X-Wing 2.0 - not surprised, but will it kill the game for you?

[RayGuns 79]

I just learned of the new 2.0 reboot. To be honest, I'm not surprised.  Of course FFG couldn't say it outright, but after reading FFG's press release, they are basically saying they are forced to reboot X-Wing because the game is messed up beyond repair. They did it to themselves by wave after wave after wave.

Like many other X-Wing fans, this 2.0 reboot might be the switch that turns the game off for me. I'm still waiting to see how it plays out, but one thing for sure is that I'm not happy at all with how FFG is forcing us fans to pay for their mistake. We need to "update" our collections to make them 2.0 compliant. On top of that, their Conversion Kits are a f&%#ing joke!! That alone will probably end the game for me!

[StriderZessei 948]

If you bought a copy of every single Rebel expansion, a rebel conversion kit will run you about 7% of what you spent.

A 7% tax to fix everything wrong with the game seems fair to me, especially when the video game equivalent (a major expansion or full-fledged sequel) can run anywhere from 33% to 100% the cost of the base game.

Edited May 3, 2018 by FFGSysops

[CBMarkham 2,441]

Kill the game for me? It makes the game for me.

Everything old is new again, and the world is bright and shiny.

[CBMarkham 2,441]

6 minutes ago, RayGuns said:

I'm not happy at all with how FFG is forcing us fans to pay for their mistake. 

I can see that you know nothing about game design.

While we're at it, you wanna go back to 1993 and tell Richard Garfield he's a hack who doesn't know thing 1 about game design, and then explain to him how to fix MtG?

[Alpha17 2,853]

11 minutes ago, RayGuns said:

That alone will probably end the game for me!

 

Bye.

[Jadotch 1,377]

9 minutes ago, StriderZessei said:

If you bought a copy of every single Rebel expansion, a rebel conversion kit will run you about 7% of what you spent.

A 7% tax to fix everything wrong with the game seems fair to me, especially when the video game equivalent (a major expansion or full-fledged sequel) can run anywhere from 33% to 100% the cost of the base game.

Your self-righteous entitlement is equal parts scornful and pathetic. Take it elsewhere,

That is if you bought it in equal parts and only exactly what is in the conversion kit list. So that 7% does not apply to 99% of the players.

Edited May 2, 2018 by Jadotch

[CBMarkham 2,441]

2 minutes ago, Jadotch said:

...So that 7% does not apply to 99% of the players.

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

technically, you'd be forcing yourself to pay for their mistakes

people like me have been on this boat for years now, knowing that the game is deeply, DEEPLY flawed. this was my decision, as is my decision to (probably) buy into 2.0

 

 

I honestly really don't understand what people were expecting. No kits? 1.0 forever?

only halfway reasonable thing would be cheaper boxes

Edited May 2, 2018 by ficklegreendice

[RayGuns 79]

8 minutes ago, Jadotch said:

That is if you bought it in equal parts and only exactly what is in the conversion kit list. So that 7% does not apply to 99% of the players.

These facts are usually missed on the fans wearing blinders.

[RayGuns 79]

12 minutes ago, Alpha17 said:

Bye.

Okay, bye Alpha17, but you are giving up on the game a bit too soon. You should wait until you see the new rules first before saying "Bye".

[hismhs 199]

Hey, RayGuns, if you are the creater of the immortal HexWing, I will be interested to see what you do with X-W 2.0 !

Hang in there, RayGuns!

 

 

[heckathornjeff 51]

I don't believe the original designers conceived of how big X-wing would be.  That said I am not aware of a long term card or miniatures game that has not required a version change.  I have been happy playing X-wing as it is but as I have started getting into competitive play I see the need for some fixes.  Form what I have seen 2.0 looks pretty good and is now poised to grow even more.  We now have a valid method of adding a Separatist and Republic factions for the prequels content many people want. 

If you don't play competitive formats and just play casually stick to 1.0.  If you have been a competitive player  you have been buying every expansion to stay up with the meta no matter if it is a faction you play or not. I am not seeing it as that much worse.  Now after you convert you can in theory be competitive in the new 2.0 meta without buying a single product for a different faction

Yes if you have more ships than the conversion kit has in it you won't have bases for them all, but what ships can you actually play that a new core set and conversion kit will not give you enough ship bases and pilots to field?  The core set has 2 Tie Fighters the Conversion will have 4 so if you want to fly a swarm of academy pilots you will be 2 short, but I would be shocked if pilots and bases from the conversion kits will be available.  I know  you will still have to pay for singles ,and the core set and conversion is $90.  For most of us it will be $190 to get all 3 conversions in September.  I would be surprised if FFG will price the Resistance and First Order conversion that high as the content will not be as much.

I agree that is a lot to pay for a single upgrade, but this is not that.  This is converting the fleet I have into something I will continue to be able to use in the competitive events I have grown to love.  

I accept that the designers could not have designed the game to meet all our needs with the information they had at the time.  I want the game to continue to grow and be around for a long time.  I hope that FFG made the right decision.  I think they did looking at other games historically. I am happy with the look of the changes and I accept that we have to pay a cost for FFG to be able to create the content we consume from them.

