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WWPDSteven

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It has some amazing dice, but since aim only lets you reroll two dice a bad roll can totally screw you.  It's definitely hit or miss.  I've popped a speeder bike and pushed one more damage through to the other in one roll, and in another game I did one total damage to a pair of speeder bikes over two turns.  I think the surge would definitely help smooth things out.

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My problem with it is just how easy it is to bring it down with potshots. Don't even really need to concentrate fire on it. Random stormtrooper group here, volley from speeder bikes there and before long it's going down. The AT-ST only has 3 more health, but what it has going for it is standoff range. It can sit back behind the rest of your army and so is much harder to concentrate on. 

The compulsor move kills the Speeder, always having to move towards your opponent's forces. It has decent potential for damage, but one or two rounds of whiffs and it's 1/4 of your army sunk doing nothing.

I have had a few matches where it was clutch, but it's not reliably clutch like Luke, or Stormtroopers w/ Dacon Lettuce Tomatoes.

 

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The Airspeeder can shoot at range 3, but it seems like everyone always rushes in with it because of the compulsory move. I wonder if it's possible to fly around the enemy instead of directly at them, to catch them in the side of your arc.

200 points in a single unit is a lot. Why take vehicles when you can load up on cheap corp troopers? One thing to consider is that vehicles don't need to worry about suppression or morale, which makes them more suited to operate independently from your commander.

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21 minutes ago, WWPDSteven said:

My problem with it is just how easy it is to bring it down with potshots. Don't even really need to concentrate fire on it. Random stormtrooper group here, volley from speeder bikes there and before long it's going down. The AT-ST only has 3 more health, but what it has going for it is standoff range. It can sit back behind the rest of your army and so is much harder to concentrate on. 

The compulsor move kills the Speeder, always having to move towards your opponent's forces. It has decent potential for damage, but one or two rounds of whiffs and it's 1/4 of your army sunk doing nothing.

I have had a few matches where it was clutch, but it's not reliably clutch like Luke, or Stormtroopers w/ Dacon Lettuce Tomatoes.

 

Actually, I deploy mine at a 90° angle, so for the first (few?) turns it actually moves around the back lines towards a corner.

Even without wedge, you can do some funny things like compulsory at biggest angle, rotate 90°, move to initial position with a different angle. With wedge you can move forwards, wedge 180° and recover top be ready to move the other way next turn.
Never deploy an airspeeder facing the enemy.

Also, at the moment, it doesn't really have any real armoured targets so a lot of its point (Impact 3) is just unspent.

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Hey if you use 1/4 of your army to fly back and forth and do nothing for  a few turns, more power to you!

I agree, the lack of real armored targets right now hurts it. I also play RvB, so it's only ever facing Imperials. I'm sure the speeder chews up AT-RTs.

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22 minutes ago, WWPDSteven said:

Hey if you use 1/4 of your army to fly back and forth and do nothing for  a few turns, more power to you!

I agree, the lack of real armored targets right now hurts it. I also play RvB, so it's only ever facing Imperials. I'm sure the speeder chews up AT-RTs.

Well, it's not really "not using it", it's waiting for the opportunity to use it in the right spot.
If these points are still alive later on where other untis are depleted, it'll be able to do stuff.

Edited by Deuzerre

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30 minutes ago, Deuzerre said:

Well, it's not really "not using it", it's waiting for the opportunity to use it in the right spot.
If these points are still alive later on where other untis are depleted, it'll be able to do stuff.

That's fair, and that's how I play my speeder too.  The downside is if you don't have a secondary weapon on there, you're getting maybe 3 or 4 shots out of it in the whole game.

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2 hours ago, Deuzerre said:

I think the biggest issue with the airspeeder is it should have surge on attacks (hits or crits, I don't care). As it is, it's rather meh 

It averages the same number of hits as Luke, only .75 less than Vader (highest average hits in the game) and is .75 ahead of the 20pt more expensive ATST. It has very consistent damage even sans aiming and with aims should easily net 5 hits.

 

on durability, I've never experienced the "it dies to pot shots". It'll take minor damage from a DLT, but short of some super anomalous dice or a ton of DLT shots (average about 8-9 units with a DLT) pot shots don't kill it anymore than an ATST. Usually when it dies, I'll map the firepower it took to bring it down. It's actually pretty equivalent to Luke in terms of durability (Luke dodges more, but the speeder has less to dodge because of Armor). He's 160 with no upgrades and has a limited threat range where the speeder is 15 more with no upgrades, but boasts the highest threat range in the game outside of infinite weapons. The compulsory move also routinely allows it to slip behind cover.

 

I don't know what to tell you. The math and my experience say it's perfectly fine. Even when I lose it, it easily absorbed enough firepower to drop at least 2 units of troopers if not 3 and I'm okay with that because they're more important to objectives than it is. Frequently my opponents will do a brief celebration upon dropping the speeder and Luke only to find themselves drowning in Z-6 shots.

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48 minutes ago, MasterShake2 said:

I don't know what to tell you. The math and my experience say it's perfectly fine. Even when I lose it, it easily absorbed enough firepower to drop at least 2 units of troopers if not 3 and I'm okay with that because they're more important to objectives than it is. Frequently my opponents will do a brief celebration upon dropping the speeder and Luke only to find themselves drowning in Z-6 shots.

Oh, I think it is sort of fine, jsut meh for 1/4 of the army , but it just don't bring anything the rebs actually need.

