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Now, for Korath, I plan on branching out into Starship Captain, working my way get all three Pride and Joy talents, at the very least, maybe even maxing it out (because it has a lot of useful talents), max out Fated Duel (right now, he only has the base ability), and probably Soresu Defender (he only needs two more talents to max it out), and a handful of skills, particularly Lightsaber, Piloting (Space), Discipline, Knowledge (Lore), Vigilance, and Leadership, to name a few. 

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2 hours ago, SithArissa said:

Tbh I was assuming the master characters were getting no xp.

 

2 hours ago, Rabobankrider said:

That too is a good option

Yea after 500xp or a 3rd tree characters are already breaking the game. Masters shouldnt get xp for things like pirates or stormtroopers or gathering together. At this point it should take some epic DeathStar trench run style event to even manage getting anything. 

Besides, arent they just going to be background NPCs at a certain point we are building towards? As you said Rabo, what really challenges characters at this level? Theres no way you or any GM should allow a Master level to go adventuring with a group of Padawons, they could solo anything a group of 4 starters should be encountering. 

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4 hours ago, Rabobankrider said:

I'd suggest a lightsaber and non-lightsaber specialist on each team, that way there's a nice balance of skills :) Medium range sounds good, Reesh would be happy to drop armour altogether for something like sparring, but I can see why mechanically that would disadvantage people. 

I'm ok going up against an opponent with an autofire weapon who starts at medium or long range and gets the first attack against me, it'll spoil the surprise if I say why.

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I like the Idea of maybe the masters only get xp for beating something of their level or greater. But also this -

The only true certainty was that the galaxy was about to change once again, and each and every one of these strangers would play a pivotal role in it. But they are not to be the heroes of this story. Relics of the past, warriors who have lost their way and figures who have hidden in the shadows for fear of their own lives. No, it is those they will help, they are to be the true heroes of this tale. 

Its the new characters story not the masters. 

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I'd recommend a cap at 2500.  Korath needs to grow and at the moment, because of how Tramp "converted" him (instead of rebuilding him with respect to the ffg system) he's not much more powerful than a starting character, and I'd be willing to cap Elias at 2400 if Korath got at cap at 2600.  Anyway my prediction is that this game will fall apart long before then but having the cap be that high will give Tramp incentive to play nicer than he would otherwise be inclined to.

But maybe we should reduce the xp of every master character by 5xp per 100 xp they are above the master character with the minimum xp,  but if that would be zero xp they get 5 xp instead of zero xp per session.  And the lowest master character gets 5 so less than the starting characters.

I give Tramp a lot of grief, but I think him playing Korath will help him relate to others better, that said he should not be permitted to get away with bad player behavior because it is "good roleplaying".  And if there is one starting character that is primarily Korath's "padawan" I volunteer for it to be chemdat (my starting characterl.

I also don't think that @KRKappel's jedi master game should be setting limits on this game (I think 2K is too low for the council)

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Well there hasn't been an official vote yet, But if I was to add to Arissa more I'd pick up Assassin. That would give me 5 Boost on Stealth and a reroll on Stealth checks, 4 ranks of Dodge , Precise Aim to remove setbacks, Deadly Accuracy and Targeted blow to add damage to attacks, Quick Draw and Jump up, and the best thing 3 more ranks in Lethal Blows to go along with the 2 from Juyo and the +30 I can get from Makashi Finish and +5 for each Darkside point from Juyo Savagery for +80 minimum (and would be another +40 with the current pool so I would only need to roll 30 to instantly kill anyone.) Fun huh?

Edited by SithArissa

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27 minutes ago, SithArissa said:

Well there hasn't been an official vote yet, But I i was to add to Arissa more I'd pick up Assassin. That would give me 5 Boost on Stealth and a reroll on Stealth checks, 4 ranks of Dodge , Precise Aim to remove setbacks, Deadly Accuracy and Targeted blow to add damage to attacks, Quick Draw and Jump up, and the best thing 3 more ranks in Lethal Blows to go along with the 2 from Juyo and the +30 I can get from Makashi Finish and +5 for each Darkside point from Juyo Savagery for +80 minimum (and would be another +40 with the current pool so I would only need to roll 30 to instantly kill anyone.) Fun huh?

Arissa is scary.  If Elias had to fight her he'd throw a sil 2 (or better yet sil 3) speeder at her, 20 or 30 damage, no opposed check when you throw an object instead of a character, and it's a ranged attack made with a 3 yellow 3 green pool against 1 purple (assuming short range) before you use dodge so 1 purple 2 red, defensive training parry and reflect do not apply so I like my odds to hit, and if I had to burn a destiny point and take a few conflict to get the pips I would, also I like my chances at going first currently a 2 yellow, 4 green, 3 blue, 4 white initiative check but I'm planning to get a 3rd rank of vigilance and a 5th white die.

