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Dengar5

Scum got nerfed hard

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33 minutes ago, madquest8 said:

 

The unboxing served only one purpose. It's 1.0 for life now. EVERYTHING has been nerfed to OBLIVION. So utterly disappointing, every ship you loved is destroyed. All the fun extracted from the game AND they want you to pay for the privilege of playing with wrecked ships. I feel sorry for anyone who buys into 2.0

I know you hate 2.0.... i think everyone does.

 

 

1 hour ago, Dengar5 said:

StarVipers thankfully keep their 1 bank barrel rolls & gain blue 2 banks... but there are many many downers for Scum today.

  • Jumpmaster major nerf, single arc turret, NO WHITE RIGHT TURNS, best actions are red, Shadow Caster title only adds die in primary arc & removes crew slot, the only worse dial is lambda
  • ShadowCaster major nerf, 2-attack mobile arc & the only flip maneuver is still 5 k-turn
  • These ships are now effectively front arc only ships!
  1. G1-A dial gets even worse!, in addition to medium base disadvantage
  2. Scurrg dial is nerfed, in addition to medium base disadvantage, + red barrel roll, doesn't have reload action like ALL the other bombers
  3. Kimogila medium base disadvantage, + red barrel roll
  4. M3-A Interceptor nerf, losing the blue 2-banks to gain 5 straight is a bad trade, ion cannon is nerfed, no light scyk option
  5. TalonBane Cobra nerf, I5 instead of expected I6, no linked actions
  6. Guri is nerfed because calculate < focus, but will be MORE expensive because I5
  7. Dace Bonearm pilot ability doesn't do damage & only affects medium & large ships
  8. Asajj pilot ability nerfed
  9. Jabba the Hutt crew is still terrible & Dengar crew is terrible
  10. No good crew, therefore Bossk is terrible ?
  11. Scum has no support options which Rebels & now Imperials get tons of

Why do Rebels get TWO 4-attack turret ships? Why does the defender get another shield? It is now way better than IG-88. The U-wing is better than most Scum medium base ships. X-wing > Kihraxz. Dash doesn't have a donut hole anymore. At least Miranda is nerfed into obscurity. Don't worry regen fanatics, Norra Wexley with R2-D2 will take over that position.

 

So much wrong with this

-G1-A Dial got boosted not nerfed - Added 0 move in exchange for making 4 straight red (yes please!), moved 3k to 2k (you you have 4k and 2k way more flexibility then 4k and 3k)
-Scurrg Dial got boosted not nerfed - Made 1 banks blue,  at the cost of 3 straight blue (so added 2 blues for the cost of 1 blue removed).... WTF ARE YOU SMOKING.
-Kimogila Dial was boosted - 2 hards are now white instead of red (straight up buff)
-M3A Dial saw a slight nerf in losing the 2 bank blues for a 5 straight but its really not that bad a trade 5 straight is very powerful
-TalonBane Cobra was hella buffed - his abilities now apply to everything not just stuff with range bonuses... so missile fire at range 3 at him? he gets +1 die for that in 2.0 YAY
-Guri got a buff along with all the starvipers to their dials a very massive buff - the 2 banks being blue now is so important it highly enables guri to do her linked actions to get to range have a focus and a calculate and then have the blue maneuvers next turn to clear the stress. Guri's huge weakness in 1.0 was her green manovuers making PTL a death sentence,  now with 2 banks blue you can use the extremely strong linked actions she has to be nicely mod stacked. Very pumped for Guri.
- Dace? really with the massive buffs to the hawk you are complaining about dace? wtf. lol, yep the ability is different on a 100% new ship thats way better then 1.0
-Asajj ability may have gotten slightly worse, but 2 force tokens is awesome she is going to be a beast even if she had no ability.... asaj is buffed with those force tokens that's for sure. "they nerfed her ability slightly lets just ignore the massive buff to her in the form of force tokens..... do do do) Her turret is nerfed, like all turrets in 2.0 oh noes how will scum compete.
-Dengar's ability is completely different and its pretty good this all comes down to cost. 
-Jaba is changed and slightly buffed as you can recharge the same ships thing 4x times instead of requiring a swarm of illicit to justify, they fixed what made him suck before and you complain?
-We have not seen all the crew yet so that statement is just trolling and Maul is fantastic.
-IG-88A can act as support for all droid ships pretty cool. so they have at least on support, tractor is changed so you can easily move your own ships where you want them.