Based upon what we are used to paying for a new wave this is expensive yes.  I for one am going to get the core set and at least one faction conversion to start and see how it plays.  I have no idea how you can judge before seeing it at your FLGS at a minimum and talk to folks who took the plunge.  FFG makes money when we like the product and show others how cool it is and then new players buy product.  I do not see them doing anything just for the money and word of mouth as players share their experiences is how a large number of people find their products.  I don't see them doing things just for the money, or not caring about what the customer thinks. I am excited they spent this time and money investing into the future of X-wing.

[Vontoothskie 1,278]

most likely done. i cannot justify spending another 300 dollars to rebuy components I already own to make the thousand plus dollars i've spent  on this game playable.

my triple defenders and 5 scyks alone are going to cost $200 dollars to make playable(2 imperial conversions and 2 scum conversions). thats  $80 more than 120 dollar retail value of the ships themselves

It also appears that medium bases will not be included in sufficient numbers to field all of the ships included in each conversion kit, meaning that if you own 2 k-wings and 2 arc 170s, you will not be able to put all 4 on medium bases and will indtead need to buys additional packs to get stands. no word on how they plan to deal with colored bases either, so if you spent 30 to get matching bases for your ships, the mediums will no longer match. really fed up with this in general

[FTS Gecko 24,135]

^

[PhantomFO 9,101]

Not done at all. Am more excited for the game than I have been in a long while. We're finally getting back to a game where maneuvers and planning matters. No more turrets covering almost a quarter of the map at once with no safe approach vectors. No more high-PS bombers who get to see what everyone lower than them has done before deciding whether it's a good idea to drop a bomb under their shields. If boost-barrel roll remains, it's severely curtailed and the barrel roll has fewer final positions.

The game has had so many fixes that they've started needing create fixes for their fixes. It was an overgrown tree that needed a pruning.

Plus, all the 1.0 stuff is still valid for those who want to play it! The cards aren't being destroyed. You can still use them against other 1.0 players if you'd like. Future expansions after Wave 14 won't support it, but that still leaves you with 14 waves worth of content to play with.

 

[Vontoothskie 1,278]

40 minutes ago, heckathornjeff said:

I don't believe the original designers conceived of how big X-wing would be.  That said I am not aware of a long term card or miniatures game that has not required a version change.  I have been happy playing X-wing as it is but as I have started getting into competitive play I see the need for some fixes.  Form what I have seen 2.0 looks pretty good and is now poised to grow even more.  We now have a valid method of adding a Separatist and Republic factions for the prequels content many people want. 

If you don't play competitive formats and just play casually stick to 1.0.  If you have been a competitive player  you have been buying every expansion to stay up with the meta no matter if it is a faction you play or not. I am not seeing it as that much worse.  Now after you convert you can in theory be competitive in the new 2.0 meta without buying a single product for a different faction

Yes if you have more ships than the conversion kit has in it you won't have bases for them all, but what ships can you actually play that a new core set and conversion kit will not give you enough ship bases and pilots to field?  The core set has 2 Tie Fighters the Conversion will have 4 so if you want to fly a swarm of academy pilots you will be 2 short, but I would be shocked if pilots and bases from the conversion kits will be available.  I know  you will still have to pay for singles ,and the core set and conversion is $90.  For most of us it will be $190 to get all 3 conversions in September.  I would be surprised if FFG will price the Resistance and First Order conversion that high as the content will not be as much.

I agree that is a lot to pay for a single upgrade, but this is not that.  This is converting the fleet I have into something I will continue to be able to use in the competitive events I have grown to love.  

I accept that the designers could not have designed the game to meet all our needs with the information they had at the time.  I want the game to continue to grow and be around for a long time.  I hope that FFG made the right decision.  I think they did looking at other games historically. I am happy with the look of the changes and I accept that we have to pay a cost for FFG to be able to create the content we consume from them.

Based upon what we are used to paying for a new wave this is expensive yes.  I for one am going to get the core set and at least one faction conversion to start and see how it plays.  I have no idea how you can judge before seeing it at your FLGS at a minimum and talk to folks who took the plunge.  FFG makes money when we like the product and show others how cool it is and then new players buy product.  I do not see them doing anything just for the money and word of mouth as players share their experiences is how a large number of people find their products.  I don't see them doing things just for the money, or not caring about what the customer thinks. I am excited they spent this time and money investing into the future of X-wing.

3 defenders

5 khiraxz

3-5 protectorates

3 tie advanced

1 k-wing, 1-u-wing, 1 arc170(if too few medium bases, this might be playable)

5 z95s and a hwk290

etc.

those were just list i personally have played in the last few months that i could not play with a single conversion kit

[Vontoothskie 1,278]

1 minute ago, PhantomFO said:

Not done at all. Am more excited for the game than I have been in a long while. We're finally getting back to a game where maneuvers and planning matters. No more turrets covering almost a quarter of the map at once with no safe approach vectors. No more high-PS bombers who get to see what everyone lower than them has done before deciding whether it's a good idea to drop a bomb under their shields. If boost-barrel roll remains, it's severely curtailed and the barrel roll has fewer final positions.

