Jump to content
Tonbo Karasu

Elemental Cycle & Scorpion Pack Spoilers

Recommended Posts

Oguri - overcosted, underpowered, abilities don't gel together. Vulnerable to Assassinate, being bowed or any Actions. What is there to really like?

Remember, being ok doesn't cut the mustard. The arms race is real, a card needs to be good to great or GTFO.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like Oguri as a cheap alternative to Shuichi. Being vulnerable to Assassinate is actually a boon in a dishonor deck for the same reason Hiruma Yojimbo was relevant for as long as she was.

We finally have a third good Courtier for Crab. I already know the changes I'm going to make to my deck to switch from Shugenja Keeper to Courtier Keeper.

The ability is a trap. Even if he didn't have it this guy would be worth playing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

l5c15_cardfan_a6.png

Posting this image just for Seppun Truthseeker.

At first I thought he was good against Dishonor Scorpion. But then I realized that he actually can fit well in a Dishonor Scorpion deck with a few more mill cards, going for that -5 Honor. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Duciris said:

l5c15_doji-fumiki_a6.png

So Fumiki is a conflict character, but has no influence cost...

If the best cards for each clan can't be splashed, won't everyone continue to splash Dragon?

There are always a few conflict cards that can't be splashed as they are meant to be unique to the clan like the Way of's and Kachiko (and frankly a named character is a perfect example of one that should be like that).  

The only thing that will kill the prevalence of Dragon Splash is reliable neutral attachment hate so that Let Go is no longer a must include for most decks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Schmoozies said:

There are always a few conflict cards that can't be splashed as they are meant to be unique to the clan like the Way of's and Kachiko (and frankly a named character is a perfect example of one that should be like that).  

The only thing that will kill the prevalence of Dragon Splash is reliable neutral attachment hate so that Let Go is no longer a must include for most decks.

I raise you Shosuro Sadako from the Phoenix Clan pack. :D

shosuro-sadako.png

The other thing that will balance the splash equation will be good cards that players have to choose between.  Neutral attachment removal fixes 1 issue, and I'll be really surprised (well, to an extent) if the next cycle doesn't have an alternative.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the Yasuki isn't the worst character on paper (Grade "okay" seems about right) but I guess if we are going talk everything in terms of an arms race. then Crab got shafted. It's quite obvious there is a covert tax on character. The skirmisher only works for one conflict and one turn as its "tax".

I just want to compare the new Crane to Height of Fashion for a moment...Wow, that attachment is even less valuable now considering it has to be attached to an existing character and only at a certain time. The Doji can pop in at anytime. Sure, the attachment has +1 on the Doji but no ability and cannot participate in any conflicts. I'm boggled by the attachment "tax" when it passes the +2 threshold, everything just becomes taxed like crazy while (conflict) characters are considered in another bracket while providing so much more value.

Edited by Hordeoverseer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
53 minutes ago, Schmoozies said:

The only thing that will kill the prevalence of Dragon Splash is reliable neutral attachment hate so that Let Go is no longer a must include for most decks.

Dragon will still have a 2/1 for 1/covert on anyone, a powerful early game bow effect, and the harpoon tattoo. Neutral attachment hate will just mean you'll see Tattoo+Fury or Tattoo+Wanderer instead.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The problem with Let Go is that it's a pillar of the eco system that it might have some other consequences. I suspect even that it might boost Dragon Clan indirectly as Path Finder's Blade and Cloud the Mind have zero good answers.

 

(Sorry, I thought we were talking about restricting Let Go)

Edited by Hordeoverseer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
55 minutes ago, Duciris said:

I raise you Shosuro Sadako from the Phoenix Clan pack. :D

shosuro-sadako.png

The other thing that will balance the splash equation will be good cards that players have to choose between.  Neutral attachment removal fixes 1 issue, and I'll be really surprised (well, to an extent) if the next cycle doesn't have an alternative.

You will note I did not specifically say every named character needs to be like that , however I do feel the the majority of them should should.  I would make an exception for the Shinobi because you know the whole infiltration and sneaking into places they shouldn't be. ;) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, DarwinsDog said:

Dragon will still have a 2/1 for 1/covert on anyone, a powerful early game bow effect, and the harpoon tattoo. Neutral attachment hate will just mean you'll see Tattoo+Fury or Tattoo+Wanderer instead.

