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Kendraam

MC-80 Liberty build question

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Finally got my hands on a Liberty expansion - what are peoples preferred upgrades on them?

Gunnery Teams or Caitkin & Sholan - or perhaps Gunnery Teams and Leading Shots?

XI7 or Mon Karren

Is ET a must have?

Spinals and/or H9s?

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Battle Cruiser should always have Gunnery Teams. For the Star Cruiser it's not so important. I would always run Engine Techs and probably always Madine. Leading Shots also most of the time but the rest of the upgrades (title and turbolasers) can be varied according to points availability and what you intend to use it for.

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Thanks @Vae

More clarification: I have 131 points to spend on it, so 28pts of upgrades.  It needs to be a long range sniper but maneuverable enough to arc dodge ISDs.

I currently have:

StratAdv (4)

GT (7)

ET (8)

Spinals (9)

but my red rolls are dire - thinking of dropping GT for Caitkin with maybe adding in LS too (that won't help at long range though) but I'll have to drop something else somewhere to find the extra 3 points.

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It might be best to post the fleet which this is in as that could have an impact on suggestions e.g. we might suggest shaving points elsewhere to boost this ship.

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The fleet and admiral do give a context though. Is this in a Madine MSU fleet aiming to get last/first in which case red dice are not as necessary as this being able to flank, shoot once at red then move in, double arc at short range and then move away? In that scenario you could drop to the Star Cruiser and take Caitken because you don't need gunnery teams. Or is it in a more multi role fleet where this is a hunter-killer of small ships and being able to one shot transports in order to get activation advantage means that Gunnery Team and H9/Spinal is more important.

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Yup, I know - being vague as its Nationals tomorrow...not that anyone will care what I'm running, nor is it likely make a difference but still, Bothan spies abound!

It's a dual role - intended to be either a big ship finisher at long range or small ship hunter if I'm playing against MSUs.  Against the first GT isn't massively important but it would be for the latter.  Either way I'd like some re-roll tech but is it worth dropping GT for C&S; can I reply on average rolls with a CF token? Experience suggests not!

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Ok let's assume that Red dice are your main intention. I assume Strategic Advisor is a must and Engine Techs is as well. That gives 16 points to keep your bid.

The only good fixing you are going to get for red range is Caitken (or Veteran Gunners but Caitken is better) but at a cost of not having Gunnery Teams. If you are not taking Gunnery Teams then you could consider Slaved Turrets and not Spinal (saving 3 points) as I assume you won't be taking a side shot or flak at the same time. However that is quite a draw back and if you can't make good use of those 3 points then there is no point. Equally with Caitken you don't need leading shots.

 

So you really have 2 choices Caitken vs Gunnery Teams and then Spinal/Slaved for an extra dice vs Mon Karren/XI7/(H9) (if flotilla hunting but that is not so important now for tabling). These are meta decisions based on if you think you will get multiple shots from Gunnery Team or not. I'd probably fall down on the side of Gunnery Teams as it gives you 2 shots even if red dice are bad.

My preference would probably be Gunnery Teams, Leading Shots and then XI7 or Mon Karren depending on how much I feel I could reduce my bid by (DTT is an option but exhausts so only on 1 shot).

 

(p.s. see you tomorrow :) )  

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I know you mentioned long ranged, but you also said relatively cheap. The Star Cruiser with C&S, Strategic Advisor, HIEs, and ETs is fantastic and only 123 points. You can add Quads for more blues. It also makes your side arcs slightly more potent.

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I enjoy flying a Battle Cruiser with Madine. Tack on:

  • Raymus
  • Gunnery Team
  • Engine Tech
  • Leading Shots
  • X17 Turbolasers
  • H9 Turbolasers

... and you've got a dancing whale of a ship that makes it's shots count every single time.

With Raymus, Madine, Engine Techs, and a Nav command you get SIX CLICKS OF YAW. (Default +2, Nav command +1, Madine +1, Nav token +1, Engine Tech +1)

With X17 Turbolasers, and H9 Turbolasers you take away your opponents Redirect and only need to use H9 to fish for an accuracy to block their brace. 

