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Admiral Deathrain

The vocal minority is an issue

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10 minutes ago, kris40k said:

You know, Blod, you aint helping the situation with that broad brush you keep painting with. You keep repeating yourself like it means something while being totally off-base.

You can not like Rian Johnson, Kathleen Kennedy, etc., without being a alt-right a-hole.

The easiest way to silence opinions you disagree with is to label the people with those opinions as something vehement. See racists, misogynists, deplorables, etc. It's a simple way to elevate themselves and their position in the same vein of virtue signalling which we see of a lot of in this thread.

Edited by McFoy

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17 minutes ago, McFoy said:

The easiest way to silence opinions you disagree with is to label the people with those opinions as something vehement. See racists, misogynists, deplorables, etc. It's a simple way to elevate themselves and their position in the same vein of virtue signalling which we see of a lot of in this thread.

Yea, you’re right there isn’t a sexist or racist backlash against Star Wars actors.

Kelly Marie Tran left insta because she just felt like it, not the daily spewing of racist and sexist threats and tirades that she had to manage. Totally makes sense. No problem here. 

 

Telling racists and racist-defenders to kindly shove off isn’t virtue-signaling. It’s honest to god negative feedback for people who NEED to have some negative feedback. 

Edited by TasteTheRainbow

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17 minutes ago, kris40k said:

You know, Blod, you aint helping the situation with that broad brush you keep painting with. You keep repeating yourself like it means something while being totally off-base.

You can not like Rian Johnson, Kathleen Kennedy, etc., without being a alt-right a-hole.

If this was just a one time thing, perhaps. 

But this isn't. This isn't even the first time in this fandom. But between gamergate, toxic/sad puppies, bring back legends, the reaction to makeminemilkshake....

Geek fandom has a problem. And dismissing it as merely a vocal minority allows them to continue to harrass and threaten and generally make their target's lives miserable. And it really isn't that hard to see why. The abused can often turn into the abuser. 

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19 minutes ago, Sithborg said:

If this was just a one time thing, perhaps. 

But this isn't. This isn't even the first time in this fandom. But between gamergate, toxic/sad puppies, bring back legends, the reaction to makeminemilkshake....

Geek fandom has a problem. And dismissing it as merely a vocal minority allows them to continue to harrass and threaten and generally make their target's lives miserable. And it really isn't that hard to see why. The abused can often turn into the abuser. 

Just saying, its not mutually exclusive to think that Trump is the worst thing to happen in US politics in recent years* and at the same time think Rian Johnson is the worst thing to happen to Star Wars in recent years**.

*relatively recent. There was that whole slavery thing, genocide of the Native Americans, Executive Order 9066, etc...

** Trioculus was pretty bad, The Christmas Special, Jumpmasters...

Edited by kris40k

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1 hour ago, kris40k said:

You know, Blod, you aint helping the situation with that broad brush you keep painting with. You keep repeating yourself like it means something while being totally off-base.

You can not like Rian Johnson, Kathleen Kennedy, etc., without being a alt-right a-hole.

True. But he deliberately used hyperbolic statements to get his point across. Consider #3: can Rian Johnson really ruin your childhood? Of course not! Your childhood is set, and nobody can change it (barring time travel, of course). Can you be disappointed in how he decided to treat the later years of Luke Skywalker? Sure, that's a natural feeling when things don't meet your expectations. But it's important to communicate those feelings with respect. Those who don't, have received the word "fandom", according to @BlodVargarna (which I don't agree with, because the last thing this world needs is more labels).

Edited by Parakitor

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13 minutes ago, Parakitor said:

True. But he deliberately used hyperbolic statements to get his point across. Consider #3: can Rian Johnson really ruin your childhood? Of course not! Your childhood is set, and nobody can change it (barring time travel, of course). Can you be disappointed in how he decided to treat the later years of Luke Skywalker? Sure, that's a natural feeling when things don't meet your expectations. But it's important to communicate those feelings with respect. Those who don't, have received the word "fandom", according to @BlodVargarna (which I don't agree with, because the last thing this world needs is more labels).

Yeah, you have a point there, but at this point, Blod is just trolling the forums

Quote

People who hate on Rose are generally incel baby-men.

Admiral Deathrain asks for respectful and mature criticisms, as you just did in the post I just quoted, and that's literally Blod's first post in the thread.

Not sure if this forum needs more of that behavior.

