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BlodVargarna

Thoughts after watching the Covenant play through video with Alex

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17 minutes ago, Forgottenlore said:

Apparently, and I didn't catch this at first either, the 1-straight template has to START aligned with the center of the base, and then the ship's final position can be either half a base forward, half a base backward or centered. I'm not sure if it works the same for large and medium base ships, but in the TC game, Alex consistently was lining up the hashmark on the base insert with either the center or one end of the 1-straight template. On the small base ships, that was no different than lining up with the edge of the base, but on the larger bases, if that is how it works, they will only be moving the same distance forward or back as the small ships because it is a fixed point on the base that is being lined up with the TEMPLATE.

 

I THINK that is what is going on.

Yeah but it still moves too much sideways. 

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8 hours ago, gamblertuba said:

If you are looking for an excuse to NOT buy into 2.0, then do not watch the video.  Seeing X-wings and TIE fighters flying around while deploying weaponized joy and happiness was great.  Second edition feels like it is simultaneously a grown-up for reals attempt at a competitive miniatures game and also a return to basics:  Set dial, move ship, blow stuff up.

You can fly TIE-Fighters and X.Wings exactly like this more or less already in 1.0 ?
Alex is not the master of list building, he is actually quite bad at it and those lists are most likely not the king of competitive lists either ... at least there is zero reason to assume just that. The TIE-Fighters actually look unplayable bad to be honest, when compared to those X-Wings. ?

So maybe more analytic thinking when watching those videos and less emotional joy about seeing X-Wings on the table. 

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17 minutes ago, SEApocalypse said:

You can fly TIE-Fighters and X.Wings exactly like this more or less already in 1.0 ?
Alex is not the master of list building, he is actually quite bad at it and those lists are most likely not the king of competitive lists either ... at least there is zero reason to assume just that. The TIE-Fighters actually look unplayable bad to be honest, when compared to those X-Wings. ?

So maybe more analytic thinking when watching those videos and less emotional joy about seeing X-Wings on the table. 

I did notice that both sample games (Team Covenant and BoLS) had very similar lists, lots of crackshot Ties and an advanced (reaper in one) vs a Y with seismic charges and Ion turret and some X's (and a U in one). I suspect that when those games were filmed they only had access to the core set cards (and wave 14 for the TC one).

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21 minutes ago, SEApocalypse said:

You can fly TIE-Fighters and X.Wings exactly like this more or less already in 1.0 ?
Alex is not the master of list building, he is actually quite bad at it and those lists are most likely not the king of competitive lists either ... at least there is zero reason to assume just that. The TIE-Fighters actually look unplayable bad to be honest, when compared to those X-Wings. ?

So maybe more analytic thinking when watching those videos and less emotional joy about seeing X-Wings on the table. 

Well, maybe because X-Wings are waaay better than they were in wave 1, while TIE-s are pretty much the same. 

Actually, they got weaker with the "nerf" to evade and crackshot. I'm really hoping there is a configuration or something that adds a little bit of oomph to them.  Maybe they have ept-s and the supposed "faction identity" helps them out. Obviously, such show games are bit limited in their repertoire, so maybe we'll see better. 

Not impressed with the TIE-s. 


but you know... Most other things were nerfed as well, and frankly, X-Wings should be better than TIE-s. 


We can judge them for their rebel bias when we exactly know how powerful rebels are compared to the rest. Until then, I shall remain hopeful. 

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10 hours ago, BlodVargarna said:

- Feel is important, and that is a really good thing. The designers made the ships to feel like how they are supposed to and they can price them later. This is good design.

Plus, with point values being "released" digitally, they can extend the play-testing window into running partially parallel with the manufacturing lead-time (something they couldn't do previously as PV's had to be submitted to the printer). 

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1 hour ago, DailyRich said:

I'm not seeing how the barrel roll is now more limited for large base ships.

Is it "more limited" in that less large ships will have access to that action (and for any that do, it'll be red)...? 

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1 hour ago, SEApocalypse said:

You can fly TIE-Fighters and X.Wings exactly like this more or less already in 1.0 ?
Alex is not the master of list building, he is actually quite bad at it and those lists are most likely not the king of competitive lists either ... at least there is zero reason to assume just that. The TIE-Fighters actually look unplayable bad to be honest, when compared to those X-Wings. ?

