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Shadow345

Does Armada's Executor prove Legion will get an AT-AT?

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On 8/3/2018 at 2:51 PM, Bohemian73 said:

What anti-personal defense did the AT-AT have? I can see a dead spot where the AT-AT cannot fire it's main weapons close range (range 2 to infinity?). I think firing either pair of lasers would be a different attack, and that it would hard to fire at different targets, even in a 90 degree front arc. What about points? Movement is another issue. 

I just don't see them adding an AT-AT for a 'standard' game, but it might be added for special scenario(s). 

AT-TE is now possible as well. I could see both for special scenarios.

Edited by FlyingAnchors

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5 hours ago, Viking171986 said:

ATAT seems a tad small on the scale you posted.

I take no credit for making the scale, but it is based on the official values for the GCW AT-AT. Also, note that the troops are double stacked, so there only has to be room for 20 people crammed together. Not that Star Wars has ever been overly concerned about being consistent with scale, only what looks good. 

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I could see movement slots on the side of an AT-AT base, then some tool or mechanic to turn them (change facing). Something along the lines of large ship movement in X-Wing. I just don't see them moving too fast across the board. 

I still think it is really too large for a reinforced platoon. I think it would be too many points to be viable as well. I could see a special scenario though.

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On 8/2/2018 at 5:01 AM, Shadow345 said:

They said Executor was too big for Armada but it's been announced now.

Do does this prove that an AT-AT will make its way to Legion one day as a super large model?

Hope not, it will mean they ran out of ideas and they will be following the community line of thoughts in marketing terms, instead of their own balanced game schedule.

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15 hours ago, Bohemian73 said:

I could see movement slots on the side of an AT-AT base, then some tool or mechanic to turn them (change facing). Something along the lines of large ship movement in X-Wing. I just don't see them moving too fast across the board. 

I still think it is really too large for a reinforced platoon. I think it would be too many points to be viable as well. I could see a special scenario though.

They're really difficult to fit into 25mm infantry games. The only time one appeared in anything official for D6 was a magazine scenario that came with a page to photocopy and cutout, AT-AT's and various hover vehicles, to run an all vehicular combat scenario. And for that the scale was zoomed out. Other than that all it saw in those days was some pics in the vehicle book of the MPC/Ertl model kit arrayed next to miniatures. It looked cool in carefully staged photos but I had one painted up already for fun, and I didn't find it to be acceptable for use in my minis games.

The best way to use them in IA/Legion scale in my opinion, is to have a small scenario that takes place INSIDE an AT-AT.

Potentially, the AT-AT map gets setup on a card table next to the main battle table. It can't walk into the battlefield because of a canyon, represented by the gulf between the two tables. But it can and does shoot into the main battle, and the rebel infiltrators are trying to kill the crew and take control of the guns.

Edited by TauntaunScout

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On 8/4/2018 at 10:23 AM, Caimheul1313 said:

I will point out that the board has no 3D terrain, and if I recall correctly the WotC game uses squares for measurements, like IA. A solid base would likely cause many problems with terrian features. A blockade forcing an AT-At to back up stretches credulity a bit. Not to say FFG couldn't figure it out, but i'm not counting on an AT-AT.

Edit: it would likely require special movement rules as the front to back movement would be.... Problematic.

Its possible it would have movement rules which would cause it to destroy anything it walked over.

Something like,

All-Terrain Mobility: If this vehicle's movement would cause it to overlap a terrain feature at the end of its movement, that terrain feature is destroyed and must be removed from the table. Trooper models that were on the terrain feature are displaced as normal, but must also make Clamber rolls for each figure that was displaced. This model may displace vehicles exactly as if they were troopers.

Edited by BadMotivator

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4 minutes ago, BadMotivator said:

Its possible it would have movement rules which would cause it to destroy anything it walked over.

Such an ability would be worth a LOT of points, since being able to pick and choose what terrain is on the board is incredibly powerful. 

Also, given that the speeders are affected by the terrain where they end their movement (due to the rules about being able to place the mini), that sort of rule would be really annoying to those of us who wonder why speeders are affected by terrain under them at the end of movement that they would otherwise ignore. 

