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Fmartinez

Double AT-ST (dATST), Is this crazy?

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The focus is to use the ATSTs and Vader to even up the difference in infantry units using suppression and direct attrition. Use the ATST's arc to cover their backs as much as possible.

 

Darth Vader, Saber Throw, Force Reflexes, Force Choke    (230)

ATST, Mortar launcher, DW3 grenade launcher (220)

ATST, 8B TLB cannon (215)

Stormtroopers (44) x2

Stormtroopers, Grappling hooks (47)

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It looks like a whole lot of fun.

I'd switch the DW3 off of 1 and put it on 2. I get the idea of walking forward to cover more ranges but I think you're splitting your kill box too much by having range 4+ and 1-2 on the same unit. 

Then deploy them in a corner to protect their rear arc and reap the battlefield. :) 

That said, the meta of your group will quickly change to counter this list.

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I don't think this list works with Vader as the commander. You only have 3 troops + Vader. This makes obj missions fairly difficult for you. 

I think the list has potential if you runs Veers over Vader and a few extra squads.

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I think you could drop the grenade launcher and mortar launcher for another 88 TLB cannon. Drop force choke from vader and get two scopes for two troopers to make them a little more reliable to hit, or grenades. You'll only get deal suppression (aside from the mortar) if you deal damage.

 

If you  want to use the grenade launcher and the suppression mortar you might want to change them up since they are very conflicting on what the at-st is doing, it has a short range weapon that if it never uses it is wasted points and if you move in close range once you get to range 3 the motar is useless. Could also drop the grenade launcher and go for double motar launcher for multiple supression stacking on the at-sts, one with the mortar launcher and the other with a mortar launcher and 88TLBC then you have points for two scopes on two units.

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12 hours ago, Oberron said:

I think you could drop the grenade launcher and mortar launcher for another 88 TLB cannon.

I would totally change it in the other way. Giving both AT-ST a mortar launcher and nothing else. At least this is the list i was going to test when using two AT-ST.

Being able to attack over the whole map without any limit, giving suppression token just for the attack and (with some luck) being able to panik a troop in the first turn and let them run off the board is just fun. But it really depend on the board, and if you have LOS to most units.

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Most objectives will be tough. Especially if there is a fair amount of LOS terrain. Also some of the deployment setups could really hurt your ability to control the board.

Personally I think that is the way this game should be played to avoid two players blasting away from each other in there deployment zones.

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19 hours ago, Oberron said:

I think you could drop the grenade launion stacking on the at-sts, one with the mortar launcher and the other with a mortar launcher and 88TLBC then you have points for two scopes on two units.

 

Suppression if I roll damage, correct?

Force choke is there so Vader can directly kill the heavy weapon specs without having to go through the whole unit with damage. Is it still not justified?

I felt giving the stormtroopers upgrades wasn't the best investment considering that they are only a 4 unit squad. 

My thoughts on the contradictory range is that because you can split up your attacks you can use the grenade launcher on something that got close or Speeder bikes and still use the mortar on a unit farther away.

 

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I think Force Choke is pretty good.  I'm actually finding I like to hold Vader back enough that I often don't need to refresh reflexes and having Choke lets me get a good amount of additional work out of him on a lot of turns.  It still gets cut when I need 5 points, but I am realizing more and more that maybe I shouldn't.

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9 hours ago, nungunz said:

Scopes aren't great on stormtroopers. You are already re-rolling 3 dice on them, not sure how much 4 dice is going to get you.

The points should be spent elsewhere but if it's a unit with a Heavy unit and extra trooper, it can be nice to have if the rest of the list has already been filled.
Probably be better to spend the points on Grenades though

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13 minutes ago, Mirkon said:

The points should be spent elsewhere but if it's a unit with a Heavy unit and extra trooper, it can be nice to have if the rest of the list has already been filled.
Probably be better to spend the points on Grenades though

Fair point, can be especially useful with a rocket launcher unit.

I'm still not 100 percent convinced on grenades either, depends on how much area terrain is used.

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2 hours ago, Fmartinez said:

 

Suppression if I roll damage, correct?

Force choke is there so Vader can directly kill the heavy weapon specs without having to go through the whole unit with damage. Is it still not justified?

I felt giving the stormtroopers upgrades wasn't the best investment considering that they are only a 4 unit squad. 

