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First Order and Empire ship archetypes

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Now that FO and Empire are different factions, there is a lot of "design space" for FO , and some new holes to fill for Empire as well

 

Empire                   First Order

Tie/In ---------------  Tie/FO

Tie Bomber--------   ?

Tie Advanced ------- Tie /SF ?

Tie Adv. prototype --- ?

Tie Interceptor   ----------?

Tie Defender -------------- Tie Silencer ?

Lambda Shuttle ---------- Batwing

Decimator -------------------   ?

Tie Phantom ----------------  ?

Starwing --------------------- ? 

Tie Aggresor ---------------? 

Tie Punisher -------------------? 

Tie Striker -------------------- ?

Tie Reaper -------------------- ? 

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I doubt that there will be an exact 1:1 match. However, I believe the FO will have some new options in the next year or two, based on the new Resistance era cartoon Disney is putting out. Maybe episode 9 will yield some new content too.

We saw in TLJ an arms dealer selling old empire tech (specifically the interceptor) - it is possible we may see a couple of imperial ships refitted into the first order with minor tweaks. 

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  • The TIE Silencer is actually more like an updated TIE Advanced in a lot of ways. It's shields are more like the advanced - worse than the older defender, in fact.
    • In game terms, it falls somewhere between a 'super' version of the Advanced and the Interceptor. The Defender (especially the TIE/x7) wants to do 'straight line' engagements  - a predictable head-on pass with a silencer won't do you anywhere near enough good compared to its cost.
  • The TIE/sf is...I dunno. In game terms, I'll agree the TIE/advanced.
    • In background, somewhere between the Advanced and a turret-less Aggressor.
    • It's short-range hyperdrive also means it's the Alpha-class equivalent; a ship capable of independent recon and short-ranged strike with ordnance as a force multiplier.
  • The TIE Advanced Prototype - I wouldn't expect to see a first order version. After all, it's a prototype 'better TIE fighter' - its direct production successor was the 'proper' TIE advanced.
  • TIE Bomber - a First Order bomber was mentioned around The Last Jedi and it wouldn't be too big a challenge to create. I wouldn't necessarily expect to see a Punisher equivalent as well so much as one ship covering both. Equally, with the striker becoming a 'light bomber' it might cover that role too, especially with the TIE/fo clearly being up to atmospheric combat (Takodana, Starkiller).
  • The TIE Defender - maybe?
  • The TIE Phantom - unless some serious re-writing is done, cloaking has extremely limited mentions. Without the cloak, it's not really a TIE phantom.

 

 

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I’ve been glad to see FFG use 2.0 as an opportunity to make XWM ships closer to their movie/book specs. I hope Disney is more forthcoming about info for new ships so this is less of an issue moving forward. 

In TFA, Poe notes that the stolen SF “really moves.”  I hope SF 2.0 reflects this...linked boost perhaps?

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6 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

I really don't care for a "really moves" SF

The ship is great and really stands out as a heavy weapons platform with a nice auxiliary arc mechanic that really defines how it flies

Could be that Poe was surprised such a heavily armed fighter could move as fast as it does in X-wing (just 1 speed slower than an F/O w/sloops is still great for a dual-arc ship with missiles).

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17 hours ago, impspy said:

Could be that Poe was surprised such a heavily armed fighter could move as fast as it does in X-wing (just 1 speed slower than an F/O w/sloops is still great for a dual-arc ship with missiles).

The problem with that view (which makes sense) is the new-canon Black Squadron comics, which shows Black Squadron (specifically Jess & Snap) strugging* with how fast the things are in comparison with their T-70s - including Jess' T-70 which is specifically tuned up for straight-line speed.

In short, the TIE/sf should be faster than the T-70 in background terms.

In game terms, I'd suggest giving the thing a [red] straight 5 and leaving it at that. Technically that makes it faster, from a certain point of view, without messing with the essential in-game function of the ship.

A more significant question - if Lightweight Frame has gone the way of the dodo - is whether the TIE/sf is going to be upped to a base agility of 3 or sticking at 2 like the striker. Lightweight Frame or Guidance Chips is one of the major design decisions with Quickdraw (one of the most popular pilots in the game) at the moment, after all.

 

* There's a cliff and canyon rock formation. Things are exploding. There's an egg, a flying monster, and some monks. It's a long story.