Edited by kris40k

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There is something really fishy about this whole situation. Firstly, and most importantly, why wasn't KMT given a social media manager by Disney to filter the crappy comments? Especially after what happened to Daisy Ridley. She's a major actor in one of their biggest franchises, yet Disney can't fork over a couple grand for an assistant to handle stuff like this? 

Secondly, Rian Johnson goes on Twitter just hours after the announcement but doesn't offer words of support or encouragement to KMT. Instead he immediately attacks the fans. Things were so bad for KMT that she had to quit Instagram yet Johnson, her director, never even mentioned her. 

Finally, while she left a cryptic comment, KMT never actually stated the reason why she deleted her Instagram. But this harassment narrative is accepted as fact. This looks to me like some fans are using KMT as a weapon to attack other fans. And that's just as bad as the original harassment IMO.

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36 minutes ago, Hedgehobbit said:

There is something really fishy about this whole situation. Firstly, and most importantly, why wasn't KMT given a social media manager by Disney to filter the crappy comments? Especially after what happened to Daisy Ridley. She's a major actor in one of their biggest franchises, yet Disney can't fork over a couple grand for an assistant to handle stuff like this? 

Secondly, Rian Johnson goes on Twitter just hours after the announcement but doesn't offer words of support or encouragement to KMT. Instead he immediately attacks the fans. Things were so bad for KMT that she had to quit Instagram yet Johnson, her director, never even mentioned her. 

Finally, while she left a cryptic comment, KMT never actually stated the reason why she deleted her Instagram. But this harassment narrative is accepted as fact. This looks to me like some fans are using KMT as a weapon to attack other fans. And that's just as bad as the original harassment IMO.

Rian Johnson has a history of bashing SW fans on twitter. (whether it was justified or not)

Although on the other hand she wouldn't delete all of her stuff for no reason.

This seems very similar to the whole Jake Llyod debacle. (We have the best fans, but we also have the worst fans)

Edited by FlyingAnchors

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41 minutes ago, Hedgehobbit said:

There is something really fishy about this whole situation. Firstly, and most importantly, why wasn't KMT given a social media manager by Disney to filter the crappy comments? Especially after what happened to Daisy Ridley. She's a major actor in one of their biggest franchises, yet Disney can't fork over a couple grand for an assistant to handle stuff like this? 

Secondly, Rian Johnson goes on Twitter just hours after the announcement but doesn't offer words of support or encouragement to KMT. Instead he immediately attacks the fans. Things were so bad for KMT that she had to quit Instagram yet Johnson, her director, never even mentioned her. 

Finally, while she left a cryptic comment, KMT never actually stated the reason why she deleted her Instagram. But this harassment narrative is accepted as fact. This looks to me like some fans are using KMT as a weapon to attack other fans. And that's just as bad as the original harassment IMO.

Oh my God, you’re right! The harassers are the real victims here!

Yet another evil plan by Disney against the fans!

Edited by Red Castle

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8 hours ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

Just today Kelly Marie Tran deleted her instagram accounts content (like Daisey Ridley before her) due to the abuse she received from certain elements from the star wars fandom (that now celebrate that they 'accomplished something'). No matter what your stance on TLJ and Rose as a character is, this behaviour isn't acceptable and makes the entire star wars fandom look like a club of bullies.

If you want to critisize the new star wars movies, please do so, but do it respectfully and in a mature way. Also maybe take a more in depth look at the people you are rallying towards.

Not just SW fans I'm afraid... Also proof that people are getting dumber. Back in my day we knew a character wasn't teh same as the actor.

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5 hours ago, Hobojebus said:

clan wolf is best of the clans in battletech

Space wolves are the best space marines

Clan Diamond Shark! (Ok Wolf is probably better, but come on, Diamond Shark! that sounds awesome!)

Dog of Russ! You barbarians will burn for what you did to Prospero! Hail Magnus!

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12 minutes ago, Captain Lackwit said:

...Wow.

I...

I really hate Star Wars fans sometimes. I just want to remind you guys of Jake Lloyd.

Can we stop being such a horrible fanbase?

Unfortunately, the Star wars fan base is comprised almost entirely of humans. Humans are horrible so the fan base is horrible.

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1 hour ago, Hobojebus said:

Does no one think it suspicious this comes out after solo drops 77% in cinemas and it comes out it's lost at least 50 million but more likely 80million plus.

Seems highly coincidental to me.

But of course! It all makes sense! It’s actually Disney’s employees that have been harassing Kelly with sexist and racist messages so that if Solo’s sales droped, they could force her to shut down her instagram to get some sympathy and suddenly everyone will go see Solo out of sympathy! Thanks for opening my eyes Hobo, I was so blind...