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make the AT-AT out of tiles and have it separate from the main mission map.  have some Rebel mission tokens to act as a gate to the AT-AT tiles.  the rebels could hijack it and have to re-wire it.  the enemies could come in waves, like a return to hoth mission and you can make it fire like the turret in the first Return to hoth mission, but make it infinite range and it rolls 3 red dice with blast.  the rebels have to stop the imps from destroying something on the map or the AT-AT itself.  rebels can dis embark as they please, but somebody has to man the AT-AT to make it fire.

 

 

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On 8/3/2018 at 8:51 PM, Bohemian73 said:

What anti-personal defense did the AT-AT have? I can see a dead spot where the AT-AT cannot fire it's main weapons close range (range 2 to infinity?).

It has two rapid fire blasters which can svivel nearly 180°.
Also: It could set the weapons to a higher setting to kill everything around it with the splash damage but not high enoug to compromise its armour.

On 8/4/2018 at 12:38 AM, CaptainRocket said:

Welp, don't tell these guys an AT-AT is too big for a 6x4 table...

Vc7OIYR.jpg

Actually this doesn't seem like a very interesting match. The imperial side has only one true decision to make: On which speeder am I going to shoot. And the result of this is totally luck based. No cover play. No outmaneuvering.
Maybe they could decide to drop their troops. But then... Still running against a fortified position. A lot of dice throwing where the only tactical decisions for both sides are what to shoot.

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On 8/18/2018 at 4:10 PM, RogueLeader42 said:

Actually this doesn't seem like a very interesting match. The imperial side has only one true decision to make: On which speeder am I going to shoot. And the result of this is totally luck based. No cover play. No outmaneuvering.
Maybe they could decide to drop their troops. But then... Still running against a fortified position. A lot of dice throwing where the only tactical decisions for both sides are what to shoot.

I totally agree, just threw that game out WRT to the nay-sayers on scale and size!

While I suspect an AT-AT will eventually come (and eagerly support it) I think to be fun it will have to be be very much like X-Wing Epic or Executor in Armada: very scenario focused, new special rules to handle it, different force composition, etc. There's no way it will be "just another but bigger unit".

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1 hour ago, CaptainRocket said:

I totally agree, just threw that game out WRT to the nay-sayers on scale and size!

While I suspect an AT-AT will eventually come (and eagerly support it) I think to be fun it will have to be be very much like X-Wing Epic or Executor in Armada: very scenario focused, new special rules to handle it, different force composition, etc. There's no way it will be "just another but bigger unit".

With no terrain like in the photo, I agree it works fine. I do hope that if/when the AT-AT is released, you're right about the scenario focus. I wasn't aware the Executor wasnt just a bigger unit, the article made it seem like Huge ships were part of normal play, unlike (if I recall correctly) the article about the Rebel Transport also announced Epic Play...

Regardless, the majority of my concerns about the AT-AT are mostly centered around it being a part of "Standard" play.

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44 minutes ago, Caimheul1313 said:

I wasn't aware the Executor wasnt just a bigger unit, the article made it seem like Huge ships were part of normal play, unlike (if I recall correctly) the article about the Rebel Transport also announced Epic Play...

Regardless, the majority of my concerns about the AT-AT are mostly centered around it being a part of "Standard" play.

Hmmm... you're right. I hadn't looked into it much (since dropping Armada in favor of Legion), and with the talk of how the Executor had originally been designed to be part of the Corellian Conflict and its increased point limit I assumed perhaps too hastily that it couldn't play in standard games.

I too have a hard time seeing the AT-AT in standard play... actually now really curious how the Executor is not just totally wonky!

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1 hour ago, Caimheul1313 said:

 I wasn't aware the Executor wasnt just a bigger unit, the article made it seem like Huge ships were part of normal play, unlike (if I recall correctly) the article about the Rebel Transport also announced Epic Play...

The SSD for Armada is coming with 4 ship cards. Two of them are “prototype” versions, ie heavily underpowered, and theoretically usable in standard play (the one we’ve seen is half a list, naked), though whether they will be allowed in tournaments is an open question. The other two ship cards are up-gunned, up-powered versions meant for scenarios and some kind of Armada Epic play, though we don’t know yet exactly how that will work. 