The game has had so many fixes that they've started needing create fixes for their fixes. It was an overgrown tree that needed a pruning.

Plus, all the 1.0 stuff is still valid for those who want to play it! The cards aren't being destroyed. You can still use them against other 1.0 players if you'd like. Future expansions after Wave 14 won't support it, but that still leaves you with 14 waves worth of content to play with.

 

i am excited about the fix but i simply cannot justify the money involved to re-collect. 

at least in warhammer the codexes and rules are the only new thing each addition.  

its really hard to look at my collection and know i have to sell most of it, but if I have a choice between buying a plane ticket to Japan or "upgrading" some plastic toys i already own, im flying to Japan

[ficklegreendice 34,362]

I didn't know flights to Japan were only $90

Seriously, you don't have to throw all your money into making your entire collection viable. You only NEED a core and probable conversion to make tons of 200 point lists 

People will still be willing to buy 1.0 models at a discount for you to make some return on your investment

As opposed to now, where I could never ever sell my 2 As, 4bs, my g1-a, 3 advance... because they're awful in xwing 1.0 and really difficult to find buyers for or reasons to put on the table 

Idk, I respect price concerns but it really seems people are blowing things out of proportion and not considering a more realistic picture

The entirety of your collection isn't going to see table time for a WHILE because there are so many new things to explore. Gonna take forever to work through it all 

 

 

[Vontoothskie 1,278]

5 hours ago, ficklegreendice said:

I didn't know flights to Japan were only $90

Seriously, you don't have to throw all your money into making your entire collection viable. You only NEED a core and probable conversion to make tons of 200 point lists 

People will still be willing to buy 1.0 models at a discount for you to make some return on your investment

As opposed to now, where I could never ever sell my 2 As, 4bs, my g1-a, 3 advance... because they're awful in xwing 1.0 and really difficult to find buyers for or reasons to put on the table 

Idk, I respect price concerns but it really seems people are blowing things out of proportion and not considering a more realistic picture

The entirety of your collection isn't going to see table time for a WHILE because there are so many new things to explore. Gonna take forever to work through it all 

 

 

what are you even talking about here? where are you getting $90?

and why would i only update part of my collection?  I dont NEED any game stuff at all, but I spent a lot of money on the game. it is utterly bizzare to suggest that players should be delighted at the privilege  of paying $50 to play with only a small portion of their collection. I understand FFG was in a bad spot, but I see no reason why these boxes cannot include the components neccessary to play a 100 point squadron of each type of ship people commonly play as swarms

[AwesomeJedi 622]

7 hours ago, RayGuns said:

I just learned of the new 2.0 reboot. To be honest, I'm not surprised.  Of course FFG couldn't say it outright, but after reading FFG's press release, they are basically saying they are forced to reboot X-Wing because the game is messed up beyond repair. They did it to themselves by wave after wave after wave.

Like many other X-Wing fans, this 2.0 reboot might be the switch that turns the game off for me. I'm still waiting to see how it plays out, but one thing for sure is that I'm not happy at all with how FFG is forcing us fans to pay for their mistake. We need to "update" our collections to make them 2.0 compliant. On top of that, their Conversion Kits are a f&%#ing joke!! That alone will probably end the game for me!

If you feel these changes are a joke and unfair, maybe you need to look at it differently. All these changes were made with the fans and the future of the game in mind.

[wurms 5,313]

Cautiously Optimistic is how I describe my feelings toward 2.0. Love it all, but its FFG, and something gonna be broken.

[Do I need a Username 2,310]

11 minutes ago, AwesomeJedi said:

If you feel these changes are a joke and unfair, maybe you need to look at it differently. All these changes were made with the fans and the future of the game in mind.

Second this.  You are paying 90$ for what amounts to a new game.  FFG could have just said "X-wing is ending, check out this new competitive dogfighting game instead!" and charged you way more for it.  Sure, people might not have paid but now those of us that want that game can pay 90 for it (minimum entry) and then 50$ over time to upgrade other parts of your collection.  This is a good move.

[LordBlades 2,403]

6 hours ago, Vontoothskie said:

 

at least in warhammer the codexes and rules are the only new thing each addition.  

 

You mean unless GW decides to re-release an unit kit, and make the one weapon option that wasn't in the old kits the only worthwhile option, right? 

 

Or when they change the new codex to the point your existing army is just bad or downright illegal? 

[Vontoothskie 1,278]

8 hours ago, StriderZessei said:

If you bought a copy of every single Rebel expansion, a rebel conversion kit will run you about 7% of what you spent.

A 7% tax to fix everything wrong with the game seems fair to me, especially when the video game equivalent (a major expansion or full-fledged sequel) can run anywhere from 33% to 100% the cost of the base game.

Your self-righteous entitlement is equal parts scornful and pathetic. Take it elsewhere.

your math is assuming people didnt buy multiples of swarm ships. My imperial collection cost $200 and itll cost $140 to make it playable.

Im just selling my imps because i will not spend 75% to fix FFGs mistakes

[DarthEnderX 5,286]

If it makes the game play better and more balanced then no.

If I'd had to rebuy all my ships, yes, but I don't.