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7 minutes ago, Green Knight said:

Huge and Large. Not the same.

Irrelevant when the rules aren't known yet, especially since Huge hasn't even been specifically noted to be a new 'size'and I capitalized 'if'.

Edited by Oculon

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3 minutes ago, Oculon said:

Irrelevant when the rules aren't known yet, especially since Huge hasn't even been specifically noted to be a new 'size'and I capitalized 'if'.

Huge is a size different from Large size.

A card that is "Large only" is then not legal.

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3 hours ago, Green Knight said:

Huge is a size different from Large size. 

"Huge" hasn't been specified as being a "size class" only a new "class." We don't know if the SSD is "large" size class. Based on a strict reading of the current rules, it would be a large ship.

Whatever happens they'll have to bring in new rules. Until we see those rules we don't know how Huge and Large will interact.

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11 minutes ago, Grumbleduke said:

"Huge" hasn't been specified as being a "size class" only a new "class." We don't know if the SSD is "large" size class. Based on a strict reading of the current rules, it would be a large ship.

Whatever happens they'll have to bring in new rules. Until we see those rules we don't know how Huge and Large will interact.

While we don't know exactly how they'll specify Huge, we do know how they specify Large as the specific base dimensions are called out in the Rules Reference on page 11 under Size Class. as being 77.5mm x 129mm .  The SSDs base is much larger than that so by rules definition it does not count as a large base.  Maybe errata will come out that will allow large base only cards to be used on large and above bases, but the large base by definition is not a huge base ( I mean, it is LARGE but not large...you know what I mean).

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8 minutes ago, Grinoch said:

The SSDs base is much larger than that so by rules definition it does not count as a large base.

But that's not quite what the rules say. The FAQ'd rules state:

Quote

Each ship has a size class: small, medium or large. Small ships use the 43 mm x 71 mm base, medium ships use the 63mm x 102mm base, and large ships use the 77.5mm x 129mm base.

 

  1. Each ship has a size class - so the SSD must have a size class (if it is a ship),
  2. small, medium or large - so the SSD must be a small, medium or large ship,
  3. small ships use the 43 mm x 71 mm base - the SSD doesn't use this base, so can't be a small ship,
  4. medium ships use the 63mm x 102, base - the SSD doesn't, so can't be a medium ship,
  5. large ships use the 77.5mm x 129mm base - the SSD does use this base, so could be a large ship.

So in the absence of any new rules if the SSD is a ship, it must be a large ship.

Without seeing what the new rules say there's little point stating what must be the case wrt things like "large ship only" upgrades.

They don't need errata - all they need is to include new rules defining "huge" - similar to how other expansion packs have introduced new rules (such as flotillas).

Edited by Grumbleduke

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2 minutes ago, Green Knight said:

But still, Huge is not Large. 

Huge may be not Large. We don't know until we see the rules. In the same way that "flotillas" can be "small."

It almost certainly will be a new size class. But until we see the rules all we can do is guess as to how it will work and what restrictions it will come with.

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58 minutes ago, Megatronrex said:

If Huge and Large were going to be used interchangeably they would have just called them Large.

Look at Small vs Flotilla, particularly wrt upgrades, and reconsider that argument...

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28 minutes ago, Green Knight said:

"Flotilla" is not a size.

Huge is.

 

20 minutes ago, Megatronrex said:

Flotillas are a type of ship. Huge is an entirely new class. You should consider including your point in your statement instead of being vague.

It has already been pointed out that Huge has not been stated to be a new 'size class'. Your continued insistence that it is in the absence of evidence is quite tiresome.

My point is that your statement about them being used 'interchangeably' is clearly overstated, as no one is saying they are identical in every way - only possibly in terms of upgrades; and that there is a precedent for this with 'small' and 'flotilla'.

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2 hours ago, Grumbleduke said:

But that's not quite what the rules say. The FAQ'd rules state:

 

  1. Each ship has a size class - so the SSD must have a size class (if it is a ship),
  2. small, medium or large - so the SSD must be a small, medium or large ship,
  3. small ships use the 43 mm x 71 mm base - the SSD doesn't use this base, so can't be a small ship,
  4. medium ships use the 63mm x 102, base - the SSD doesn't, so can't be a medium ship,
  5. large ships use the 77.5mm x 129mm base - the SSD does use this base, so could be a large ship.

So in the absence of any new rules if the SSD is a ship, it must be a large ship.

Without seeing what the new rules say there's little point stating what must be the case wrt things like "large ship only" upgrades.

They don't need errata - all they need is to include new rules defining "huge" - similar to how other expansion packs have introduced new rules (such as flotillas).

For the shake of stupidness 

From RRG p 10

A ship consists of a ship base, a ship model, a ship token, and a ship card. All components must match the ship’s type, and the name on the ship card must match the name on the ship token

 

1. The SSD is not a ship as consist in two large bases (What you say) and ships don't consist in two bases. 

2. The SSD is a ship as it has only 1 base. That base is formed by two large ones. But it is just one base and it is obvioulsy not a large one.

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11 minutes ago, Oculon said:

 

It has already been pointed out that Huge has not been stated to be a new 'size class'. Your continued insistence that it is in the absence of evidence is quite tiresome.

My point is that your statement about them being used 'interchangeably' is clearly overstated, as no one is saying they are identical in every way - only possibly in terms of upgrades; and that there is a precedent for this with 'small' and 'flotilla'.

The article says class.

Flotillas are type.

I didn't find any other class for ship. Only size class.