 

If an AT-AT comes for Legion (and I think it will eventually, 3-4 years down the road), it will absolutely be as part of some for of en-big-enated, epic play style and not standard. 

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11 hours ago, Forgottenlore said:

The SSD for Armada is coming with 4 ship cards. Two of them are “prototype” versions, ie heavily underpowered, and theoretically usable in standard play (the one we’ve seen is half a list, naked), though whether they will be allowed in tournaments is an open question. The other two ship cards are up-gunned, up-powered versions meant for scenarios and some kind of Armada Epic play, though we don’t know yet exactly how that will work. 

 

If an AT-AT comes for Legion (and I think it will eventually, 3-4 years down the road), it will absolutely be as part of some for of en-big-enated, epic play style and not standard. 

I'd imagine that the intent with the "underpowered" version is for it to be tournament legal. I know if I was spending $200 on a model, I'd want to get as much use out of it as possible. 

I could see 3-4 years, or even later than that. Especially since FFG has indicated we aren't even playing the final form that they have planned for Legion. Between whatever new expansions they have planned for Rebel Alliance and Empire (which there are more than a few units people want to see, particularly stuff/characters from Rogue One and Rebels) and releases to flesh out new armies such as the Grand Army of the Republic, Confederacy of Independent Systems, and whatever other armies they decide to include (Gungans, Ewoks, Mandalore, Scum, etc), it might be some time before FFG decides to create new game modes requiring expensive models. 

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12 hours ago, Forgottenlore said:

The SSD for Armada is coming with 4 ship cards. Two of them are “prototype” versions, ie heavily underpowered, and theoretically usable in standard play (the one we’ve seen is half a list, naked), though whether they will be allowed in tournaments is an open question. The other two ship cards are up-gunned, up-powered versions meant for scenarios and some kind of Armada Epic play, though we don’t know yet exactly how that will work. 

 

If an AT-AT comes for Legion (and I think it will eventually, 3-4 years down the road), it will absolutely be as part of some for of en-big-enated, epic play style and not standard. 

Okay that makes a ton more sense! Did you hear how it was supposed to relate to the campaign?

I could totally see a similar thing with an AT-AT. Have a couple "cheap" versions. One that's basically a troop transport/mobile terrain. One that's basically an 'emplacement vehicle' Call them 'transport prototype' or 'damaged drive train'.

Then the full point cost vehicle with all capabilities would be released with higher point campaign set up... maybe multiple battle to recreate the Battle of Hoth!!!

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@CaptainRocket I'm still not convinced FFG plans on including transports in Legion as actual models. The major effect of transports in a wargame is to safely deploy infantry somewhere on the battlefield they would not normally be able to safely move. Rapid Reinforcements does a decent job of that in my opinion. One of the main reasons I can see the AT-AT working better solely in an Epic is the likely introduction of a new way to move, to prevent the AT-AT's movement from being ridiculous, or to reduce the cover. But we'll see what FFG has in mind if/when they get around to it. 

So the weird thing with the AT-AT, is the early GCW models start out as larger than the AT-AT seen in ESB...

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I agree about transports, they just don't seem like they would be fun or worth the points, though willing to be open minded about some kinda gunship with bonus transport ability (like spawn troops ignoring the usual range 2 deployment restriction).

As for scale... yeah, we're gonna "fly casual" on that front I figure... my popcorn bucket looks great IMHO!

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13 hours ago, Obvious_Ninja said:

As long as Legion is selling there will be an AT-AT... WotC did one. I'm sure FF will do one... And I'll be one of the first to get one... I'm hoping for next Christmas, myself ?

Armada's been out for 3 years, I wouldn't expect anything on the scale of the AT-AT for awhile yet, especially as next year is likely to be entirely clone wars releases for Legion. 

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On August 2, 2018 at 12:37 AM, Mep said:

I don't think they will do the AT-AT cause it is too big. I also didn't think they do the SSD cause it is too big.

However if the SSD is $200 wth will the AT-AT be?

Price is irrelevant to me. I'm getting two SSD. Likewise when the ATAT comes, I'll get two. 

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