-Rebels have 1x 4 dice turret (the ghost got hit way hard by the nerf hammer) and the yt-2400 is a gimped up 4 dice turret (still really good)
-The ig's are amazing double calculate is really strong so they saw a slight boost.

And you ignored things like the firespray that got buffed to the moon and back. 

Like all factions some buffs some nerfs.... but your list of nerfs is mostly just false if not misinformed or showcases your lack of understanding of the game.

I think you are just trolling to be honest but had to answer for those that read it and take your word for these things.

 

Edited by Icelom

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5 minutes ago, Dengar5 said:

The changes to the hwk appear okay, but the pilot abilities requiring arc is a major hit.

The defender retained X7 in this vastly lower attack power game. They are by far the most defensive ship in 2.0. Even if they're so expensive that you can only field 2 with limited upgrades, they will wreck most 2.0 ships. People keep saying 2 attack will be enough now. Not if half the meta is defenders and Norra Wexley with R2D2.

Let's ignore how nora was nerfed and R2-D2 was mega nerfed then? 

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7 minutes ago, thebrettski said:

How is the medium base a disadvantage?  It makes the firespray more nimble, the G1A more in-your-face, and the Kimogila fits the midsize bomber role that the punisher and K fill for our friends.  

Y'all keep missing the forest for the trees.

In 1.0 large base ships got a discount for being on a large base. They are easy to block. They fly poorly in asteroid fields. Their turns are MUCH bigger so they have to avoid corners. In 2.0 bullseye arc is a thing. Large base is an advantage only with boost & the falcon is the only one with that now.

At least the firespray & IG-88 are medium base now. I'm not fretting about those ships.

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1 minute ago, Dengar5 said:

The changes to the hwk appear okay, but the pilot abilities requiring arc is a major hit.

Maybe for rebels. For scum it’s likely it won’t matter that much since you’ll be rotating your arc to be able to shoot anyway. And with moldy crow you’ll have 2 arcs to pick from. 

1 minute ago, Dengar5 said:

The defender retained X7 in this vastly lower attack power game. They are by far the most defensive ship in 2.0. Even if they're so expensive that you can only field 2 with limited upgrades, they will wreck most 2.0 ships. People keep saying 2 attack will be enough now. Not if half the meta is defenders and Norra Wexley with R2D2.

If all you have is 2 defenders (no palp like the 1e version), a tie swarm could well actually push some damage through

Just now, skotothalamos said:

Scum has always been about the shenanigans you can pull with crew, mech, and illicit combos. Show me 1.0 Assaj without Latts and Glitterstim and I'm bored.

I ran her with ID, burnout slam and tactician. Worked quite well. 

Just now, skotothalamos said:

Show me a 1.0 Jumpmaster without Deadeye/R4/K4/Guidance Chips/Zuckuss/etc and I don't care. We have way too little data to make any assessments yet.

Also has lots of viable builds. Bumpmasters are great. Titled scout is actuallly quite effective as well. 

2 minutes ago, falveryn said:

G1-A: 4-Lom is a bit better, the others worse.

Hard to say when we haven’t actually SEEN them. Or know point costs. 

2 minutes ago, falveryn said:

Kimo: It was sluggish and increasing its size makes it worse. Agreed.


Makes it faster  

2 minutes ago, falveryn said:


Bad Stuff: Most scum and imperial generics

There’s literally no way to actually make that generalization accurately. They’ve said you’re going to pay more of a premium for higher initiative/unique pilots than you did one 1e. All that prevents a generic from being good is cost relative to other options. If they’re coated cheap enough they’ll be good. If they’re too expensive (like almost all 1e scum generics) they’ll be bad. And if they’re too good or too bad, they can have points adjusted easily.

 

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Just now, Dengar5 said:

The defender retained X7 in this vastly lower attack power game. They are by far the most defensive ship in 2.0. Even if they're so expensive that you can only field 2 with limited upgrades, they will wreck most 2.0 ships. People keep saying 2 attack will be enough now. Not if half the meta is defenders and Norra Wexley with R2D2.

