Jump to content
X Wing Nut

Afterburnes is this where the lie comes undone?

Recommended Posts

I just think it is interesting that Afterburners HAPPENS to be the most powerful modification at this point, that most ships want to take, if they can. 

There aren't a lot of cards that add action economy, and the one that does just HAPPENS to be in extremely short supply, and only fitting the narrative we've been fed in the loosest possible interpretation. 

So... to think that this is not deliberate, is asinine. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Commander Kaine said:

I just think it is interesting that Afterburners HAPPENS to be the most powerful modification at this point, that most ships want to take, if they can. 

There aren't a lot of cards that add action economy, and the one that does just HAPPENS to be in extremely short supply, and only fitting the narrative we've been fed in the loosest possible interpretation. 

So... to think that this is not deliberate, is asinine. 

You sound terribly paranoid. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, Commander Kaine said:

I just think it is interesting that Afterburners HAPPENS to be the most powerful modification at this point, that most ships want to take, if they can. 

There aren't a lot of cards that add action economy, and the one that does just HAPPENS to be in extremely short supply, and only fitting the narrative we've been fed in the loosest possible interpretation. 

So... to think that this is not deliberate, is asinine. 

With your keen powers of deduction, what are you doing hanging around the FFG forums? Robert Mueller and the American people need you!
But, in all seriousness, this kind of massive overhaul is complicated. There are bound to be mistakes and misstatements. It seems like they're trying to make this consumer-friendly so let's wait and see how this plays out. If insufficient afterburners are the worst glitch, I think we're doing pretty well.

Edited by PenguinBonaparte

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, JamesWG said:

Marinealver - I can't recall the video where they said that just like always for official tournaments you'll need a physical copy of every upgrade card in your squad.

It's in the tournament rules I think (or it will be once they're released), and they mentioned it several times on the World's Stream. 

But yeah, it should be of no surprise that there's a great card in an FFG Core set which you don't get enough copies of. That's just how they roll in all their games unfortunately. The surprising thing is if it's in the Fang Fighter set as well (which it technically shouldn't be, as we know what's in the Scum conversation kit).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One not entirely related observation; looking at the quick build card for the black squadron ace; it does seem to imply that the afterburners mod is going to be an expensive one.

Assuming points costs are (proportionally) unchanged from 1.0:

  • Black Squadron Pilot Ace - 14
  • Outmanoeuvre - 3
  • Shield Upgrade - 4
  • Engine Upgrade Afterburners - 4

Which is 1/4 of a squad, or two threat.

Have things changed price? Maybe, but if so, probably downwards:

  • With a 'clean' academy pilot being one threat, I assume they're still 12 points (equivalent).
  • Whilst we've been told higher end aces pay a premium, Black Squadron aren't I4 generics like Rogues or Sabers, and don't get Pilot Abilities or The Force.
  • Outmanoeuvre and Shield Upgrade are both widely considered to be overpriced in 1.0.
  • Outmanoeuvre is further best used to remove hyper-modified green dice (Han with C-3PO, Dash with Lone Wolf, The Inquisitor with Autothrusters/Palpatine, etc), which (in theory) are less common.

In short, I fear my hope for 5 strikers with afterburners may be a no-go unless the striker also goes down in cost.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, judging by the utility of afterburners (even if it is limited by charges) it's going to be EXPENSIVE

AT LEAST 8 points like ye ole EU, given what it offers

So, you could run multiples but should you? If FFG does their job right, you probably shouldn't (esp if higher I pilots pay significantly for their advantages)

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's also charge-based, so you either have to select when to use it carefully, or else find a way to flip charges and spend even more points on that.  On cheaper platforms, you either won't get much use out of it or you'll make weak ships too big and just hand your opponent points.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/10/2018 at 12:09 PM, HolySorcerer said:

There is no way the Interceptor and awing don’t come with this card in wave 2. Hold off on the pitchforks until we see what the cardboard only upgrade packs look like. 