Watch out Disney! The fans are onto you and your evil SJW plot!

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7 hours ago, Frimmel said:

Yes, you did. Right here: 

I'm wrong for thinking I shouldn't be tarred with the same brush as those who've harassed Ms. Tarn. We can only criticize TLJ "respectfully." And you are no doubt the arbiter of what is and isn't respectful? 

Methinks he doth protest too much...

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10 hours ago, McFoy said:

The easiest way to silence opinions you disagree with is to label the people with those opinions as something vehement. See racists, misogynists, deplorables, etc. It's a simple way to elevate themselves and their position in the same vein of virtue signalling which we see of a lot of in this thread.

Don't forget SJW, cuck, snowflakes...both sides burry themselves in buzzwords that through their thoughtless use have become meaningless. The extremists reflect badly on us and I want them to go away, because they do not in any way represent the star wars community I experienced around here and in real life.

The community has room for people who hate movies from the franchise, in fact that is one of its defining features. You are free to hate the sequels or the prequels, even the OT, and you are free to express that. What this community doesn't have room for are bullies with pea-sized egos that feel the need to output so much hate on to individual actors (Jake Lloyd was just a kid ffs). KMT is just another case of a series that shouldn't have started in the first place.

This thread is not about telling people to go out and become cringeworthy bullyhunters. It is just highlighting an issue and asking those who cause it to get lost.

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13 hours ago, TasteTheRainbow said:

Harassing and threatening female actors is the issue. And that behavior is not just tolerated, but encouraged, in a lot of places on the Internet where Star Wars fans congregate. 

Female actors can have supposedly bad writing or bad acting in other fandoms that are just as large without waking up to thousands of harassing comments  and threats daily. The Star Wars fandom has a sickness. And you can’t fix those by denying them.

Harassing any actor based on stuff their character does is an issue.

It's a dark mirror to creepily-obsessed-fan, and it's no less poisonous for the individual involved.

Jake Lloyd ('Young Anakin') is, as noted, by @kris40k, another perfect example. He's had enough abuse to massively mess up his life and psyche, even in a very early social media era.

Kid was TEN when he played Anakin.

  • You can argue (and I would) that putting Anakin that early in his life into the story was a mistake.
    • That's an issue with the script writing; it's not like he made up his scenes himself.
    • I can tell you with pretty good confidence that a ten-year-old kid was not the major scriptwriter for a $115 Million movie.
  • You can argue that his performance wasn't especially dramatic.
    • This is an issue with either the casting (if you feel Jake wasn't up to the job) or the direction (If you feel he was but wasn't used well enough).
    • There are a lot of very well know, very successful actors in Episode I and frankly all of them are playing planks of wood.
    • Equally Jingle All The Way is a truly awful film, but  Jake Lloyd wasn't bad in it, so I suspect was direction is the thing at fault.

 

Kelly Marie Tran is a similar case. I don't think Rose's character really adds much to the story that makes sense, her behaviour and presence doesn't make a lot of sense, and makes some weird decisions as a character. But that's an issue I have with Rian Johnson and his scriptwriters, not Kelly (who did a decent job of delivering her part of a half-baked story).

 

 

Short Version:

  1. By all means dislike a character. That's what (in some cases) they're there for. 
  2. There is no excuse for letting that dislike 'splash' onto the actress or actor responsible for that character.
  3. Equally, don't blame an actor for stuff they don't control (such as script- or story-writing unless you know they were involved in same).
  4. Regardless of what offences you may have considered them to commit, there is no excuse for flinging poo monkey-fashion at them on social media, and no excuse whatsoever for threats and aggression, electronic, postal, real, whatever.

 

 

Edited by Magnus Grendel

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8 hours ago, Red Castle said:

But of course! It all makes sense! It’s actually Disney’s employees that have been harassing Kelly with sexist and racist messages so that if Solo’s sales droped, they could force her to shut down her instagram to get some sympathy and suddenly everyone will go see Solo out of sympathy! Thanks for opening my eyes Hobo, I was so blind...

Watch out Disney! The fans are onto you and your evil SJW plot!

You mock but it's been six months of this but apparently it only got too much now? As People have pointed out daisy did the same but we never heard about it.

People put a lot of stock in victim hood these days.

Happens on campus too someone spray paints something offensive, turns out to be the "victim" themselves.

Disney didn't send this stuff but do you really think studio execs are above using it to try and change the narrative?