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I have run a liberty with every which loadout you can.  And I’m orobably the only person with a top four regional finish with EVERY title.

 

that being said, I really can’t help much without knowing the rest of the list, especially commander.  You can do some star cruiser load outs in the pints you allow, but some of the best battlecruiser ones will be off the table.

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44 minutes ago, Phil B said:

Knowing @kendraam it will be Raddus or Rieekan.

Both of which will fly very differently from each other, as well as Madine.

 

In my experience, most of the top players are ok with their lists being known.  It is a part of being rigorous with yourself and testing accordingly.  Often, it really doesn't come down to whether someone knew the list and built the perfect counter (which might not counter much if anything else), but how one flew the list at the board.

for Rieekan, I'd just keep the ship cheap.  For Raddus, it depends upon whether it is being dropped or triggering a drop,  but you likely want it to be able to hit hard while it can.  You might not need to be dodgy for either one of them, but you definitely want it dodgy with Madine, and maybe Madine is the only way to make it really super-dodgy.  On the other hand, you can get quit a bit of turning by simply using the Nav Command + ET at speed-1, and that can keep it pointed on target for any commander outside of Madine.

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It's the following:

MC-80 Battle Cruiser

Rieekan

Strat Adv

GT

ET

Spinal

MC-75

OE

ACM

ExRax

Profundity

Hammerhead Torpedo

ExRax

GR-75

Comms Net

GR-75

Quantum Storm

Shara

Tycho

393 pts 

If I place top 50% I'll be pleased!

 

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Yeah, that's interesting.  I'd probably go for a light box the enemy in with the two capital ships and kill them off, hopefully trading one of them out for a tabling.  So for example, Star Cruiser, Mon Karren, SA, GT, ET, SW-7 is an extremely lean build that aims to push as much damage as you possibly can through at blue range.  I think the real danger is that whatever ship Riekan is on is going to be a major target for the enemy, because if they can kill only one ship, they'll get more points off of that one.  Also, if you do face a squadron list, having Slicers on the Quantum Storm would be extremely handy.

 

Good luck!  Much of this comes down to flying the list well, and I'm not sure how much more can be productively said.

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On 8/23/2018 at 12:32 PM, Vae said:

(p.s. see you tomorrow :) )  

We didn't meet but well done on your win - I'd have liked to have seen how my list would have fared against your ISDs.  Probably not great as I lost 9-2 against the only double ISD list I played!

I went Gunnery Teams in the end - really missed rerolls as my dice were dreadful most of the day.  Was a fun list to play though.

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I like running the star cruiser variant with SW-7's, Spinal, and Mon Karren. You now have the firepower of an ISD II, your opponent can only use one defense token and you can maximize those accuracies you don't need. Also the beauty of this is it means every blue die you roll is a hit if you need it to be.  

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I plan on running this when I get the chance. Big ol bully Liberty with some admonition pouncings.

Faction: Rebel
Commander: General Madine

Assault: Advanced Gunnery
Defense: Contested Outpost
Navigation: Dangerous Territory

MC30c Torpedo Frigate (63)
• Skilled First Officer (1)
• Ordnance Experts (4)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
• XI7 Turbolasers (6)
• Admonition (8)
= 87 Points

MC80 Battle Cruiser (103)
• Strategic Adviser (4)
• Caitken and Shollan (6)
• Engine Techs (8)
• SW-7 Ion Batteries (5)
• XI7 Turbolasers (6)
• Spinal Armament (9)
• Mon Karren (8)
= 149 Points

CR90 Corvette A (44)
• General Madine (30)
• Turbolaser Reroute Circuits (7)
• Jaina's Light (2)
= 83 Points

GR-75 Medium Transports (18)
• Comms Net (2)
= 20 Points

GR-75 Medium Transports (18)
• Slicer Tools (7)
• Quantum Storm (1)
= 26 Points

Squadrons:
• Tycho Celchu (16)
• Shara Bey (17)
= 33 Points

Total Points: 398

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