Also, this thing is going to be 8 points minimum, so you probably aren’t going to want 5 of these anyways. 

i already own 6 interceptors, so what i should buy 2 or 3 more of them

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, ficklegreendice said:

Yeah, judging by the utility of afterburners (even if it is limited by charges) it's going to be EXPENSIVE

AT LEAST 8 points like ye ole EU, given what it offers

So, you could run multiples but should you? If FFG does their job right, you probably shouldn't (esp if higher I pilots pay significantly for their advantages)

I agree. It's a really good upgrade and the obvious (without knowing points) gotta-get-me-some-of-that card, because 1.0 proved that buying a high initiative repositioning ace and avoiding being shot at at all beats any amount of toughness increases hands-down, and with limited 360' turrets, that's probably more true, not less.

I think it's appealing simply because there aren't a huge number of alternatives right at this moment. People are used to hull upgrades not being worth it (although it wouldn't surprise me to see them come down from 6 to 5 points as a result, maybe even 4?), stealth is nice but only really if you can modify the be-jesus out of that green die to ensure you keep rolling it (so on a Lone Wolf/Full Throttle TIE defender it's awesome).

But it hopefully shouldn't be too vital - all small ships do now have at least a red reposition baked in without having to buy modifications, which should help keep afterburners less appealing than they were before (for example) S-Foils.

I do keep looking at the fact that electronic baffle is now a universally available modification and thinking 'hmm', though. Yes, all right, a point of damage hurts, but sometimes you might be prepared to pay that. Certainly it looks like a nice option for beefier ships like TIE bombers or Punishers; K-turn/Baffle/Boost/Link/Target Lock and "have thou some advanced proton torpedoes where the sun shineth not" sounds like something I'd pay a shield token for with glee.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, HolySorcerer said:

Because the cardboard only upgrade pack they are releasing will likely come with Afterburners.

What makes you think that?  I strongly believe those baggies included in the conversion kits are a preview of what can be expected in the cardboard only packs that will be released in future waves.  Those baggies only contain new cards.  As in cards not in the Kit or the Core Set.  Since Afterburners are in Core they won't be in cardboard only packs just like they are not in the Scum Kit baggie.

Obviously I don't know for sure, but I think I have some compelling evidence behind my contention.  Have you seen or heard something from FFG indicating that the cardboard only packs will contain more than the bare minimum?  I have not watched every video so I certainly could have missed something.

As a tangent, I do somewhat expect Maul to be an exception to this general rule of only new cards in the cardboard only packs.  I would hope Maul will be in the cardboard only pack for the Ghost when that ship is re-released, so that Rebel players can have access to it without needing to buy either the out-of-faction Scum kit or re-buy the full ship.  Would it shock me if Maul is not in the cardboard only pack?  No.  But I really think it should to hold true to both the "no need to buy out of faction" promise and the "no need to rebuy re-released ships to get access to new upgrades/pilots" promise.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, JamesWG said:

What makes you think that?  I strongly believe those baggies included in the conversion kits are a preview of what can be expected in the cardboard only packs that will be released in future waves.  Those baggies only contain new cards.  As in cards not in the Kit or the Core Set.  Since Afterburners are in Core they won't be in cardboard only packs just like they are not in the Scum Kit baggie.

Obviously I don't know for sure, but I think I have some compelling evidence behind my contention.  Have you seen or heard something from FFG indicating that the cardboard only packs will contain more than the bare minimum?  I have not watched every video so I certainly could have missed something.

As a tangent, I do somewhat expect Maul to be an exception to this general rule of only new cards in the cardboard only packs.  I would hope Maul will be in the cardboard only pack for the Ghost when that ship is re-released, so that Rebel players can have access to it without needing to buy either the out-of-faction Scum kit or re-buy the full ship.  Would it shock me if Maul is not in the cardboard only pack?  No.  But I really think it should to hold true to both the "no need to buy out of faction" promise and the "no need to rebuy re-released ships to get access to new upgrades/pilots" promise.

Yeah this all makes alot of sense. And makes me just not want to be involved in xwing anymore. Tired of having to sift through legalese bull cause they won't speak plainly, as they nickel and dime ****** everything. Not enough that it's 300 bucks to get a collection of one each of everything converted nah. They gotta **** ya again on everything.

Edited by Dabirdisdaword

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, Dabirdisdaword said:

Not enough that it's 300 bucks to get a collection of one each of everything converted

$300 to covert a collection of one of each ship?  What kind of math is that?

