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digitalbusker

[2.0] Simultaneous Fire is dead. Long live Simultaneous Fire!

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So this is going to come up: in first edition, there were two different timings for removing destroyed ships. Most of the time the ships were removed during the attack that destroyed them, but sometimes a ship would be kept around by Simultaneous Fire.

Now any ship that's destroyed during the Engagement phase for any reason hangs around until the end of the current initiative step. Most of the time this won't matter, but for ships with passive defensive abilities like Serissu or Biggs, it'll mean you can't clear them out of the way with the first of multiple same-initiative attacks.

This is about rules, but it's not a question, so let me postscript this with: when measuring with a ruler, I learned to start from the 1 mark rather than the end of the ruler, because it's less precise (the marks might be misaligned, the end of the ruler might have worn down, etc). I had a bunch of off-by-one errors early on, but now I barely think about it. Anybody else do that?

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This is interesting, so if 8 academy pilots all shoot at I1, and the first three deal 6 damage to Biggs, Biggs (or any ship with Selflessness, but then it's only crits) could keep taking damage despite already having a number of damage cards equal to or greater than his hull?  Actually reminds me a lot of Armada and Biggs/Reeikan interaction.

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16 minutes ago, MasterShake2 said:

This is interesting, so if 8 academy pilots all shoot at I1, and the first three deal 6 damage to Biggs, Biggs (or any ship with Selflessness, but then it's only crits) could keep taking damage despite already having a number of damage cards equal to or greater than his hull?  Actually reminds me a lot of Armada and Biggs/Reeikan interaction.

Correct. Zombie Biggs lives.

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Zombie Howlrunner matters, too.  Suppose a squad of Phoenix Squadron A-Wings is attacking an Academy Pilot TIE Swarm with Howlrunner, and they're acting first in player order.  The A-Wings can shoot down Howlrunner, then any Academy TIEs at that same initiative can still shoot with Howlrunner's reroll.

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By the wording of Destroying ships in the 2nd star

If a ship is destroyed during the Engagement phase, it is removed after all the ships that have the same initiative as the currently ENGAGED ship have engaged. 

I highlighted the first engaged because that is the defender not that attacker, so if a Init 1 shoots Howlrunner at Init 5 and kills him he is removed after the Init 5 shooting round, which is already done, not at the end of init 1.

If the defender is same Init they can shoot

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2 hours ago, WhisperEcho said:

By the wording of Destroying ships in the 2nd star

If a ship is destroyed during the Engagement phase, it is removed after all the ships that have the same initiative as the currently ENGAGED ship have engaged. 

I highlighted the first engaged because that is the defender not that attacker, so if a Init 1 shoots Howlrunner at Init 5 and kills him he is removed after the Init 5 shooting round, which is already done, not at the end of init 1.

If the defender is same Init they can shoot

No. The currently engaged ship is the one doing the shooting. If a ps1 kills howl she stays until all the ps1s on both sides have shot then she dies.

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29 minutes ago, WhisperEcho said:

engaged is the defender engaging is attacker. Now if it said activated ship I would agree

Provide 3vid3nce to support your view, bearing in mind that engaging doesn't mean attacking it means activating in the engagement phase. If your definition is correct the engaged ship doesn't exist, or there could be multiple if gunners are used, not to mention it meaning that lower ps ships don't destroy higher ps ones until the next round.

In short you're wrong.

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1 hour ago, WhisperEcho said:

engaged is the defender engaging is attacker. Now if it said activated ship I would agree

This is incorrect. Ships do not activate during the engagement phase; they activate during the activation phase and engage during the engagement phase. The currently engaged ship is, effectively, the one whose turn it is to shoot.

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7 hours ago, WhisperEcho said:

engaged is the defender engaging is attacker. Now if it said activated ship I would agree

Page 17, simultaneous fire:

Quote

To represent that ships with the same initiative are essentially attacking at the same time, if a ship is destroyed during the Engagement Phase, it is removed after all ships that have the same initiative as the currently engaged ship have engaged.

That indicates that the "currently engaged" term means the ship who is currently resolving his engagement phase.

Also, page 5, aftermath:

Quote

If a ship is destroyed during the Engagement Phase, the ship is not removed until all ships of the attacker’s initiative have engaged.

 

Edited by Ubul

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Rule book under engagement phase. Clear as day

PHASE 4: ENGAGEMENT PHASE
During this phase, each ship engages one at a 
time. Ships engage in initiative order, starting with 
the highest initiative. When a ship engages, it 
may perform one attack, therefore, ships with high 
initiative get to attack first. After all ships have had 
the opportunity to engage during the Engagement 
Phase, the players proceed to the End Phase.

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On ‎8‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 3:55 PM, thespaceinvader said:

No. The currently engaged ship is the one doing the shooting. If a ps1 kills howl she stays until all the ps1s on both sides have shot then she dies.

Likely to be a pain in the neck if attacking Biggs, Del Meeko or Serissu with a swarm. At least every faction has someone similar now.

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