So maybe more analytic thinking when watching those videos and less emotional joy about seeing X-Wings on the table. 

Yes, you can.  And run into TLT, Harpoons, PS11 boosting Ghosts, infinite bombs, infinite regen, unkillable reinforce, bombs dropped with perfect board knowledge, double reposition aces, etc.  All of which will not exist (or at least be severely limited) in 2.0

I've put in the analytical thinking...  I'm ready for some emotional joy dammit.

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Do you even have a source that not ALL TIE-Interceptors will have the double-Reposition action chain? ?

TLTs might be still a thing, harpoons most definatlly will be still a thing, PS11 Boosting Ghosts become PS 5 Boosting Ghosts, the coordinate action is given out to a lot of ships ... and my new Whisper/Soontir + Reaper List might be even more terrifying  than ever. ?

We have no clue how good the re-balancing did work out and the new monsters might be more terrifying than the old ones. The biggest indicator for more problems is that the new TIE-Fighters seem to be worse off than the old ones. 

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1 hour ago, Commander Kaine said:

but you know... Most other things were nerfed as well, and frankly, X-Wings should be better than TIE-s. 

They never have been better in the reference material. TIE-Fighters were better in the X-Wing games, the best game of the series was TIE-Fighter and the battle of Yavin was 30 Y- and X-Wings + one heavy armoed freighter vs one squadron of TIE-Fighters and some most harmless anti-capital ship turbolasers. And the TIE-Fighters did hold their ground still very well. 

Henchmen are worse than main characters, so a lot of TIE-Fighter die to the main cast. But the TIE-Fighter design always seem to have been pretty solid when used in squadron engagements. 

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1 hour ago, SEApocalypse said:

Do you even have a source that not ALL TIE-Interceptors will have the double-Reposition action chain? ?

TLTs might be still a thing, harpoons most definatlly will be still a thing, PS11 Boosting Ghosts become PS 5 Boosting Ghosts, the coordinate action is given out to a lot of ships ... and my new Whisper/Soontir + Reaper List might be even more terrifying  than ever. ?

We have no clue how good the re-balancing did work out and the new monsters might be more terrifying than the old ones. The biggest indicator for more problems is that the new TIE-Fighters seem to be worse off than the old ones. 

judging from the comments in another thread about observations from todays streams, both TLT and Harpoons are GONE in V2.0.

 

Additionally I did read somewhere that Engine Upgrade might be gone as well, obviously all need to be verified but for the time being V2.0 looks to be devoid of the pillars of the current meta.

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took me till the TIE advance thread to realize this but the reaper build is just...the worst

so, elusiveness:

it has one green die. its pilot has an ability that guarantees his die rolls an evade

tactical officer:

1.) the reaper already has red coordinate

2.) the reaper wants to jam, especially Feroph (it triggers his ability)

Krennic:

requires the reaper to TL

again, jam --> feroph. I can't stress this enough, it's basically the entire point of the reaper.

 

Feroph would literally have been better going in without any upgrades. Or give him ruthlessness and let Steele get elusive.

you got a 1 green die ship with a redundant defensive buff and an Advance with ruthlessness atop his FCS modifier. flip em around!

 

 

wouldn't have been a big deal if the rebel squad hadn't actually been well built

Edited by ficklegreendice

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7 minutes ago, Mace Windu said:

judging from the comments in another thread about observations from todays streams, both TLT and Harpoons are GONE in V2.0.

 

Additionally I did read somewhere that Engine Upgrade might be gone as well, obviously all need to be verified but for the time being V2.0 looks to be devoid of the pillars of the current meta.

Yup, need verification but according to the stream TLT, Action Bombs/Mines, Engine Upgrade and Harpoons are all gone in 2.0. The Falcon does get Boost now in its action bar though.

3 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

took me till the TIE advance thread to realize this but the reaper build is just...the worst

so, elusiveness:

it has one green die. its pilot has an ability that guarantees his die rolls an evade

tactical officer:

the reaper already has red coordinate

the reaper wants to jam, especially Feroph (it triggers his ability)

Krennic:

requires the reaper to TL

again, jam --> feroph

 

 

Feroph would literally have been better going in without any upgrades

I guess they wanted to try new upgrades, though would be funny if you could instead fit another Tie in there for the cost of those upgrades. 

