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tsondaboy

Did I miss something or Phantoms got nerfed to inexistence in 2.0?

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Posted (edited)

Ok, I watched the unboxing, seen the spoiled stuff and cant find myself excited flying my most favorite ship in the game any more. 😥
Unless there are some pretty crazy phantom specific stuff unspoiled or a sharp point cost drop I really cant see what role they fit in the game any more.
 

Edited by tsondaboy

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The only thing that would make sense at this point is if decloacking works as it used to be at the beginning of the activation phase or something that boosts their attack back to 4 dice.

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2 minutes ago, Punning Pundit said:

You missed the rather dramatic bump in survivability they got. 

Also we literally have no idea how many points they will be. If they're (new scale) 24 points for Whisper, I'd say there's no reason to complain. 

Generics got a bump in survivability from the extra health. Whisper lost survivability with not being able to recloak at high ps anymore

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2 minutes ago, Punning Pundit said:

You missed the rather dramatic bump in survivability they got. 

Also we literally have no idea how many points they will be. If they're (new scale) 24 points for Whisper, I'd say there's no reason to complain. 

Yup a -9 point cost drop will leave me nothing to complain, but could you elaborate more how they got a bump in survivability?

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2 minutes ago, tsondaboy said:

The only thing that would make sense at this point is if decloacking works as it used to be at the beginning of the activation phase or something that boosts their attack back to 4 dice.

Defensive mods are harder to come by and have been nerfed, so I think 3 dice on them will be fine.

Plus, after decloaking they get a free evade, and are no longer bound to Adv Cloaking Device, so assuming Modifications are still a thing they can get something else.

Phantoms can stick to range one of ships like nobody's business so they might as well still be Attack4, and the things that kept them out of the meta (bombs, turrets, etc) have been brought down several notches.

Like others have said, depends on the price, but I think the new phantom is reasonable.

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Just now, VanderLegion said:

 Generics got a bump in survivability from the extra health. Whisper lost survivability with not being able to recloak at high ps anymore

Plus the free evade token for decloaking. 

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Posted (edited)

since I'm assuming you only glanced at the 4 --> 3 die primary, then yes you obviously missed something

m3UIgur.png

Stygium Array is the bees' goddamn knees

look at this ****!

you can cloak turn 1, then derp around barrel-rolling before engagement and still recloak

what if you k-turn? got an evade? still RECLOAK because it's not an action (just dont get the free evade next turn, so take it as an action)

what if you get shot before you can shoot? Well, now you can benefit defensively from your free evade instead of getting jack **** from ACD

 

FFG didn't nerf the phantom, they buffed the **** out of it. FFG FINALLY REMOVED ITS CRIPPLING PS DEPENDENCY!!!!!!!!!!!

now you can put REAL EPTS on them instead of stapling +2 PS!!!

 

sure, if it costs the same as it used to I'll throw a fit, but this thing is incredible at the right price (even 2/3 points less)

since it's got a 1.0 X-wing stats, I'd expect them to cost roughly as much and to make back their lack of efficiency with how ******* awesome Stygium Array cloaking is

 

 

EDIT: oh right, remember the advanced sensor nerf?

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well, stygium array de-cloak is during the system phase (before activation)

PHANTOMS DON'T GIVE A ****

Edited by ficklegreendice

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Posted (edited)

only problem currently with the phantoms is a.) point cost (same as everything else, we don't know the points) and b.) whether it gets gunner or crew slot

 

a phantom derping around with perceptive co-pilot or the goddamn inquisitor (crew) would be bananas

32779995_10216743995378058_7023155119696

Edited by ficklegreendice

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1 minute ago, HolySorcerer said:

Still no target lock.  That actually hurts quite a bit, as they can't use FCS anymore.

no one can use FCS anymore, except the Advance really

but we got predator now

 

or Vader (crew) if they can take crew

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2 minutes ago, VanderLegion said:

The generics were probably rocking it anyway. Though it does let them recloak again now if they don’t need the token

Lets see how you are going to be able to keep the token on a 2 evade dice ship. Stygium array is a way way worst ability than Full Throttle since its linked to another action and not a maneuver on a 2 agility ship.  If there is also no VI card or equivalent in 2.0 phantoms are gonna be prayed upon by any ship that has higher initiative than them.  

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1 minute ago, ficklegreendice said:

no one can use FCS anymore, except the Advance really

but we got predator now

 

or Vader (crew) if they can take crew

Crossing my fingers that the Defender got a system slot.  Also, the punisher might like FCS, as it isn't restricted to primaries anymore.

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4 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

only problem currently with the phantoms is a.) point cost (same as everything else, we don't know the points) and b.) whether it gets gunner or crew slot

 

a phantom derping around with perceptive co-pilot or the goddamn inquisitor (crew) would be bananas

32779995_10216743995378058_7023155119696

Since the dial hasn't changed much in terms of blue (the new green) good luck stressing the Phantom. 