Of course i might open with draw closer and if I hit activate concussive 2 and keep you stun locked and if I miss then throw the speeder at you.

If it came down to a lightsaber duel arissa would wreck anyone short of mace windu (i.e. everyone) but I'm reminded of an exchange from pirates of the Caribbean

"I would have killed you in a fair fight"

"Well that's not much of an incentive for me to fight fair, now is it?"

?

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11 hours ago, EliasWindrider said:

Arissa is scary.  If Elias had to fight her he'd throw a sil 2 (or better yet sil 3) speeder at her, 20 or 30 damage, no opposed check when you throw an object instead of a character, and it's a ranged attack made with a 3 yellow 3 green pool against 1 purple (assuming short range) before you use dodge so 1 purple 2 red, defensive training parry and reflect do not apply so I like my odds to hit, and if I had to burn a destiny point and take a few conflict to get the pips I would, also I like my chances at going first currently a 2 yellow, 4 green, 3 blue, 4 white initiative check but I'm planning to get a 3rd rank of vigilance and a 5th white die.

Of course i might open with draw closer and if I hit activate concussive 2 and keep you stun locked and if I miss then throw the speeder at you.

If it came down to a lightsaber duel arissa would wreck anyone short of mace windu (i.e. everyone) but I'm reminded of an exchange from pirates of the Caribbean

"I would have killed you in a fair fight"

"Well that's not much of an incentive for me to fight fair, now is it?"

?

I could pick up The Power of Darkness talent from Juyo and with only 3 DS points I would survive the sil 2 drop. Would need more toughened to survive 3 sil but I think more are out of reach even with another 500 xp. 

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2 hours ago, Rabobankrider said:

At this stage I think @EliasWindrider probably has the suggestion that will please the most people. I will say though that most of the stuff I will be doing as GM will be for the benefit of the padawans with the masters as a vehicle for that. 

I also agree that most of the focus should be on the starting characters.

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On 7/17/2018 at 2:50 PM, Rabobankrider said:

I'd suggest a lightsaber and non-lightsaber specialist on each team, that way there's a nice balance of skills :) Medium range sounds good, Reesh would be happy to drop armour altogether for something like sparring, but I can see why mechanically that would disadvantage people. 

@SithArissa, @TheShard Are we going to get this off the ground?  To satisfy curiosity, I'm willing to try Elias against any master character in the party except Ro'Ka and Korath, because I already have a good handle on those odds.  Elias vs. Ro'Ka would end badly forElias probably 7 times out of 10 (Elias would have to win initiative, and roll well in the first round to have a shot and that's thanks to a fully modded dragite crystal). 

I don't want Elias to fight Korath, because I really don't want a repeat argument about how I should have built Elias differently because he shouldn't have improved that much relative to Korath in such a short amount of time which isn't "realistic".  But if tramp will promise me not to bring that up again I'll humor him with a 1 on 1 match.

Drez'n with his cortosis armor has a decent shot at Ro'Ka, Arissa *might* get her through criticals in the first round. 

Elias would do better against Arissa in a one on one match (only 2 force dice determining the destiny pool) than against her in a 2 vs. 2 match (4 dice in the pool).

I'm curious about how Elias would do against Akua,  who I think are pretty similar in a lot of ways.

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54 minutes ago, Jonas Shaaf said:

Personally I'm in the no XP for masters camp, but I seem to be in the minority here.

To get a burgeoning jedi master version of Elias (who I'd consider just a very experienced knight right now) I'd need another 100 xp: 20 for center of being, 25 for improved center of being, 25 for force rating (all from niman disciple), 5 for the details upgrade of foresight, 15 for a 3rd rank in vigilance (yeah precognition was a big thing for the aborted (star wars meets Jurassic park meets highlander failed campaign) d6 character Nathan Sunrider I wanted to make in rcr but was disallowed by tramp in 2005 and Elias resulted instead) then 10 xp for the force leap as a maneuver upgrade to the enhance power... I expect that to synergize nicely with improved dodge from steel hand adept.

At 1500 intelligently spent xp, I'd say Elias is currently a few hundred xp shy of the power level of Anakin in revenge of the sith, and I'd say anakin lacked the "focus"/discipline Elias has (Anakin spent his xp unwisely, although not as unwisely as Korath  ?, because hey he's Anakin and lacks discipline),  so I'd put anakin at about 2000 xp at the time of revenge of the sith, and he was granted a seat on the council at palpatine's insistence but not elevated to the rank of master.  

Maybe to get a better handle on how much xp it takes to make a master character we should try building some movie characters?

Obiwan had soresu defender, padawan survivor, niman disciple or arbiter, teacher, warleader.

Anakin had shien expert, padawan survivor,  niman disciple, starfighter ace, warleader as of rots

I personally think that Kylo Ren has about in the neighborhood of 1500 xp as of TLJ but probably 5-6 force rating, he's really not all that good with a saber so probably shien expert, padawan survivor, and then 2 specs that each grant 2 FR.  He's less impressive than anakin as of rots imho, but smoke chose him for his potential and the fact that he wasn't YET powerful enough to be a real threat.

