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That Tireless is just what the Lion have been looking for, and the new spell while good will likely see more play in Phoenix than Lion.

The Water master is just all kinds of wrong and will continue the trend of Phoenix big boys Water/Earth archetype.

And I will simply close my thoughts with 

Y O R I TO M O !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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I am so excited for the play opportunities Yoritomo brings. He really synergies well with the Tall board players, with Unicorn Yurt mechanics, and with the old "Save all your fate for Conflict Characters" build.

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As much as I liked the dead personality in discard pile revised as Lion sub-theme here, I kind of hoped it would be the Unicorn sub-theme in the LCG.   One of the interesting things that evolved for Unicorn in the original L5R was the concept of the Unicorn Death Priest aka the discard pile mattered for some interesting Unicorn mechanics.

FFG has done a nice job of bringing some of these sub-themes back early from the Core Set and now in the Elemental Cycle. 

the temple of death.jpg

cav-shugs.jpg

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15 minutes ago, sector3600 said:

As much as I liked the dead personality in discard pile revised as Lion sub-theme here, I kind of hoped it would be the Unicorn sub-theme in the LCG.   One of the interesting things that evolved for Unicorn in the original L5R was the concept of the Unicorn Death Priest aka the discard pile mattered for some interesting Unicorn mechanics.

FFG has done a nice job of bringing some of these sub-themes back early from the Core Set and now in the Elemental Cycle. 

You forgot my all-time favorite, the Soul of Moto Tsume himself...

moto%20akikazu.jpg

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1 hour ago, sector3600 said:

As much as I liked the dead personality in discard pile revised as Lion sub-theme here, I kind of hoped it would be the Unicorn sub-theme in the LCG.   One of the interesting things that evolved for Unicorn in the original L5R was the concept of the Unicorn Death Priest aka the discard pile mattered for some interesting Unicorn mechanics.

FFG has done a nice job of bringing some of these sub-themes back early from the Core Set and now in the Elemental Cycle. 

 

Lion Ancestors was a thing long before the death priests showed up.

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11 minutes ago, Schmoozies said:

Lion Ancestors was a thing long before the death priests showed up.

 

23 minutes ago, Schmoozies said:

Lion Ancestors was a thing long before the death priests showed up.

But it was not as big of a sub-theme as with the Unicorn,  the point is yeah it was splashed in Lion but it was basically core to much of the Unicorn design for longer until the cycle before Ivory.  In fact, the Lion Clan HAD only one "graveyard" based Stronghold - The Hall of Ancestors.

Unicorn had 3 including an experience version of the Temple of Death with different abilities.

 

 

 

 

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Unicorn had 18 Death Priest personalities.  8 which interacted with the the discard pile's dead personalities.   The dead and discard pile was the key sub-theme to Unicorn for a long time, that some people wondered if the Unicorn lost their Clan identity.  

 

Edited by sector3600
fixed wording

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The scarier thing is if Mantis brings in Naval or Range into the LCG ;) 

The neat thing about Mantis is their playing the Fate game, but I wonder if it'll get out of hand if every Clan can splash in Mantis cards with any future Fate pool manipulation cards. 

Still if Mantis gets Clan status down the road, what will their role be in the LCG?

This Yoritomo clearly wants big Fate pools ... 

The potential for Yoritomo be a 5/5 or greater in a early conflict for 5 Fate is almost too efficient for a Neutral :P

 

 

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3 minutes ago, sector3600 said:

Unicorn had 18 Death Priest personalities.  8 which interacted with the the discard pile or dead personalities.   The dead and discard pile was the key sub-theme to Unicorn for a long time, that some people wondered if the Unicorn lost their Clan identity.  

 

Yes but the Kitsu ancestor worship/graveyard interaction dates back to the first edition RPG and was a core effect for many of the early Kitsu Shugenja in the CCG.  Again I only gave you a small sampling of the early L5R characters that had it. 

The rise of the Death Priests was a later adaptation of the Unicorn themes and while it did eventually rise to a level of an important sub theme, it was always present in the Lion as well so saying that Lion stole it from Unicorn is incorrect.  At this point in the Story Unicorn were busy trying to assimilate as best they could and those who were practicing ancient Moto traditions were doing so for the most part on the down low.  Given the general attitude of most Rokugani to anything to do with the dead (Lion were generally communicating with Spirits and seeking guidance from an ancestor with the occasional helpful spirit appearing to lend a hand rather than wholesale raising the dead) the reaction to Unicorn Death Priests, especially given the already shaky acceptance of Meishido, may be a bridge to far for most clans.

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Just now, sector3600 said:

The scarier thing is if Mantis brings in Naval or Range into the LCG ;) 

The neat thing about Mantis is their playing the Fate game, but I wonder if it'll get out of hand if every Clan can splash in Mantis cards with any future Fate pool manipulation cards. 

Still if Mantis gets Clan status down the road, what will their role be in the LCG?