Edited by ovinomanc3r

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7 minutes ago, Oculon said:

 

It has already been pointed out that Huge has not been stated to be a new 'size class'. Your continued insistence that it is in the absence of evidence is quite tiresome.

My point is that your statement about them being used 'interchangeably' is clearly overstated, as no one is saying they are identical in every way - only possibly in terms of upgrades; and that there is a precedent for this with 'small' and 'flotilla'.

Huge is quite obviously a new size class. If you can't see that then no one can help you. As far as the rest of your statement goes.

9adb24017b4b7946059a8da54907b40f--light-

 

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28 minutes ago, ovinomanc3r said:

From RRG p 10

A ship consists of a ship base, a ship model, a ship token, and a ship card. All components must match the ship’s type, and the name on the ship card must match the name on the ship token  

Good spot! Which would mean the SSD isn't a ship without new rules. Unless we take the two bases to also count as a single base - but that wouldn't mean it can't be a Large ship, as the only requirement for it to be a large ship is that it uses the large base.

20 minutes ago, Megatronrex said:

Huge is quite obviously a new size class.

Of course it is. But we don't have any rules to define it yet. Until we do, we can only speculate about what those rules are. And that includes speculating, rather than stating definitively, how size class-restricted upgrades work with huge ships.

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2 minutes ago, Grumbleduke said:

Of course it is. But we don't have any rules to define it yet. Until we do, we can only speculate about what those rules are. And that includes speculating, rather than stating definitively, how size class-restricted upgrades work with huge ships.

You're much better at articulating your point. Thank you. Yes it's all just speculation at this point. I simply feel that assuming that "large only" upgrades will for some reason become "large and huge only" upgrades makes a much grander assumption than saying Huge is not Large does. I really don't care much either way but I've seen this type of argument with each new release. In the end the side that's right is almost always the side that went with minimum rules changes and erratas.

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23 minutes ago, Grumbleduke said:

Good spot! Which would mean the SSD isn't a ship without new rules. Unless we take the two bases to also count as a single base - but that wouldn't mean it can't be a Large ship, as the only requirement for it to be a large ship is that it uses the large base.

But a large base has a size. And if SSD's base is 1 base, its size is obvioulsy not 77.5mm x 129mm base 

I mean it is not that hard:

how many bases has the SSD? 1

what size it is? Not 77.5mm x 129mm 

 

also there are not large bases. There are large ships cause their bases have a specific size.

 

Edited by ovinomanc3r

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Just now, ovinomanc3r said:

But a large base has a size. And if SSD's base is 1 base, its size is obvioulsy not 77.5mm x 129mm base  

But the actual objects it uses are also bases in their own right; they're 77.5mm x 129mm bases (by the looks of it); so like "attack" we have a word with two meanings. Oh noes, the game is broken!

......

Anyway. Speculating the only upgrades that seem to be affected by this with the SSD are:

  1. Admiral Konstantine - really should work with huge ships,
  2. Admiral Motti - anyone's guess as to how they deal with this, probably needs a change
  3. Governor Pryce - might be covered by the "pass" system so no change needed, but could be useful on a Huge ship,
  4. Hardened Bulkheads - probably should work on the SSD, could do with a change
  5. Strategic Adviser - covered by the "pass" system, probably not needed,

Then we've got the other ones that aren't relevant yet but could be in the future:

  1. Bail Organa - not sure if it would be a good idea to put this on a huge ship,
  2. Minister Tua - I can see this working either way; putting her on a huge ship with a defensive retrofit kind of makes sense - giving you double defensive, but maybe that's too much,
  3. Ordnance Pods - probably should be able to go on a huge ship, although with their massive arcs that might be a bit much.

So whatever happens, this is probably going to need a few changes.

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3 hours ago, Grumbleduke said:

Huge may be not Large. We don't know until we see the rules. In the same way that "flotillas" can be "small."

It almost certainly will be a new size class. But until we see the rules all we can do is guess as to how it will work and what restrictions it will come with.

Flotillas can be Small because they are not a ship class, they are a ship type per both the Flotillas card rule and their own announcement article.  A flotilla can potentially be on any base size, which will define its size for game purposes.

The announcement article explicitly states that this the first of a new ship class, Huge Ships.  A ship class has its own base size for all models in that class, so until stated otherwise Huge is a new size of ships that is wholly separate from any other rules (perhaps, paradoxically, we could eventually even have a Huge Flotilla).

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35 minutes ago, thecactusman17 said:


The announcement article explicitly states that this the first of a new ship class, Huge Ships.  A ship class has its own base size for all models in that class, so until stated otherwise Huge is a new size of ships that is wholly separate from any other rules (perhaps, paradoxically, we could eventually even have a Huge Flotilla).

I dont get why people cant understand that there is now going to be 4 ship classes, small, medium, large, Huge. as thecactusman said the article explicitly states this, from the article:

"This expansion pack arrives to swell the forces of the Galactic Empire with the first ship of an entirely new class—huge ships."

 

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On 8/3/2018 at 5:39 PM, ovinomanc3r said:

Make turns from the second big base. It is also notched so I assume it will be possible to navigate using it.

I suggest it is notched because it is a standard base. No need to make a special base when they can use what they have and then decide the rules. The rear notch could be used for navigation but the presence of the notch on its own doesn't guarantee it. 

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26 minutes ago, clontroper5 said:

I dont get why people cant understand that there is now going to be 4 ship classes, small, medium, large, Huge. as thecactusman said the article explicitly states this, from the article:

"This expansion pack arrives to swell the forces of the Galactic Empire with the first ship of an entirely new class—huge ships."

 

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