The defender now MUST equip a shield upgrade and old engine upgrade. It will obviously cost more. Unlikely to fit 3 generics in a squad, more likely just 2 nameds. They are NOT the most defensive ships in 2.0. With only 2 defenders, it is very unlikely they will wreck most 2.0 ships. Any ship below will give them a run for their money (more defensive, and higher ps for arc dodging, given how defenders historically have had low ps)

The most defensive ships are: Soontir, Grand Inq, Vader (but weak on offense and bad actions, really needed a boost action, but can still token stack), Guri, IG's B/C combo. Luke is far more defensive than Norra. Remember evades now just change a result. Luke basically gets the same if there is at least one eyeball, for free, no other requirements. Han Solo and the new Falcon title are also very good, even with only 1 agility, given you can almost always guarantee 1 evade, which is worth almost 3 unmodded greens. Now, Norra assures you have 1 evade + your regular roll, but the problem is that the ship is not very maneuverable, and has not max ps. So the mentioned ships are still better in most cases.

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1 hour ago, piznit said:

FWIW, Dace effects small base ships too :)

 

and waiting to to see the points cost, but I wouldn't call Guri a nerf.  She can get calculate and focus from her ability, along with linked actions and at In5.  Looking forward to Guri

Guri, palob, and Zuckuss still seems like a fun build.

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10 minutes ago, Icelom said:

Let's ignore how nora was nerfed and R2-D2 was mega nerfed then? 

Many things in 2.0 are wonderful, like the nerf to R2-D2. But Norra Wexley's new ability is very good as there are few strong defensive abilities. Her's is the only instance of "adding evade results" that I know of in 2.0. Evade tokens don't even add results anymore. Norra Wexley has actionless 1.0 reinforce with an enemy at range 1, much powerful

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Regardless of how good or bad 2.0 is people will still complain. The Devs cannot make everyone happy. You might want to wait until the game is released before telling everybody how bad it is.

Go back through the threads. From what little I know about 2e, the Devs addressed most of the complaints about the game. Nym/Miranda, turret wing, TLTs, token stacking, ship costs etc., etc., etc..

Reading these new threads is a lot like reading the old threads with one major difference. The start date. Where the old threads bemoaned the fact a ship was too strong the complaint now is they are worthless. 

Maybe FFG should have kept the first edition and did away with all the Organised Play. Seems to me to be a better fix. 

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Just now, Dengar5 said:

Many things in 2.0 are wonderful, like the nerf to R2-D2. But Norra Wexley's new ability is very good as there are few strong defensive abilities. Her's is the only instance of "adding evade results" that I know of in 2.0. Evade tokens don't even add results anymore. Norra Wexley has actionless 1.0 reinforce with an enemy at range 1, much powerful

It is very powerful, but remember it is not max ps and the ship itself is not that nimble, so it is hard to trigger it (it is somewhat conditional, not as bad as krennic, but not as good as luke).

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5 minutes ago, Stoneface said:

Maybe FFG should have kept the first edition and did away with all the Organised Play. Seems to me to be a better fix. 

This is a fair statement and I agree OP is the real cancer of this game, always has been. I do think 2.0 eventually would have happened regardless though.

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17 minutes ago, Icelom said:

-G1-A Dial got boosted not nerfed - Added 0 move in exchange for making 4 straight red (yes please!), moved 3k to 2k (you you have 4k and 2k way more flexibility then 4k and 3k)

-Scurrg Dial got boosted not nerfed - Made 1 banks blue,  at the cost of 3 straight blue (so added 2 blues for the cost of 1 blue removed).... WTF ARE YOU SMOKING.
-Kimogila Dial was boosted - 2 hards are now white instead of red (straight up buff)
-TalonBane Cobra was hella buffed - his abilities now apply to everything not just stuff with range bonuses... so missile fire at range 3 at him? he gets +1 die for that in 2.0 YAY
And you ignored things like the firespray that got buffed to the moon and back. 
 

I like your thorough response. Yes, I ignored the many things I like in 2.0 in my original post. Boba Fett is now perfect for instance.

  • The G1-A dial is worse because it loses a 3-straight blue maneuver & everything good in 2.0 gives you stress. Losing the white 4 straight is painful. Full stop is nice, but it's red.
  • The Scurrg traded 2 bank blues for 1 bank blues. 2 banks are the superior maneuver. It too lost the important 3-straight blue to clear ships & clear stress.
  • The Kimogila did gain white 2 turns, but it is now medium base. This is a wash. I never protested about its new dial.
  • Talonbane was useful because he was a PS9 glass canon. 1 extra green dice at range 3 is worth very little. Dash will still probably kill him in 2 shots at range 3.