This Yoritomo clearly wants big Fate pools ... 

The potential for Yoritomo be a 5/5 or greater in a early conflict for 5 Fate is almost too efficient for a Neutral :P

 

 

Mantis will likely end up as and economy control with military smash.  Fate efficiency mixed with high risk reward game play.

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Well the next thought, is if Mantis did get full Clan status in the LCG - would the Neutral Mantis Clan cards be updated to reflect their status thus lose their neutrality?

FFG will have a headache in the future, if Neutral card Yoritomo and Mantis card Yoritomo can be in the same build ;)

 

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Just now, sector3600 said:

Well the next thought, is if Mantis did get full Clan status in the LCG - would the Neutral Mantis Clan cards be updated to reflect their status thus lose their neutrality?

FFG will have a headache in the future, if Neutral card Yoritomo and Mantis card Yoritomo can be in the same build ;)

 

Why? The Three Copies Per Title rule would still apply. 

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1 minute ago, sector3600 said:

Well the next thought, is if Mantis did get full Clan status in the LCG - would the Neutral Mantis Clan cards be updated to reflect their status thus lose their neutrality?

FFG will have a headache in the future, if Neutral card Yoritomo and Mantis card Yoritomo can be in the same build ;)

 

They've already dealt with that, I think.  Characters are Unique by name, and it is possible for there to be multiple cards with the same name.  However, you can still only have 3 copies of a card called Yoritomo in your deck.

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11 minutes ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

They've already dealt with that, I think.  Characters are Unique by name, and it is possible for there to be multiple cards with the same name.  However, you can still only have 3 copies of a card called Yoritomo in your deck.

Yeah they've dealt with this in Thrones already with duplicate versions of characters rules.

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If FFG keeps the same name, true to the LCG rules. 

IMO I think that more of the core Clans need  more balancing before adding another 8th Clan.

The current state of L5R LCG - Lion has the "pet" sub-theme, Crab the holding sub-theme, Dragon the multiple attachments sub-theme, and Unicorn the movement sub-theme.  These were also a part of the Mantis Clan identity: personalities with their own ability to have a pet follower, the more holdings with for example the keyword port mattered,  the more weapons or followers or personalities boosted their stats more so in their early days, and they had Naval which was like another Calvary-like mechanic in the old L5R.

Mantis Clan also had a ranged attack sub-theme which hasn't really been introduced yet.  

The Fate pool take is different, but then what about the Spider Clan or Naga or other potential factions?   There is only so much the LCG can give out that will continue to make all LCG Clans unique. 

Even L5R CCG had difficulties maintaining all these Clans, unaligned personalities and so on. 

 

 

 

 

Edited by sector3600
fixing

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16 minutes ago, sector3600 said:

If FFG keeps the same name, true to the LCG rules. 

IMO I think that more of the core Clans need  more balancing before adding another 8th Clan.

The current state of L5R LCG - Lion has the "pet" sub-theme, Crab the holding sub-theme, Dragon the multiple attachments sub-theme, and Unicorn the movement sub-theme.  These were also a part of the Mantis Clan identity: personalities with their own ability to have a pet follower, the more holdings with for example the keyword port mattered,  the more weapons or followers or personalities boosted their stats more so in their early days, and they had Naval which was like another Calvary-like mechanic in the old L5R.

Mantis Clan also had a ranged attack sub-theme which hasn't really been introduced yet.  

The Fate pool take is different, but then what about the Spider Clan or Naga or other potential factions?   There is only so much the LCG can give out that will continue to make all LCG Clans unique. 

Even L5R CCG had difficulties maintaining all these Clans, unaligned personalities and so on. 

 

 

 

 

Mantis initial theme was they had no distinct theme but were a mishmash of abilities.  If anything it was Economy as they were core set holdings built on chain gold (although so did Crane and to a lesser extent Crab since they had holdings that benefited from multiple holdings boosting off others) and the box was a trade honor for gold.  Each of the member clans had there own themes, with Mantis being followers and efficient cost to power ratio, Centipede being ranged Shugenja (admittedly they only had the one character but she did it well) and Wasp being Ranged characters.  The issue was that most of the sub clans only had one of two characters so determining what the sub themes were was tough initially.  Eventually as the character pool grew it further developed into the themes that they eventually settled into and when they did finally introduce the Naval Keyword it did a lot to establish the Mantis Theme. 

Mantis actually can fill one of the missing themes as they could become the raid economy burn faction to counter the Scorpion/Crane control fate store archetype.

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2 hours ago, Ishi Tonu said:

It doesn't matter what they were...................What Unicorn are now is the launching pad for some Gaijin Customs beatdown decks with some help from the Mantis.

Only thing more scary than a samurai on a horse, is a samurai on a horse on a boat.

"I'm on a boat, I'm on a boat
Everybody look at me 'cause I'm sailing on a boat."

"Unicorn 'music' gets more scandalous by the season."

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