$150 for one of each of the existing kits.  The Resistance and First Order kits are of unknown pricing but FFG has said those kits will be cheaper because they convert fewer ships.  Let's call it $25 a Kit (and I suspect even that is high).  So an additional $50 for a total of $200.  Even throwing in a Core Set only brings it to $240.  And that's at full retail.  All of these will be available for cheaper than that if you want to order online.

I don't dispute that some people will need to spend $300 or more if they wish to convert their entire collection.  But those collections are larger than one of each ship.

I also don't begrudge the decision to quit because of being tired of being nickle and dimed and/or are tired of less than transparent marketing language.  But I did feel compelled to challenge the $300 figure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, JamesWG said:

$300 to covert a collection of one of each ship?  What kind of math is that?

$150 for one of each of the existing kits.  The Resistance and First Order kits are of unknown pricing but FFG has said those kits will be cheaper because they convert fewer ships.  Let's call it $25 a Kit (and I suspect even that is high).  So an additional $50 for a total of $200.  Even throwing in a Core Set only brings it to $240.  And that's at full retail.  All of these will be available for cheaper than that if you want to order online.

I don't dispute that some people will need to spend $300 or more if they wish to convert their entire collection.  But those collections are larger than one of each ship.

I also don't begrudge the decision to quit because of being tired of being nickle and dimed and/or are tired of less than transparent marketing language.  But I did feel compelled to challenge the $300 figure.

I'm not assuming fo and resistance will be discounted but they might be. And I'm working in Canadian.  50 dollar core 3 conversions at 60 each for 230. Plus anywhere up to 60 each for fo and resistance. But fine call it 30 each for fo and resistance. That's 290. Close enough to call 300? I think so when ya add in taxes and such.

 

So... That kinda math.

Edited by Dabirdisdaword

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Dabirdisdaword said:

I'm not assuming fo and resistance will be discounted but they might be. And I'm working in Canadian.  50 dollar core 3 conversions at 60 each for 230. Plus anywhere up to 60 each for fo and resistance. But fine call it 30 each for fo and resistance. That's 290. Close enough to call 300? I think so when ya add in taxes and such.

 

So... That kinda math.

Well we don't have to assume that the FO and Resistance kits will cost less.  FFG has said it.  How much less has not been determined.  But since the other factions have around 4x the number of ships it should be significantly less.  I expect those kits to be even cheaper than half but went with half to be conservative.

My apology that I assumed you were talking in US dollars.  But to be fair, since FFG is a US company, and "bucks" is slang for dollars in the US (as well as in Canada) if you probably should have called out that your figures were not meant to indicate US currency to start.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, JamesWG said:

Well we don't have to assume that the FO and Resistance kits will cost less.  FFG has said it.  How much less has not been determined.  But since the other factions have around 4x the number of ships it should be significantly less.  I expect those kits to be even cheaper than half but went with half to be conservative.

My apology that I assumed you were talking in US dollars.  But to be fair, since FFG is a US company, and "bucks" is slang for dollars in the US (as well as in Canada) if you probably should have called out that your figures were not meant to indicate US currency to start.

True, I was not clear at all about currency my bad. And I don't trust ffg at all right now. When they say less it could be 5 bucks less and still be true.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Dabirdisdaword said:

True, I was not clear at all about currency my bad. And I don't trust ffg at all right now. When they say less it could be 5 bucks less and still be true.

So you DO trust them to keep their word; you just aren't reading tons more into their statement than they actually said.

That's...pretty reasonable, actually.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Dabirdisdaword said:

I don't trust ffg at all right now. When they say less it could be 5 bucks less and still be true.

Fair enough.  I know you are not the only one turned off by the some of FFG's marketing tactics.  I think they would have been better served being more open about things.  Sure some people would disagree with some of the their decisions but now they are angry about feeling deceived on top of it.

Though when all is said and done I suspect it won't matter much.  I don't think enough people will be angry enough to really impact their bottom line. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As a point, the text on the card for the slave 1 title is a little different in the firespray expansion to what is seen in the conversion kit tha5 has been shown.  This could also point to the kits we have seen being pre production and the finished product will be different.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/13/2018 at 8:54 PM, Dabirdisdaword said:

True, I was not clear at all about currency my bad. And I don't trust ffg at all right now. When they say less it could be 5 bucks less and still be true.

In before Resistance and FO kits are 49.99 :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...