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45 minutes ago, Magnus Grendel said:

You can argue that his performance wasn't especially dramatic.

  • This is an issue with either the casting (if you feel Jake wasn't up to the job) or the direction (If you feel he was but wasn't used well enough).
  • There are a lot of very well know, very successful actors in Episode I and frankly all of them are playing planks of wood.
  • Equally Jingle All The Way is a truly awful film, but  Jake Lloyd wasn't bad in it, so I suspect was direction is the thing at fault. 

 

Jake Lloyd was a decent child actor. Child actors have their limitations, though (obviously) and need extremely good direction to shine, and he wasn't provided with that. That isn't too bad if the child actor is only featured lightly, but that isn't what happened in TPM. Would Llloyd have gone on to become a hollywood staple without getting the hate piled on to him? Probably not, child actors rarely make that jump, but he didn't even get the chance to try.

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15 hours ago, Forgottenlore said:

Not making fun of people who ARE trying to stop them. Speaking out when the subject comes up on forums you DO frequent to say such behavior is unacceptable and not welcome there. Basically, express support for those opposed to such behavior instead of normalizing and enabling it. 

This is a perfect (if comparatively minor) example of the whole  “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” Thing. Don’t do nothing. 

Odin, forbid my cajoling dissuade some valiant keyboard warrior from going out and fighting Evil. Assuredly such individuals backed off by a bit of needling would strike fear in any online harasser. I will forthwith cease such mockery so as not to diminish the number of  those stamping out the evils of online harassment. Sally forth and with the strength of your rhetoric end this vileness!  

 

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2 hours ago, Hobojebus said:

You mock but it's been six months of this but apparently it only got too much now? As People have pointed out daisy did the same but we never heard about it.

Maybe, just maybe, she's not as thin-skin as Frimmel suggested earlier and she tried to endure it at first; harassment from stupid fans coming with being a celebrity I guess. Maybe she thought that once Solo would release, angry fans would finally leave her alone and move on to hate Solo instead, so she endured until now only to see that nope, they are effectively relentless. There is only so much free hate a human can endure, we all try to ignore it at first, but we all have our limit, maybe she finally reached her limit. 

But hey, if you prefer to ignore the harassment problem and think it's all a Disney conspiration to try to boost Solo's sales, you go ahead. I'm not even sure why I bothered answering to you in the first place.

As for Daisy, she made a post against gun's violence and was received with heinous response. She decided that social media was not for her. It was not constant harassment like Kelly or Jake was victim's of, so maybe that's why we never really heard about it.

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4 hours ago, Red Castle said:

But hey, if you prefer to ignore the harassment problem and think it's all a Disney conspiration to try to boost Solo's sales, you go ahead. I'm not even sure why I bothered answering to you in the first place.

Fun fact I cared so little about rose tico I didn't know the actresses name until yesterday, I have no dog in this race, I haven't sent her hate but I also feel zero inclination towards defending this grown woman.

Dopamine addiction isn't one of my vices I don't spend all day every day looking for something to be offended about.

I don't drink coffee for the same reason.

Conspiracy theories about the mouse on the other hand I do find entertaining.

 

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On 6/5/2018 at 6:55 AM, Admiral Deathrain said:

I'd rather not, I prefer my view on humanity not totaly jaded. Anyone who participates in this invalidates any weight their opinion may have carried.

Well my view on Humanity is already ruined, but then I realize that "Hey, I am also in that group".

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11 hours ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

Don't forget SJW, cuck, snowflakes...both sides burry themselves in buzzwords that through their thoughtless use have become meaningless. The extremists reflect badly on us and I want them to go away, because they do not in any way represent the star wars community I experienced around here and in real life.

The community has room for people who hate movies from the franchise, in fact that is one of its defining features. You are free to hate the sequels or the prequels, even the OT, and you are free to express that. What this community doesn't have room for are bullies with pea-sized egos that feel the need to output so much hate on to individual actors (Jake Lloyd was just a kid ffs). KMT is just another case of a series that shouldn't have started in the first place.

This thread is not about telling people to go out and become cringeworthy bullyhunters. It is just highlighting an issue and asking those who cause it to get lost.

I did say in a later post that I should have included slurs aimed at the left as well there. That post has since been reported and removed for questionable reasons (I understand why, I just don't particularly agree with it). I don't condone the attacks but I don't especially care either. Celebrities on social media should anticipate some harassment, that's just how it works since throwing rotting vegetables is assault now in most places. Granted some is not what KMT has been receiving as I've gathered from this thread.

Edited by McFoy

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