WOTF: Triple Threat question

[CrowOfPyke 14]

Do you have to be able to re-roll 3 character dice to play Triple Threat?  For example, if there are only 2 character dice in play, can you still play Triple Threat?  Can you choose to re-roll less than 3 character dice if 3 are available?

 

I have gotten two different rulings from local judges at different stores. 

[Abyss 328]

It doesn't say up to, it specifies three dice. So yes, you should need three dice to do it (though Destiny's rules are kind of backwards sometimes, so I'm not 100% certain on that).

[CrowOfPyke 14]

51 minutes ago, Abyss said:

It doesn't say up to, it specifies three dice. So yes, you should need three dice to do it (though Destiny's rules are kind of backwards sometimes, so I'm not 100% certain on that).

Seems reasonable to me.

Here is the card's text: "Reroll 3 character dice. Then turn one of them to any side."

The judge at one store who ruled the other way simply said you had to fulfill as much of the condition or card or requirement as you could, but otherwise it works without 3 character dice in play to reroll.  I thought it a bit odd that he ruled that way, and later when I tried that at the other store, they said nope, there have to be at least 3 character dice in play to choose from in order to play Triple Threat.

Uhhhhhhhh....  And now it's causing a little bit of local debate with a SC event coming up this weekend. 

[NetCop 64]

There is no play restriction for that card. You can play it even if there is less than 3 character dice however the second part of the card is "Then" and it will work only if you rerolled 3 character dice. It's "THEN" effect from p.19.

[kingbobb 126]

4 hours ago, CrowOfPyke said:

Seems reasonable to me.

Here is the card's text: "Reroll 3 character dice. Then turn one of them to any side."

The judge at one store who ruled the other way simply said you had to fulfill as much of the condition or card or requirement as you could, but otherwise it works without 3 character dice in play to reroll.  I thought it a bit odd that he ruled that way, and later when I tried that at the other store, they said nope, there have to be at least 3 character dice in play to choose from in order to play Triple Threat.

Uhhhhhhhh....  And now it's causing a little bit of local debate with a SC event coming up this weekend. 

So far as you've posted, both judges were incorrect.  As NetCop posted, you can play Triple Threat at any time you can pay the cost, as it has no play restrictions.  But it does have a then effect, and the only way to use a then effect is if you can fully satisfy the part before the then.  In this case, reroll 3 dice.  Not 1 or 2.  No 3 dice rerolled, no then effect.  

[Lusiphur05 30]

You can reroll less then three character dice, but if you do, you do not satisfy the Then condition and cannot turn one of the dice to any side.

[Vineheart01 6,398]

Generally if there isnt an "up to" you have to reroll 3 dice, its the reason Battle Formation is kinda crap.

But, unless it is one of the very few effects that requires dice to actually be out there for something (usually limited to showing a result), you just satisfy as much as you can.

Remember it can be used on opponents dice too, it does not say "yours"

[Zordren 37]

Similar to Loth Cat and Mouse, then? (can’t remove an opponent’s die if you had no dice in the pool for your opponent to remove first?)

[CrowOfPyke 14]

4 hours ago, NetCop said:

There is no play restriction for that card. You can play it even if there is less than 3 character dice however the second part of the card is "Then" and it will work only if you rerolled 3 character dice. It's "THEN" effect from p.19.

Right on.  Thank you sir, and thanks for the RR page number, that helps a great deal.

[Trapeziste 0]

I am refreshing this topic because I disagree  with the ruling here and thought the best would be to disuss it !

The THEN rule is here to explicitly state that you must fulfill what is before to be allowed to do what is after.

"He doesn't like you" : Choose one of your dice and remove it. Then choose an opponent's dice..."

Contrary to cards without THEN such as "Heat of the Battle" : Choose an opponent. That opponent turns up to 2 of their dice to sides showing damage ( or ). Turn up to 2 of your dice to sides showing damage ( or ).

Here no THEN so you can play the card even if your opponent does not have these two dice to turn. You can still turn yours.

Note that "Heat of the Battle" like many other cards also use the phrasing "up to". Back to this later.

But not because it's written THEN means what's before does not have a condition. The condition is to respect the rule. For example nothing on any event prevent me from using them during some one else turn but it's not the rule so I don't do it. (I could use "Stifle" and activate it during my opponent's turn because it's written on it).

 

Back to "Triple Threat": Reroll 3 character dice. Then turn one of them to any side.

Does not say : Reroll up to 3 character dice. Then if you rerolled 3 turn one of them to any side.

The use of "up to" is EXTREMELY important.  On "Alter" it allows you to change only 1 dice and overpay for it but let you have this opportunity. On "Battle formation" like it was mentionned or on "Triple threat" there is no "up to".

 

Therefore, you can't play the card if you do not reroll 3 character's dice just like it is written on it, in my oppinion.

[DarkFallenAngel 5]

You play Triple Threat. If there are three character dice in play you must re-roll 3. If there are only 1 or 2 then roll as many as you can. THEN (if you re-rolled 3 dice)  you must turn one of them to any side. If you did not reroll 3 dice you cannot turn any dice but you absolutely can reroll less than 3 character dice if there are less than 3 in play. 

[Trapeziste 0]

15 hours ago, DarkFallenAngel said:

You play Triple Threat. If there are three character dice in play you must re-roll 3. If there are only 1 or 2 then roll as many as you can. THEN (if you re-rolled 3 dice)  you must turn one of them to any side. If you did not reroll 3 dice you cannot turn any dice but you absolutely can reroll less than 3 character dice if there are less than 3 in play. 

Could you quote the rule allowing to do less than what is written on the card ?

 

 

[DarkFallenAngel 5]

2 hours ago, Trapeziste said:

Could you quote the rule allowing to do less than what is written on the card ?

Players must resolve as much of an ability as they are able to, unless it includes the word “may” or explicitly gives the player a choice. Special abilities (S) are mandatory if that side of its die is resolved 

RRG Page 17

 

2 hours ago, Trapeziste said:

 

 

[TIE wing 10]

pretty sure you can just reroll 2 out of 3 and then no 'then' effect.

the 'up to' is just there to say it is optional to do so.

[toxic newb 5]

18 hours ago, TIE wing said:

pretty sure you can just reroll 2 out of 3 and then no 'then' effect.

the 'up to' is just there to say it is optional to do so.

I think tie wing is correct. If he's not then that means T3 gaming, dice commando, Team Covenant, and more than half of the destiny community is wrong

[nafisjedriel 0]

If you did not reroll 3 dice you cannot turn any dice but you absolutely can reroll less than 3 character dice if there are less than 3 in play. 

Redtube Beeg Spankbang

Edited June 10 by nafisjedriel

[toxic newb 5]

Regarding this question, are you able to chose an opponent's character dice aswell?

[gokubb 149]

8 hours ago, toxic newb said:

Regarding this question, are you able to chose an opponent's character dice aswell?

Anytime a card reference just character dice, without prefacing with yours or opponent's, then it can affect either players' character dice.

Edited June 10 by gokubb