuff. If movie ships are always in rotation AND good, they're kinda shooting themselves in the foot. 

 

As such, I expect at least part of the movie ships to either be made less good, or taken out of rotation. 

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1 hour ago, Kieransi said:

I agree with this. Alex seems like a cool guy and I like him, but I did get really mad at him for continually referring to the "Second Edition" format as the "limited" format in his speech at Nova.

But isn’t it more honest calling it what it is?

It’s a format that limits options to create a different way to play. 

Edited by SabineKey

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Just now, Kieransi said:

From a new player's perspective, it's not "limited" it's "stuff I can actually officially buy without spending a ton of money on eBay"

No, that’s still limited, even from a new player’s perspective. They can officially buy a kit and what ships they want early from a store, and use them as they wish. 

And as the game is for new and old players alike, saying that 2nd Ed Format is limited makes a lot of sense as it communicates what it is suppose to do to both types of player. 

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22 minutes ago, LordBlades said:

 

As such, I expect at least part of the movie ships to either be made less good, or taken out of rotation. 

So taking the Rey, Boba, Han, Vader and Luke lists/ships or cards will pretty much kill the greater community, maybe not the "competitive" meta seeking players but the players who help support the OP for those "competitive" types. 

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18 minutes ago, SabineKey said:

No, that’s still limited, even from a new player’s perspective. They can officially buy a kit and what ships they want early from a store, and use them as they wish. 

And as the game is for new and old players alike, saying that 2nd Ed Format is limited makes a lot of sense as it communicates what it is suppose to do to both types of player. 

Well, I had a lot of thoughts on this topic which I shared a while back so you can read them if you'd like:

I'm just sort of burned out on this whole debate though, so I think I'm done here for today. 

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1 minute ago, Kieransi said:

Well, I had a lot of thoughts on this topic which I shared a while back so you can read them if you'd like:

I'm just sort of burned out on this whole debate though, so I think I'm done here for today. 

I did read that back in the day. If you care to remember, I even spoke to you in that thread.

I do not mean to belittle 2nd ed format. To me, a limited format isn’t a bad term, it’s a descriptor. It is an option that can be fun to play and potentially an easier way to get into the game. I even understand your frustration you expressed in that thread to an extent. But considering everyone, new or old, has access to the conversion kits and 1.0 material if they wish it, I honestly do not see how 2nd Ed format is not a limited format, even if it was to become the primary format.

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11 minutes ago, Kieransi said:

From a new player's perspective, it's not "limited" it's "stuff I can actually officially buy without spending a ton of money on eBay"

Are you not allowed to officially buy 1.0 ships and conversion kits from your LGS because you’re a new player?

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