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1 hour ago, madquest8 said:

The unboxing served only one purpose. It's 1.0 for life now. EVERYTHING has been nerfed to OBLIVION. So utterly disappointing, every ship you loved is destroyed. All the fun extracted from the game AND they want you to pay for the privilege of playing with wrecked ships. I feel sorry for anyone who buys into 2.0

Your ships, maybe. My Defenders are looking sexier than ever.

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26 minutes ago, VanderLegion said:

I ran her with ID, burnout slam and tactician. Worked quite well. 

Asajj definitely worked with builds other than the standard. Inertial Dampeners has been spoiled & it's mostly worthless now. It requires you to SPEND A SHIELD to full stop & you still receive stress. Tactician likely doesn't exist anymore. Stress affects appear to be highly limited in 2.0, which is a good thing. Hopefully burnout SLAM is still around and isn't limited to large ships now.

Even with force, Asajj is dead because of that 2-attack mobile arc.

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1 hour ago, madquest8 said:

 

The unboxing served only one purpose. It's 1.0 for life now. EVERYTHING has been nerfed to OBLIVION. So utterly disappointing, every ship you loved is destroyed. All the fun extracted from the game AND they want you to pay for the privilege of playing with wrecked ships. I feel sorry for anyone who buys into 2.0

You sound like someone I would really enjoy not having a beer with 

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5 minutes ago, DR4CO said:

Your ships, maybe. My Defenders are looking sexier than ever.

Those Defenders are the most obviously broken ship so far in 2.0. Now they can arc dodge with boost! Or laugh when Dengar gets a single unmodified 2 dice attack against them. Most ships got readjusted shield hull ratios, the defender was readjusted backwards. Meanwhile StarVipers been eating crits since 1.0

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1 hour ago, madquest8 said:

 

The unboxing served only one purpose. It's 1.0 for life now. EVERYTHING has been nerfed to OBLIVION. So utterly disappointing, every ship you loved is destroyed. All the fun extracted from the game AND they want you to pay for the privilege of playing with wrecked ships. I feel sorry for anyone who buys into 2.0

Don’t feel sorry. There seems to be a good number of us who are jumping in with full enthusiasm.

Like my fellow HWK pilots have pointed out, it makes your assertion that everything has been nerfed ring hollow, and that’s just one example. 

You might consider every ship you love nerfed into oblivion, but I’ll take the buffed ships I love (such as the HWK, the Defender, the Firespray, the E-Wing, the StarViper, to just name a few) and have a fun time with 2.0.

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What's with all that whining? I feel sorry for you... Just wait and see how the points turn out to be. Before that it's just crying over change. Change always happens. 

I am looking forward to a whole new game, with new stuff to explore, plus the bonus that I already know most of the rules

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1 hour ago, VanderLegion said:

We’ll see about the loss of light scyk. I pretty much only played linked battery Sunny since LB came out. Doubt linked battery returns, and we don’t know about sunny yet. 

Yeah, I fear this little combo isn’t making the edition jump. She’s been a staple of many of my Scum lists lately and I shall miss it. Gonna add her to the good bye tour and keep the build on hand for my throwback lists.

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Hwk is freakin awesome now. Moldy crow is a super adv optics, letting palob BOOST into range 1-2. Or better yet, jam one ships focus and steal anothers. That is fenn rau w/ HSCP type of denial for two ships.

The jumpmaster can still equip expert handling for white barrel rolls?, and r4 astro for green 1 and 2 maneuvers? I think Dengar will be fine.

Fenn Rau is still Fenn Rau.

Asajj is pretty **** good. Force powers allow her a lot of options.

Medium bases like brobots and firesprays can equip cloaking device now with 2 charges. 

Speaking of Firespray, Boba w/ Slave I may be the best **** ship in the game (depending on his price).

Scum looks good.

EDIT: Forgot starvipers! Every viper has PTL equipped pretty much. That dude who made top8 at system open with three PTL vipers, remember him? All he did was 1 speeds with a focus b-roll or boost with PTL equipped. Now, you get PTL included, leaving talent slot wide open and have 2 banks that are blue. That curved b-roll is so powerful. Gonna be great!

Edited by wurms

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5 minutes ago, wurms said:

Hwk is freakin awesome now. Moldy crow is a super adv optics, letting palob BOOST into range 1-2. Or better yet, jam one ships focus and steal anothers. That is fenn rau w/ HSCP type of denial for two ships.