They will have those toys except Fury is a restricted list card and the tattoo is likely to follow soon or be due for an errata to fix the obvious overpowering effect.  Taking the splash for one of those effects limits you from taking other powerful in clan cards for most factions so that is a fair trade off and makes the auto include nature of them less questionable (do I want Fury or the option of Charge/Iron Mine/Forged Edicts/Pathfinder's Blade are all tough calls, so much so that most Dragon players are skipping Fury for their Crab Splash). As to Wanderer, yes it is a strong ability but other splashes have equally strong abilities that can be just as enticing so it doesn't force an auto include as the default choice for most non-Dragon decks the way Let Go does.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yeah, frankly, I'm fairly confident that the reason dragon dominates the splash market is that we have let go + other powerful card. Every clan has splashable powerful cards, only we have let go, and that is a problem, because let go is basically the only good way to deal with attachments. Sure there's miya mystic, but she's a mediocre character that sacs herself for her ability, so she's not really worth buying for any reason other than her ability, and calling in favors requires you to dishonor someone, and the rest of scorpion doesn't necessarily mesh as well with some clans the way dragon can.

Out of core, let go should have been a 1 cost neutral event, because attachment hate is a necessity, and thus a good attachment hate card will become a staple, so when the best attachment hate card is clan locked, of course that's gonna be everyone else's splash clan. I understand that they gave us the attachment hate card because we're supposed to be the attachment masters, but I think it would have been better if they did the 1 cost neutral let go and gave us an attachment recovery event out of core, like "action: put an attachment in your discard pile into your hand." Call it something like reforge or something.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, psychie said:

yeah, frankly, I'm fairly confident that the reason dragon dominates the splash market is that we have let go + other powerful card. Every clan has splashable powerful cards, only we have let go, and that is a problem, because let go is basically the only good way to deal with attachments. Sure there's miya mystic, but she's a mediocre character that sacs herself for her ability, so she's not really worth buying for any reason other than her ability, and calling in favors requires you to dishonor someone, and the rest of scorpion doesn't necessarily mesh as well with some clans the way dragon can.

Out of core, let go should have been a 1 cost neutral event, because attachment hate is a necessity, and thus a good attachment hate card will become a staple, so when the best attachment hate card is clan locked, of course that's gonna be everyone else's splash clan. I understand that they gave us the attachment hate card because we're supposed to be the attachment masters, but I think it would have been better if they did the 1 cost neutral let go and gave us an attachment recovery event out of core, like "action: put an attachment in your discard pile into your hand." Call it something like reforge or something.

Unfortunately, attachment recovery would be absolutely broken with Adopted Kin.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, Duciris said:

Unfortunately, attachment recovery would be absolutely broken with Adopted Kin.

It would have to be heavily restricted if released now, likely limited to only weapons,which would still be very strong with Pathfinder's Blade in the mix, but since there was no Kin at the launch if they had gone that route instead of Let Go it may have been viable and likely wouldn't have required printing Adopted Kin.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm probably a little more bothered that the kimono is worn wrong on the Yasuki, it's supposed to be left side over right side and not the other way around, when it comes to living people anyway. Maybe it was initially meant that way but the setting is less forgiving on art flips. I can see why they did it, since it's framed on the card better.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 9/21/2018 at 3:33 PM, Hordeoverseer said:

I'm probably a little more bothered that the kimono is worn wrong on the Yasuki, it's supposed to be left side over right side and not the other way around, when it comes to living people anyway. Maybe it was initially meant that way but the setting is less forgiving on art flips. I can see why they did it, since it's framed on the card better.

The art was drawn from the POV of the person wearing it, which in turn is looking at a mirror. 

Edited by Tabris2k

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, no, no... You **** dirty apes. You blew it all up. A Scorpion conflict courtier. Great, now pretty much anyone who wants to can run Forged Edict.

Stolen Secrets is intriguing.

I assume Making an Opening requires you to have a higher bid than your opponent so between that and needing to participate to use it it's rather underwhelming.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, LordBlunt said:

Stolen Secrets.... for 1 Fate look through 4 cards, removal of card face down, then you get to play it as if it’s in your hand... ?

BROKEN. 

 

(IMO, not intriguing)

Don’t forget about putting the other 3 cards back in the order you want. A minor benefit, but a benefit nonetheless. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, LordBlunt said:

Stolen Secrets.... for 1 Fate look through 4 cards, removal of card face down, then you get to play it as if it’s in your hand... ?

BROKEN. 

 

(IMO, not intriguing)

 

1 Fate and 1 Fate off a character.

IDK, I'd consider running it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, shineyorkboy said:

I assume Making an Opening requires you to have a higher bid than your opponent so between that and needing to participate to use it it's rather underwhelming.

If I bid five and you bid one, the difference is four. If I bid one and you bid five, the difference is four. I'm not seeing any reason why those two situations wouldn't both trigger the penalty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...