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Kieransi

The Upsilon Shuttle.

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Since FFG refuses to give us anything new (preview or FAQ) to talk about, let's talk about one of the other goodies they've given us that we've sort of tossed aside. 

This seems to be the least talked-about ship in the entire game. I often tend to forget it exists. But not only does it exist, but it's also very recognizable, canonical, and one of only three ships to have a four-dice primary weapon. It's now appeared in two movies and its top pilot is the most well-known character in his entire faction. In addition, all three times I saw TLJ in the theater, the unnamed Upsilon pilot (I like to think it's Stridan) got the biggest laugh of any funny thing in the movie ("right away, sir."). So it's definitely important from a Star Wars perspective.

But in the game? This is one of the most solidly "meh" ships in existence. It's not bad enough that people are shouting "Upsilon fix" as they are for the Punisher, U-Wing, or Firespray, but it's bad enough that it's almost never seen. 

So let's give the Upsilon the discussion it deserves. 

Have you used it? If so, how?

How would FFG go about "fixing" it?

What needs to exist for it to serve a useful role? That is to say, can it be "fixed" just by a meta shift or some new tech cards entering the game or something?

Why couldn't Upsilon Kylo get PS11 coordinate?!?

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I want to like the Upsilon, but alas, arc-bound large ships are hot garbage, and this one is about 5-8 points overcosted. I've played with mine extensively, and they never seem to be worth their staggeringly high cost. 4 dice attack seems really good until you realize that this ship isn't the Ghost with an Aux. arc AND a turret slot. LOL.

To fix it, I'd make an ace pack for it that has new dials/cardboard (give it a K turn), and give it a rear Aux arc. Maybe a title that allows you to use a coordinate action at the beginning of the combat phase (take that Fenn!).

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The list I ran (4-2) at the CAC this weekend was:

Starkiller Base Pilot (30)
Collision Detector (0)
Emperor Palpatine (8)

Darth Vader (29)
Veteran Instincts (1)
Advanced Targeting Computer (1)
TIE/x1 (0)

The Inquisitor (25)
Push the Limit (3)
Autothrusters (2)
TIE/v1 (1)

Total: 100

 

I have to sacrifice EU from Vader for the Upsilon-class (as well as a missile/bid), which hurts but have decided that its worth it for a few reasons.  I use coordinate to allow Vader to change TL when setting up a K-Turn, or Evade, Focus, and Target Lock on approach, or to barrel roll to avoid obstacles or a potential block. There is also the trick where if you have an unstressed Inquisitor, you can dial a green straight (like 3 or 4) coordinate a boost to turn direction, PtL a Focus, then reveal and move and clear stress, then Target Lock + Evade with you standard action and end the round with 4 actions taken and no stress without being limited to his typical 1-speed maneuvers.

Now, some might say that "you are giving up your shuttles action" which is correct, however I find that the innate +1 primary attack of the Upsilon-class over a Lambda-class makes almost up for "giving up" a Focus action on offense (see Expose v. Focus discussions) without being able to be bumped away. The increased defense of the Upsilon over the Lambda (+1 shield, +1 hull) also allows it to stay around longer, taking generally another attack to remove. There have been plenty of instances where a 1 or 2 health shuttle got out of the initial scrap to continue passing Palp and coordinate actions from behind the enemy for another turn or two.

The value of white 2-hard turns and 3-banks cannot be overstated. 3-banks allow the shuttle to crash into the enemy setting up bump-fests for Vader and Inquisitor to exploit, then jump over everyone to get out. The 2-turns allow it to actually get turned back around quickly and stress free so it can continue to pass actions via Coordinate. Also, many times I have 3 forwarded or banked in, grabbed a TL, and missing the block, set up a 5 die + TL + Palp attack that just rips apart someone. I distinctly remember putting 4 points after his defense roll on a QD in one shot during the tournament, which can be very disheartening for a QD pilot. Also, the occasional 1-hard turn has caught enemies unaware having them eat a 5 die attack in the rear.

While I think Capt. Yorr is an awesome pilot in the Lambda and people do great things with him, I don't quite think that people give the Upsilon the credit its due.