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24 minutes ago, Mace Windu said:

judging from the comments in another thread about observations from todays streams, both TLT and Harpoons are GONE in V2.0.

 

Additionally I did read somewhere that Engine Upgrade might be gone as well, obviously all need to be verified but for the time being V2.0 looks to be devoid of the pillars of the current meta.

There is the new "Afterburners" card in the Scum and Villainy preview article. It looks it will allow the ship to perform a boost after fully completing a speed 3-5 maneuver.

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2 hours ago, SEApocalypse said:

They never have been better in the reference material. TIE-Fighters were better in the X-Wing games, the best game of the series was TIE-Fighter and the battle of Yavin was 30 Y- and X-Wings + one heavy armoed freighter vs one squadron of TIE-Fighters and some most harmless anti-capital ship turbolasers. And the TIE-Fighters did hold their ground still very well. 

Henchmen are worse than main characters, so a lot of TIE-Fighter die to the main cast. But the TIE-Fighter design always seem to have been pretty solid when used in squadron engagements. 

IIRC the TIEs and X-Wings were a pretty even match. I'll have to rewatch the trench run and get a real tally, but it seems that over the years of EU, that the TIE vs X-Wing disparity got greatly exaggerated.

Edit. Just finished. 
Porkins: Dies to tower fire.
TIE: 1 XWing
Luke: 1 TIE
Wedge: 1 TIE
Vader: 1 YWing
Vader: 1 YWing
Vader: 1 YWing
Vader: 1 XWing
TIE: 1 XWing
Vader: 1 XWing (Red Leader)
Vader: 1 XWing
3 times(?) TIEs hit but do not destroy a ship
Han: 1 TIE + collateral damage.

Let's pull Vader out of there, he's skewing the numbers with his mad skills. That's two kills for the TIEs, two kills for the X-Wings, about 3 times a TIE hits but does not destroy an X-Wing. Note that many times a TIE will take out an X-Wing with one volley. The Wings seem tougher, but not that much tougher.
 

Edited by Koing907

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I think charges are the single best change from 1.0 to 2.0. Most of the garbage cards (cool hand, lightning reflexes, etc) were garbage because they had to compete with things that had infinite uses for a similar cost. Adding in charges makes the game much more focused on having an engagement plan and using your special abilities at the perfect moment to tip the scales of the battle.

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Another thing you gotta remember with fighters is that they take a lot more skill to fly.

They crutch so utterly on their crappy green dice that they NEED mods to live, they have bullseye-only crackshot, and they can't move well at low speeds. 

So when you put them in...not the best hands, they look a lot worse in comparison to the beefier rebels (except for that Y...he really didn't want to live)

Now in my case, you're dead to a single crit result regardless, but I think we're judging way too prematurely especially given the clearly better built rebel list

Seriously, that feroph build should be a (star) war crime. It's actually handicapping the entire squad 

 

Edited by ficklegreendice

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21 hours ago, ficklegreendice said:

Yup that's my concern as well

With action efficiency being seeming so hard to come buy, the allure of a fully modded four die attack is HUGE

But with the App, they can adjust costs per ship AND pilots (could be more expensive on higher ps)

 

 

And ordnances... maybe the cost for those 4 die attacks wiill be huge as well...

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anything that requires TL really has to scale up as initiative goes higher, because it's much easier to TL at higher initiative

I'd actually expect 2.0 TIE Advance generics to run about as much as Strikers currently do, if not less because Strikers will have their Ailerons (if the reaper is any indication)

Edited by ficklegreendice

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1 minute ago, BlodVargarna said:

Neither will be a thing. They aren’t in the new  version. 

I don't think we can confirm or deny that, or have there been answers on this on stream? Still, TLT will be very different guaranteed (something like 14 points and of course will have a mobile arc is what I'd expect should the effect stay similar, which I don't expect), Harpoons probably also, given that pretty much all ordnance appears to be getting an overhaul.

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2 minutes ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

I don't think we can confirm or deny that, or have there been answers on this on stream? Still, TLT will be very different guaranteed (something like 14 points and of course will have a mobile arc is what I'd expect should the effect stay similar, which I don't expect), Harpoons probably also, given that pretty much all ordnance appears to be getting an overhaul.

All collected yesterday.

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