The jumpmaster can still equip expert handling for white barrel rolls?, and r4 astro for green 1 and 2 maneuvers? I think Dengar will be fine.

Fenn Rau is still Fenn Rau.

Asajj is pretty **** good. Force powers allow her a lot of options.

Medium bases like brobots and firesprays can equip cloaking device now with 2 charges. 

Speaking of Firespray, Boba w/ Slave I may be the best **** ship in the game (depending on his price).

Scum looks good.

Boba looks so good, I'm beginning to feel disappointed for him leaving the Empire's services. And I don't say that lightly.

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1 hour ago, Dengar5 said:

Imperials complained alot, and now they have co-ordinate options up to wazoo

Ah, so that’s what this is about.  I was puzzled by the histrionic hyperbole.  But since we are just trying to cry loudly to get our faction buffed it now makes sense.  Well, don’t let me stop you.  I’m sure you can balance the game without seeing the other half of the cards, any of the point costs or even trying to play a single game.  Carry on then.

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2 minutes ago, wurms said:

Hwk is freakin awesome now. Moldy crow is a super adv optics, letting palob BOOST into range 1-2. Or better yet, jam one ships focus and steal anothers. That is fenn rau w/ HSCP type of denial for two ships.

The jumpmaster can still equip expert handling for white barrel rolls?, and r4 astro for green 1 and 2 maneuvers? I think Dengar will be fine.

Fenn Rau is still Fenn Rau.

Moldy Crow holds less tokens now. You will only get to use your title front arc primary once or twice per game against a decent opponent because no k-turns still. It does have a great action bar now.

Expert Handling uses your talent slot & will likely be expensive on Dengar. R4 astro I believe is limited to small or small & medium ships. Dengar has no way to improve that atrocious new dial.

Fenn Rau is still Fenn Rau ? Hopefully he isn't to expensive.

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1 hour ago, falveryn said:

The most defensive ships are: Soontir, Grand Inq, Vader (but weak on offense and bad actions, really needed a boost action, but can still token stack), Guri, IG's B/C combo. Luke is far more defensive than Norra. Remember evades now just change a result. Luke basically gets the same if there is at least one eyeball, for free, no other requirements. Han Solo and the new Falcon title are also very good, even with only 1 agility, given you can almost always guarantee 1 evade, which is worth almost 3 unmodded greens. Now, Norra assures you have 1 evade + your regular roll, but the problem is that the ship is not very maneuverable, and has not max ps. So the mentioned ships are still better in most cases.

Soontir is good on defense, though if he wants focus/evade he has to get someone in his bullseye arc.  Luke's force ability does nothing for him if he rolls blanks.  And he only has 2 dice instead of 3.  Guri can get focus/calculate, but no evade.  Vader can't get evade.  Inquisitor can get evade tokens, so he might do well on the defensive end.  But if he wants to use his ability, he has to spend a force charge to do it, which reduces how often he can use those same charges to change eyeballs.  Otherwise he's only 2 attack instead of 3 unless he's at range one.  IG B/C could be decent, but can't PTl so you have to pick between evade or double calculate.

Defneder straight up gets focus/evade every round if youw ant it and complete your maneuver (and aren't stressed).  AND it has native boost and barrel roll for some repositioning.  And presumably can take afterburners so you could even double reposition a couple times.  And rexler is i5, so you still have a hgih initiative pilot, just not a 6.

36 minutes ago, Dengar5 said:

Asajj definitely worked with builds other than the standard. Inertial Dampeners has been spoiled & it's mostly worthless now. It requires you to SPEND A SHIELD to full stop & you still receive stress. Tactician likely doesn't exist anymore. Stress affects appear to be highly limited in 2.0, which is a good thing. Hopefully burnout SLAM is still around and isn't limited to large ships now.

Even with force, Asajj is dead because of that 2-attack mobile arc.

Inertial Dampeners is worse than before, but still not worthless.  That 1s can easily be worth staying put if it gets you the right position.  And IIRC, it could work multiple times now.

I fully disagree that she's dead with the 2 attack mobile arc.  I've flown plenty of ketsu, where you spend most of your time using the primary arc anyway.  And 2 dice shouldn't be as useless in 2e as it is in 1e, so theoretically you should be able to do some actual damage with it still, if less htan a 3 dice attack.

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