 

Edited by kris40k

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The problem with the ups is simply that it's too expensive for how quickly it crashes and burns. It's the same problem with the yv except the yv gets aux arcs to augment its effectiveness 

The wookie really is the points standard for how these ships should be priced, even though the 3 health difference nowhere near compensates for not having reinforce. So the UPS could be at least 3-5 points cheaper 

Alternatively, we can just get better system or (more pertenently) Large Ship Only tech since neither the ups nor res bomber are particularly setting the world on fire 

Until then, the economical lambda or reaper will always be better points investments

About the only cool thing the UPS can do is "ridin' dirty kylo", which is a combination of collision detector, expert handling, and pattern analyzer. It's just funny as **** to roll kylo onto debris without consequence while seeing this giant model dance around like an Interceptor

Palpatine gets a ride to provide action independent modifiers (since we're too busy Expertly Handling) and also pops out crits for kylo. Now, Advanced Optics make it a tiny bit more legit with a threatening, fully modded 4-die alpha  

It wasn't bad actually, pre Palp and x7 Nerf I ran it with Omega L and a delta. Nowadays, vcx Fenn will easily two round it 

Edited by ficklegreendice

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15 minutes ago, Stay On The Leader said:

http://stayontheleader.blogspot.co.uk/2017/10/squadbuilding-trial-and-error-with.html

Check out the above blog for Upsilon shenanigans, especially the second half :-)

That was an interesting blog post, for me because of the thought process you show.

Would you change OL to a Rho with Harpoons by now?

It would make Vader your endgame ship, add some burst offense (as opposed to the DoT from OL) and double syngergize with all the crits you already generate.

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I had some fun with it when it was released, but I haven't put it on the table in a year.

Jank List Incoming

Stridan: FCS, Systems Officer, Targeting Synchronizer

Pure Sabaac: VI, title, LWF

Wampa

Scimitar Squad Pilot: Harpoon, EM, Chips

Drive at the opponent with Stridan, Sabaac and Wampa on the flanks with the Scimitar close.  If possible, use systems officer to toss Sabaac a TL, coordinate an action if you want or take a TL.  Sabaac shoots, can use his or Stridan's TL, after Stridan shoots with FCS the bomber can use his TL to fire off his missile.

Everything on the table with the exception of Stridan is pretty weak defensively so this doesn't hold up to meta lists, it's a fair amount of fun though.

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I've flown an effective 53 point Stridan next to a 47 point Kylo Silencer, it was fun and thematic.

Stridan /w Gunner, Rebel Captive, FCS, Pattern Analyzer, Targeting Synchronizer, Engine Upgrade and Kylo Ren's Shuttle title

Kylo Ren w/ PTL, Advanced Sensors, Advanced Optics, Autothrusters, First Order Vanguard.

 

Sure, it dies to Cancer pretty fast, but it's fun and matte black. I've been tempted to swap out the Gunner/RC for Palp to make Kylo a tougher nut, but then the shuttle loses some of its whallop.

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Get that thing where you want it.

 

Kylo,expert handling,engine upgrade.

Maybe pattern abuser (analyser)and or inspiring recruit.

 

Otherwise, my standard is dormitz backdraft and quickdraw all of them with hyperwave com scanners to place at ps 12 ...then enjoy putting fully molded cruise missiles on the enemy on turn 1.

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1 hour ago, Jehovah Netto said:

At the very least, the Upsilon needed a kturn of some sort. 

So, I thought as a community we were pissed that large based ships were too maneuverable for a starfighter game.

******

Anyways, how I have fun with the Ups is:

Kylo Ren (48)
Upsilon-class Shuttle (34), Swarm Leader (3), Fire-Control System (2), Agent Kallus (2), Rebel Captive (3), Sensor Cluster (2), Weapons Guidance (2)

Baron of the Empire (24) x 4
TIE Advanced Prototype (19), Veteran Instincts (1), Cruise Missiles (3), TIE/v1 (1), Guidance Chips (0)

The Barons take their alpha strike, then hang out with Ren and feed him evade tokens.  This list is then filled out to Epic status with other goodness.

Edited by Darth Meanie

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The Upsilon is one of my favorite ships to fly because of its looks and four attack dice alone, but it's always a struggle to find exactly how best to use it.

As a heavy hitting support ship (which is what I ideally would want it to be) it's too easy to put too many points into it and not have enough points left for good, solid fighters that receive the support. Then it's just a big chunk of easy-to-kill points for my opponent. But if I don't put enough points into the support aspect, then it's really not doing its job very well and wasn't worth the points to bring anyways.