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, tsondaboy said:

Lets see how you are going to be able to keep the token on a 2 evade dice ship. Stygium array is a way way worst ability than Full Throttle since its linked to another action and not a maneuver on a 2 agility ship.  If there is also no VI card or equivalent in 2.0 phantoms are gonna be prayed upon by any ship that has higher initiative than them.  

if you don't get shot at, you can keep the token and you can keep cloak --> decloak --> cloak forever

if you keep taking sustained fire with something as flighty as a phantom, you've probably dun goofed (or are hopefully flying Whisper)

if you're fighting against higher initiative, ACD wouldn't do diddly **** for you and you're still better off in 2.0

 

stressing the phantom isn't much of a problem because you don't have to worry about using an action to cloak anymore. Echo's banky de-cloaks in particular mean she won't give the slightest ****

if you don't use the inquisitor's ability, it's still a free "focus". So on the turn you're shedding stress, you can pick up an evade token via action and still have "focus"

If you use the inquisitor, you can use it to cock block higher initiative pilots with your roll

 

Edited by ficklegreendice

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

if you don't get shot at, you can keep the token and you can keep cloak --> decloak --> cloak forever

if you keep taking sustained fire with something as flighty as a phantom, you've probably dun goofed

if you're fighting against higher initiative, ACD shouldn't do diddly **** for you anyway

 

stressing the phantom isn't much of a problem because you don't have to worry about using an action to cloak anymore. Echo's banky de-cloaks in particular mean she won't give the slightest ****

if you don't use the inquisitor's ability, it's still a free "focus"

 

Well stressing is still a major problem since Stygium is a action which means it does not even kick in if you decloack when stressed.

Stress the Phantoms and you basically striped down their ability. So any opponent ability that adds stress to enemy ships shuts down Phantoms indefinitely.

Edited by tsondaboy

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, tsondaboy said:

Well stressing is still a major problem since Stygium is a action which means it does not even kick in if you decloack when stressed.

already covered

you clear stress, evade as an action and inqy covers you with "focus"

alternatively, you can put the inquisitor on a Lambda. It'll coordinate your phantoms when your enemy activates

 

alternatively alternatively, you can use another force-user with "Sense" to counter higher initiative (doesn't have to be Vader, and probably shouldn't be because he's I 6 and expensive)

31895305_10158069640477524_6059609301675

 

it's really not that hard to overcome the theoretical hurdles facing the 2.0 phantom. It is far better equipped to survive compared to its "oh they shoot first? guess I'll die" ancestor. ****, even TLTs ruined whisper's **** and they're gone now

the only hurdle that cannot be overcome is point costs

Edited by ficklegreendice

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You people screaming a ship is dead because its dial/stats got nerfed are ridiculous...

We are 100% in the dark on points. Best we have is uber vague "it'll be expensive" comments.

New Phantom is bound to be a heck of a lot cheaper now that it no longer has ACD access and its a 3die attack. Old phantoms routinely broke 40pts, and as a result were either easy-mode win or auto-lose because they were countered by higher PS or stress-attacks. New phantoms wont eat almost half your list guaranteed (otherwise yes it is dead) allowing it to have proper lists instead of 2ship only lists

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3 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

already covered

you clear stress, evade as an action and inqy covers you with "focus"

How is it already covered, is there a way to clear stress before decloacking?
Anything that puts stress on them shuts their ability down and makes them the most predictable ship in the game with the limited blue moves available on their dial. 

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Posted (edited)

you don't need to clear stress before decloaking

you decloak, bank/straight, and then evade action. Inquisitor then covers you with "focus"

put it on Echo. You can't really be "predictable" with her ridiculous de-cloaks

 

unless you get outplayed, ofc

 

and like I said, that is simply one solution. Inq can go on a Lambda, or you can bring another force user with sense, or you can just use de-cloak intelligently to outmanuever higher initiative ships which now no longer possess nearly the same amount of maneuverability as they used to (interceptor and A-wing excepted)

it's a brave new world. the phantom has been weened off its crippling ACD addiction and it can now function without falling to pieces at the sight of higher initiative

Edited by ficklegreendice

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Posted (edited)

And what, pray-tel, gives them a stress before they decloak?

A) they decloak first
B) they stated that stress attacking is going to be much more limited than before, so far the only intentional/active stress is Asajj with the rest being reactional
C) Phantoms will NOT be half your list this time around since they have been clearly nerfed to be around Interceptor level of strength with a slight shift in defensive capabilities (2agi base, access to cloak, but no double reposition)
D) Support ships are a thing, granting actions after you cleared stress anyway. Stress doesnt prevent decloak after all and its the reposition thats so strong not the agi or the "free evade"

Edited by Vineheart01

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