My thoughts on the contradictory range is that because you can split up your attacks you can use the grenade launcher on something that got close or Speeder bikes and still use the mortar on a unit farther away.

 

 

Suppression is after an attack if you roll damage, yes that is correct i was mistaken on my first post.

 

I thought force choke was a trooper unit not a trooper mini, that kinda changes thing. But its a range 1 limit which means vader would be able to destroy the unit by himself most likely or at the least keep it tied up in combat, if vader is already that close that unit is about to take a pounding from vader. Reflexes is to good on vader to not use and refresh for free every turn.

 

As for splitting attacks I see the only reason to split attacks only as a last option since you are now dividing your potential damage among two different units., the grenade launcher is only 2 black dice so at best you are killing 2 troopers with it and next to 0 damage on anything with armor. You are better off using the twinblaster cannon that comes standard on the at-st since it will do more damage on anything the grenade launcher could target if you are insistence on firing the mortar that turn, or fire both the TBC and the grenade launcher at the same target which has a very good chance at heavy damage on any target.

 

If you aren't to fond of the scopes then grenades is solid since its black dice, a solid upgrade from the Strooper's white dice attacks. Troopers are a solid investment since they score on more things then other units can.

 

Another idea is drop the grenade launcher, force choke, grappling hooks, and 88TLB cannon and grab another mortar launcher on the other at-st and turn your three troopers into squads of 5, having more bodies in units makes them more likely to live longer which means scoring more objectives. Couldn't figure out a way to get that last point for another squad of 4.

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16 hours ago, nungunz said:

Fair point, can be especially useful with a rocket launcher unit.

I'm still not 100 percent convinced on grenades either, depends on how much area terrain is used.

The idea is to build a list without knowing terrain, opponent or objective so I guess most choices will come with a bit of a risk.

The commong thing for grenades of course is that they require you to close in on the enemy so if you have a slow moving army of low-mobility troops then grenades are only good for spending leftover points imo.

Though the Impact grenades can be devastating if you manage to get a full squad close enough!

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12 hours ago, Soulless said:

The commong thing for grenades of course is that they require you to close in on the enemy so if you have a slow moving army of low-mobility troops then grenades are only good for spending leftover points imo.

Unless, of course, your opponent shows up with a lot of short-range firepower.

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On 4/4/2018 at 5:07 PM, Oberron said:

As for splitting attacks I see the only reason to split attacks only as a last option since you are now dividing your potential damage among two different units.

Splitting attacks is very powerful because of suppression: you can only add 1 Suppression token per attack, regardless of how many hits you inflict (plus any from the Suppressive keyword). If you split fire to attack two trooper units, you could deprive two enemy units of an action each. If your next unit splits its attacks, you could then panic both of those units!

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9 hours ago, elbmc1969 said:

Splitting attacks is very powerful because of suppression: you can only add 1 Suppression token per attack, regardless of how many hits you inflict (plus any from the Suppressive keyword). If you split fire to attack two trooper units, you could deprive two enemy units of an action each. If your next unit splits its attacks, you could then panic both of those units!

 

And killing a unit removes all of its actions or reducing it to 1 or 2 men makes it so ineffective that they might as well be a non issue. Suppression is nice, death or next to it and suppressed is better. Plus doesn't give the opponent time to rally in between split firing . And if fighting against imperial with Vader you won't be able to panic a unit in range of him.

Edited by Oberron

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Interesting idea with 2 ATST and Vader!!!

 

I would suggest:

Vader: Choke, Throw, Meditation

3 x 4 Troopers

2 x ATST: Mortar, Grande Launcher

 

Wanted Reflexes over Choke, but no points.

 

I think double ATST needs 2 mortars. Dropping 4 suppression onto enemy every turn seems too good (added to Vader suppression drops and people should start running).

Meditation is so Vader can be far away from ATST and still give one orders.

Generally Vader and troopers 'bubble up'.

 

I think Veers and more troopers would be better than Vader with 2 ATST - but good luck

 

 

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1 hour ago, Shraken said:

Reflexes and saber throw are both must haves for Vader. 

 

I'm slowly considering Reflexes optional.  You probably SHOULD have it, but Vader often wants to hold his activation back long enough that he doesn't get as much out of it as it feels when you first play him and use him overly aggressive.  Saber Throw, however, remains mandatory, IMO.

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