I've tried running it as an "attack shuttle" kind of build, including the "Ridin' Dirty" Kylo build. That's probably the more fun and somewhat effective way to use it for the points that get invested into it. But there's just so many options for ships that do what the Upsilon can do at that point, but with far less point investment.

It sure is fun to use for First Order themed casual lists though. It probably has the most intimidating silhouette of any ship just because of that wingspan.

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35pt+ support ships dont fit well in the 100/6 game. Making the Ups offensive cranks it up to 45-50pt-sh, and by that time you should be thinking about a Decimator for offense instead of a single arc ship.

Upsilon woulda been great for the 2 dice ships, if 2 dice ships meant anything to the game anymore, cause Stridan and Hux tossing focuses to 3 ships is cool.

Stridan with something similar like Kylos title and Opspec is already 37pts and you can get a fully kitted out Quickdraw for that price.

I think the Upsilon should of had Kylos title be free. Just having the Starkiller with title for 30pts could be decent. Once it starts going over 30pts for support, you are entering the "awesome aces" territory for imperials which is almost always better to have Ryad,Vessery,Quickdraw,Inquisitor,Vader,etc than a single arc large slow support ship. The Uwing doesnt even get played and its 23pts with at least a crappy way to turn around.

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1 hour ago, Darth Meanie said:

So, I thought as a community we were pissed that large based ships were too maneuverable for a starfighter game.

******

Anyways, how I have fun with the Ups is:

Kylo Ren (48)
Upsilon-class Shuttle (34), Swarm Leader (3), Fire-Control System (2), Agent Kallus (2), Rebel Captive (3), Sensor Cluster (2), Weapons Guidance (2)

Baron of the Empire (24) x 4
TIE Advanced Prototype (19), Veteran Instincts (1), Cruise Missiles (3), TIE/v1 (1), Guidance Chips (0)

The Barons take their alpha strike, then hang out with Ren and feed him evade tokens.  This list is then filled out to Epic status with other goodness.

So give her a modification that allows a kturn with a condition. One adiitinonal stress maybe?

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4 hours ago, Celestial Lizards said:

A really funny thing you can do is take Dormitz and two Starkiller Base Pilots, give them all Hyperwave Comm Scanner, and set up the SBPs in the middle of the board, where they can swoop in and engage the enemy with the focus or evade they grabbed earlier. 

i've seen this squad used scarily effectively, actually. You've also got enough points to hand each of them either Fire Control system or Pattern Analyser or Advanced Optics.

 

Stridan can be good as a support ship - with Hux and  System Officer it can spew tokens with gay abandon, whilst Stridan with the title and Death Troopers should be good at drawing fire and spewing stress.

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1 hour ago, Derpzilla88 said:

The Upsilon is one of my favorite ships to fly because of its looks and four attack dice alone, but it's always a struggle to find exactly how best to use it.

As a heavy hitting support ship (which is what I ideally would want it to be) it's too easy to put too many points into it and not have enough points left for good, solid fighters that receive the support. Then it's just a big chunk of easy-to-kill points for my opponent. But if I don't put enough points into the support aspect, then it's really not doing its job very well and wasn't worth the points to bring anyways.

I've tried running it as an "attack shuttle" kind of build, including the "Ridin' Dirty" Kylo build. That's probably the more fun and somewhat effective way to use it for the points that get invested into it. But there's just so many options for ships that do what the Upsilon can do at that point, but with far less point investment.

It sure is fun to use for First Order themed casual lists though. It probably has the most intimidating silhouette of any ship just because of that wingspan.

I have found that you have to be aggressive with the Upsilon-class as its taking up a lion's share of your points in the 35-40 range. You have to have it do some work, as opposed to some people that used to run away with Palp shuttles and not get attacks on target. You generally don't want to use to many upgrades on them, however, as they will not get many shots on target, so you want to stay away from the 40-50 point boats.

That said, now that I don't have a tournament coming up for a bit, I am totally going to make an alt art card and be running this at my local gamestore nights for giggles:

Major Stridan (32)
Reinforced Deflectors (3)
Emperor Palpatine Supreme Leader Snoke (8)
Weapons Guidance (2)
Pattern Analyzer (2)
Anti-Pursuit Lasers (2)
Kylo Ren's Shuttle (2)

Kylo Ren (TIE Silencer) (35)
Push the Limit (3)
Advanced Sensors (3)
Advanced Optics (2)
Autothrusters (2)
First Order Vanguard (2)

Total: 98

 

Edited by kris40k

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