Edited by Magnus Grendel

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2 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

A more significant question - if Lightweight Frame has gone the way of the dodo - is whether the TIE/sf is going to be upped to a base agility of 3 or sticking at 2 like the striker. Lightweight Frame or Guidance Chips is one of the major design decisions with Quickdraw (one of the most popular pilots in the game) at the moment, after all.

I imagine - like the Bomber, Aggressor and Striker - it will be sticking at 2.  After all, offence has been toned down in 2nd Edition from what we've seen before, so the pseudo-3-dice is nowhere near as necessary.

I'm guessing the title will be integrated on the ship card with printed 3 front/2 rear arcs.

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1 minute ago, FTS Gecko said:

I imagine - like the Bomber, Aggressor and Striker - it will be sticking at 2.  After all, offence has been toned down in 2nd Edition from what we've seen before, so the pseudo-3-dice is nowhere near as necessary.

I'm guessing the title will be integrated on the ship card with printed 3 front/2 rear arcs.

It will help distinguish it from the Silencer, too - the TIE/sf is essentially the closest thing at the moment to a 'first order bomber' (in missile terms, anyway).

Of course, given that they can 'tweak' slots at will, and given that Kylo's Vanguard is one of the few ships in the entire SW canon we see actually fire missiles on the screen, you might well see the silencer pick up ordnance slots too.

 

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Please make this baby here happen! something between A-wing and Interceptor, but i find it hard to distinguish a hole different ship out of it. Maybe something to paint targets for the artillery named Tie/SF. So a quick and dirty arcdodger with only 2 attack dice but the ability to tractor or ion something without doing damage.

 

 

tie_sfi___schematic_by_ravendeviant-dagt

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Thinking about the comparison, I'm actually quite happy to notice that I'd put a question mark behind many if not all of those comparisons. Sure, they might be different in 2.0, but in the current system, there are no true 1:1 design space overlaps.

The /fo as a frame is a lesser swarm ship, but a better filler than the /ln, since its synergies with other copies of itself is worse, the point cost is just a little too high for the classic builds and of course it's just better on its own since it brought all these upgrades. 

The Upsilon is a  very potent and surprisingly maneuverable attack craft- and too expensive to just slot in ships you'd use with a space cow. It's behaviour on the battlefield is much less passive as well. It feels as if it's almost precisely in the middle between the Lambda and the Ghost in terms of design space.

The /sf is a weird transmutation of the concept behind the TiE/D card on a bomber-like frame that still fills the aces role in most lists.

The silencer somehow looks on paper exactly like his canon backstory of combining Interceptor and Advanced, but can often feel much rather like someone mixed the x7-Defender and Echo instead, depending on the build.

Sure, most of these points are extremely subjective. But it certainly makes me appreciate the uniqueness of the First Order ships quite a bit, which I hope translates unharmed to their own faction in 2.0. Should be fun to see where they're headed.

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4 hours ago, DampfGecko said:

The silencer somehow looks on paper exactly like his canon backstory of combining Interceptor and Advanced, but can often feel much rather like someone mixed the x7-Defender and Echo instead, depending on the build.=

This makes a lot of sense to me. There is an argument to be made that the Empire was way too spread out in terms of their various "advanced" fighter projects overlapping too much in their roles and capabilities. Maybe FO learned from that.

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The xi class shuttle (what Finn and Rose escsape on) could be the equivalent to the TIE Reaper.

Something I've thought of is with Darth Vader’s crew ability being changed, they could give the old to Kylo crew, of a self damaging variant, as it would be very thematic.  

Edited by That Blasted Samophlange

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7 hours ago, Taiowaa said:

Please make this baby here happen! something between A-wing and Interceptor, but i find it hard to distinguish a hole different ship out of it. Maybe something to paint targets for the artillery named Tie/SF. So a quick and dirty arcdodger with only 2 attack dice but the ability to tractor or ion something without doing damage.

 

 

tie_sfi___schematic_by_ravendeviant-dagt

I'm sure the Strikers are really proud of their child

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The Tie Silencer is a combo between Tie Advanced  and Tie Interceptor (which is what the old EU Tie Avenger was, they look similar too). So it covers a couple niches.

The main holes I see in the FO line up are ordnance/bombs and turrets.

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