Sit Tight stalemate

[brettpkelly 774]

Sit Tight: Use at the start of a round. You do not activate any groups this round until you have more ready deployment cards than your opponent. 

What happens if two players with an equal number of deployments both play this card? As written, neither of them would ever be able to activate a group. This would either end the game at time, or cause a stalemate. 

This is an extremely rare case, but it could use an FAQ or ruling for clarity sake. 

 

 

[a1bert 4,115]

True, if both have Sit Tight (which the pass rule almost obsoleted - would a player take Sit Tight without Zillo Technique?) in hand and play it, and if both armies do have the same number of (undefeated) deployment cards.

I wonder which one of the two obvious rulings would be better for the game.

You better fire a question towards Todd.

(The third ruling from the tournament regs would be: Unsportsmanship conduct and holding up the game would disqualify the player who played Sit Tight if the player with initiative already played Sit Tight during the same start of round trigger.)

Edited April 2, 2018 by a1bert

[Szycha 134]

IMO there are two possible interpretations - ignore both sit tights entirely (just like with devious scheme - which would need errata) or skip the whole activation phase during this round and proceed to status phase (take a note, that the skirmish rules are not clear in this case, because they present  two different triggers for status phase (p. 4)

5. Activation phase (...) Once all Deployment cards are exhausted, players proceed to the Status Phase.

6. Status Phase: After all figures have been activated, players resolve the cleanup steps in preparation for the next game round. (not always all figures become activated during Activation phase - ie. Take Initiative exhaust)

It can lead to a conclusion, that status phase occurs when no more figures can activate (which happens in a presented situation) and not only when all of the figures have been activated/are exhausted.

However, I don't think, that the second interpretation is right either, because "Activation phase" status phase trigger is more precise and works well + the "status phase" ruling feels more like a description of the phase rather, then the actual rulling.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 3, 2018 by Szycha

[GottaBadFeelingAboutThis 304]

7 hours ago, Szycha said:

IMO there are two possible interpretations - ignore both sit tights entirely (just like with devious scheme - which would need errata) or skip the whole activation phase during this round and proceed to status phase (take a note, that the skirmish rules are not clear in this case, because they present  two different triggers for status phase (p. 4)

5. Activation phase (...) Once all Deployment cards are exhausted, players proceed to the Status Phase.

6. Status Phase: After all figures have been activated, players resolve the cleanup steps in preparation for the next game round. (not always all figures become activated during Activation phase - ie. Take Initiative exhaust)

It can lead to a conclusion, that status phase occurs when no more figures can activate (which happens in a presented situation) and not only when all of the figures have been activated/are exhausted.

However, I don't think, that the second interpretation is right either, because "Activation phase" status phase trigger is more precise and works well + the "status phase" ruling feels more like a description of the phase rather, then the actual rulling.

 

That's fascinating. You're definitely correct that the rules-as-written call for all figures to "have been activated" when Take Initiative or Change of Plans can exhaust one or more without activating. Your solution is elegant, though I don't think the rules are clear on it (those cases could be -- perhaps even more aptly -- described as "when all deployments are exhausted" as readily as "when no more figures can activate"). I imagine we still need to, ahem, sit tight, until a ruling from above.

That said, there is something thematic to the card about skipping straight to the status phase: if two armies both elect to sit tight in a given round, then you really could rule that the round effectively ends. A bit reminiscent of WWI trench warfare or something.

[Tvboy 3,529]

I feel like there just needs to be a rule that if both players do not activate a group in succession, the round ends. Most other games have a "double pass" rule like this that prevents these types of things from happening.

Edited April 7, 2018 by Tvboy

[brettpkelly 774]

Skipping a round can be a pretty big swing: Passing initiative, scoring end of round points, getting end of round attacks with Han or Vader. I think it's too swingy of an effect, even though it's so rare. I'd rather the two cards just cancel each other out.

[DTDanix 845]

I think you both just get ejected from the tournament.

[brettpkelly 774]

Got a ruling on this:

Hi Brett,

 

Thanks for pointing this out. If it ever comes up, the player who has initiative should have to make the first move.

 

Todd Michlitsch
Game Developer
Fantasy Flight Games
tmichlitsch@fantasyflightgames.com

[DerBaer 1,223]

Todd ruled likewise before. Start of round, the player with the initiative plays Sit Tight, then the other player plays Sit Tight, overriding the first player's Sit Tight.

The same thing happens, when both players use R2-D2's command card on the same round. The second instance overrides the first instance.

The only exception is Take Initiative. Player with initiative does nothing in his start of round window, then the other player uses Take Initiative. The first player cannot play his Take Initiative now, because his start of round window has already ended.

With that exception, it's always "The second instance overrides the first instance."

Edited April 22, 2018 by DerBaer

[Szycha 134]

On 21.04.2018 at 7:22 PM, brettpkelly said:

Got a ruling on this:

Hi Brett,

 

Thanks for pointing this out. If it ever comes up, the player who has initiative should have to make the first move.

 

Todd Michlitsch
Game Developer
Fantasy Flight Games
tmichlitsch@fantasyflightgames.com

The funny thing is, that this interpretations is obviously the easiest and most intuitive and yet no one came into it

[a1bert 4,115]

26 minutes ago, Szycha said:

The funny thing is, that this interpretations is obviously the easiest and most intuitive and yet no one came into it

It was covered by "the obvious one" in my first reply. ;p

 

[Szycha 134]

12 hours ago, a1bert said:

It was covered by "the obvious one" in my first reply. ;p

 

YOU DID IT AGAIN!

Edited April 26, 2018 by Szycha

[a1bert 4,115]

I had to leave to someone else to say it aloud - I don't want to hog all the fun - but either people thought it was obvious as well, but although not worded the same way, you ( @Szycha) actually did say it ( "ignore both sit tights entirely" ).

 

Edited April 26, 2018 by a1bert

[Szycha 134]

Holy cows! I am genius!