An airspeeder with a power harpoon (because why wouldn't you take it honestly) is 183 points. For that, I can buy 2 AT-RT with laser canons, which will have a better firepower (surges to crit on two red + four black), almost twice the HP (12 vs 7); slightly less armour but then they don't have to expose themselves as much, can't get stuck on terrain due to compulsory... Sure, it won't be able to move + aim + shoot, but generally that's more detrimental than a boon.

Honestly, it's not just about the math. If it were only the math, the airspeeder would be awesome. But it isn't, because a unit isn't just firepower: It's how you can apply it, and the airspeeder doesn't really work that well in that regard.

I have felt it getting chipped off by shots, but your meta may differ from mine. Where I play, opponents use DLTs with impact 1, split their fire here and there, have quite a lot of terrain... All of this makes the airspeeder rather "meh".

 

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27 minutes ago, Deuzerre said:

Oh, I think it is sort of fine, jsut meh for 1/4 of the army , but it just don't bring anything the rebs actually need.

An airspeeder with a power harpoon (because why wouldn't you take it honestly) is 183 points. For that, I can buy 2 AT-RT with laser canons, which will have a better firepower (surges to crit on two red + four black), almost twice the HP (12 vs 7); slightly less armour but then they don't have to expose themselves as much, can't get stuck on terrain due to compulsory... Sure, it won't be able to move + aim + shoot, but generally that's more detrimental than a boon.

Honestly, it's not just about the math. If it were only the math, the airspeeder would be awesome. But it isn't, because a unit isn't just firepower: It's how you can apply it, and the airspeeder doesn't really work that well in that regard.

I have felt it getting chipped off by shots, but your meta may differ from mine. Where I play, opponents use DLTs with impact 1, split their fire here and there, have quite a lot of terrain... All of this makes the airspeeder rather "meh".

 

 

Where I play 90% of the players are empire and also use DLTs and we have a good bit of terrain which is why I find the speeder valuable to Rebels as one of the few units fast enough to line up uncovered shots or chase down units trying to get away with supplies.

 

Probably half of my opponents have arrived at the conclusion that they hate playing against the speeder because it routinely forces the choice of redirecting a lot of firepower on critical turns to deal with it or just letting it rampage through your backfield picking off key units while you deal with mobs of troopers with Z-6s. The other half are usually ambivalent about the speeder because they make critical errors early in the game and the speeder is just a match on a fire.

 

I dunno, I probably just a weird person because I generally view the compulsory move as a bonus rather than a deficit. I have an entire army of things that can sit there and plink away, so I don't really need more of that so much as extra legs to extend the army's reach.

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If you need something to redirect fire, get three AT-RTs with flamethrowers and rush at the imperials. That's about 30% of your force that is sure to do horrendous damage and be focus fired like mad while they try to prevent them from approaching... And you're scoring everything there is to score.

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Personally, I think the airspeeder's "Impact" is a bit of a red herring. In my experience, it's a fantastic trooper killer. So what if it dies, so long as it delivers its payload and decimates the troopers that were trying to hide behind cover or out of LOS. It does take some finesse, though, I agree. But paired with a flamethrower AT-RT, that's a serious threat to the enemy troopers that they will need to deal with.

The first time I used the airspeeder, I did decent damage to a couple trooper units, then focused on and destroyed the AT-ST. Had I not made that target switch, I think I could have handily neutered my opponent's ability to score victory points. Ended up losing that game, and I think I can point to that target switch as a big contributor.

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I played a couple games this past weekend with a single speeder in my list, with no upgrades on it.  We were playing the Operation: Gathering Forces event so each match was Battle Lines/Key Positions/Clear Conditions.  In both games with the T-47 I deployed it on the edge of the field facing my opponents lines.  I found that using the compulsory move was plenty of distance most turns and the Aim+Fire really did a number on enemy troopers.

The first game my opponent was so worried about my T-47 that he focused his Luke on it and exposed him, allowing the rest of my army to shoot Luke off the table in a single turn.  The speeder was able to get angles on his Trooper units that eliminated his cover and was doing 3+ wounds each time I fired.

The second game my T-47 was the MVP.  In 6 turns I was able to finish off 3 full Stormtrooper squads and take out Veers by itself.  I ignored my opponents AT-ST and focused on eliminating his Troopers.  By the last turn the only unit on the table was his AT-ST. 

Oh, and we finished that full 800 point game in about an hour and 45 minutes.  The other 3 tables all finished before time as well, so a 2 hour round for a tournament seems quite reasonable.

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43 minutes ago, NeonWolf said:

I found that using the compulsory move was plenty of distance most turns and the Aim+Fire really did a number on enemy troopers.

Aim seems really good with 3R3B. I hope when I get my airspeeder on the table it performs as well as yours!

 

19 hours ago, Deuzerre said:

An airspeeder with a power harpoon (because why wouldn't you take it honestly) is 183 points. For that, I can buy 2 AT-RT with laser canons, which will have a better firepower (surges to crit on two red + four black)

Rolling 1R2B twice is not the same as rolling 2R4B, because cover removes a flat number of hits. I think there's a good argument for few attacks with many dice versus many attacks with few dice, because they can punch through cover.

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5 minutes ago, Contrapulator said:

Rolling 1R2B twice is not the same as rolling 2R4B, because cover removes a flat number of hits. I think there's a good argument for few attacks with many dice versus many attacks with few dice, because they can punch through cover.

There's infinite variations to what you're saying.

an other argument would be that you may not be sure to have a good target for the airspeeder every turn due to compulsory moves. Overall, this compensates the cover thing, especially since the AT-RT surge to crit which ignores cover anyway.

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