 

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Here's an approximate progression plan for Elias' next 500 xp  snap shotted at 100 xp increments, I fidgeted with the "actual" order to make the increments come out evenly, and the 1600 xp increment is the only one I would consider set in stone.

http://www.mediafire.com/file/gjh3knvgufk0ycn/EliasWindriderSequelEra1600xp.pdf

http://www.mediafire.com/file/qcd5uf8dt7ssjne/EliasWindriderSequelEra1700xp.pdf

http://www.mediafire.com/file/qs4egvyirx5qftx/EliasWindriderSequelEra1800xp.pdf

http://www.mediafire.com/file/3sc9n7xh5rg0s6y/EliasWindriderSequelEra1900xp.pdf

http://www.mediafire.com/file/dc0pz692xu11hj2/EliasWindriderSequelEra2000xp.pdf

 

 

And here's the end goal at 2500 xp (which is just touches my sanity limit, note to get the 5 ranks of coordination for use with coordination dodge I needed to ditch the quickdraw I selected in the earlier pdfs so consider it stricken from the record, I'm just to lazy to go back and remove it), with any more than 2500 xp I don't have to choose between the things I want... so what would be the point then, coincidentally this is about what I would consider prequel era Jedi council level (maybe a mace windu equivalent, but not a yoda... yoda probably has 2800).  But I really do want  the maxed out coordination dodge and I need 2500 xp to get it, so I rescind the offer to limit Elias to 2400 xp so Korath could have 2600.  Of course I realize that this campaign isn't going to last long enough for Elias to collect another 1000 xp but still.

http://www.mediafire.com/file/37eava5aj33wmjh/EliasWindriderSequelEra2500xp.pdf

 

Maybe we could hypothetically advance the master characters to 2000 xp and 2500 xp and duel at that level for a level playing field weight class, gear is something else of course, maybe leave armor at the equivalent of armored robes???

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10 hours ago, EliasWindrider said:

Elias vs. Ro'Ka would end badly forElias probably 7 times out of 10 (Elias would have to win initiative, and roll well in the first round to have a shot and that's thanks to a fully modded dragite crystal). 

Ill take this as a compliment. Hunter/Heavy is a very good combo. Mix in some cybernetics, autofire, and a bunch of force rating, its truly terrifing. 

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3 hours ago, TheShard said:

2000xp is a good dueling point.

I'm willing to go armor as is or armored robes. 

 

If you make the changes to your ogg dude sheet (instead of just crossing things out and post a in to that I'm willing to do a one vs. One against you without updating swsheets (I really don't want to update swsheets for this) as long as we know what the build is.  My 2000xp build isn't strictly built for fighting, he's meant to say e useful at stuff besides combat in a real game, for thi purpose I'll think I'll move the 5th dedication from cunning to brawn which would get the 6th or 7th dedication.

We also ought to create a few locations with terrain, which we roll randomly  to select for each match.  

I think destiny points should work for each side as if they were pcs and the otherside were npcs.  So instead of lightside and darkside there are A-side and B-side destiny points, to members of team A A-side destiny points are lightside and B-side destiny points are darkside.  To members of team B, B-side destiny points are lightside and A-side destiny points are darkside.  Spending A-side destiny points turn them to B-side destiny points and vice versa.  I also think that instead of rolling destiny points there should initially be a number of destiny points per side equal to the number of team members plus one.

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9 hours ago, EliasWindrider said:

I think destiny points should work for each side as if they were pcs and the otherside were npcs.  So instead of lightside and darkside there are A-side and B-side destiny points, to members of team A A-side destiny points are lightside and B-side destiny points are darkside.  To members of team B, B-side destiny points are lightside and A-side destiny points are darkside.  Spending A-side destiny points turn them to B-side destiny points and vice versa.  I also think that instead of rolling destiny points there should initially be a number of destiny points per side equal to the number of team members plus one.

 

It occurs to me that the A vs. B side destiny points would make Arissa's trash talk a lot less dramatic 

"Dark side" A-team arissa:  you don't know the power of the B-side

Lightside B-team: yes we do, we're b-siders.

Arissa: I mean you don't know the power of using the B-side to fight the B-side

B-team:  I imagine it's a lot like using the B-side to fight the A-side

Arissa: no it's darker and more dramatic so it's much cooler.

B-team: firefighters use fire to fight fire and they're heroes, so I don't see how it's that dark.

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1 hour ago, Tramp Graphics said:

I just read a very interesting thread over in the EotE Gamemasters’ forum that everyone should check out and take to heart. Group Implosion and Video Games.

Since quoting Matthew 7:5 would come across too antagonistic, which is not my intent, I will instead quote Ghandi "you must be the change you want to see in the world"

 

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