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veiv

Suppression

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Does anyone think that suppression should be tweaked a bit? As it stands, even a depleted unit can suppress a full strength unit even if it's in heavy cover, or more basic, any unit that is attacked has extremely high odds of being suppressed regardless of cover, strength etc. I could see the logic of the threshold being 1 for vehicles but for infantry standard weapons in particular it seems low. Maybe at least a red def die when in cover. Thoughts?

 

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1 minute ago, veiv said:

Does anyone think that suppression should be tweaked a bit? As it stands, even a depleted unit can suppress a full strength unit even if it's in heavy cover, or more basic, any unit that is attacked has extremely high odds of being suppressed regardless of cover, strength etc. I could see the logic of the threshold being 1 for vehicles but for infantry standard weapons in particular it seems low. Maybe at least a red def die when in cover. Thoughts?

 

I think it’s fine as is. It makes sense that one trooper can suppress a squad as most people would be trying to avoid being shot.

Edited by Derrault

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Agreed it's good to avoid being shot. Typically though, in a combat situation suppression means that a unit is under fire from a heavy weapon not just small arms fire, unless at an excessive volume.  

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3 minutes ago, veiv said:

Agreed it's good to avoid being shot. Typically though, in a combat situation suppression means that a unit is under fire from a heavy weapon not just small arms fire, unless at an excessive volume.  

Suppression fire is all about volume, the intention isn’t to actually hit something, just to force a target to keep their heads down while allies maneuver. 

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The suppression mechanic came from their development of Dust Warfare and it’s one of my favorite parts of it.  It gives the psychological side of battle.  Sure it’s one guy left, but when you’re in cover and bullets are still blazing away, you don’t know how many you’ve killed it what’s still out there.  And you can hole up in your heavy cover for as long as you want, but eventually the psychological effect of focused fire will get you to panic.

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The word volume is the key. One rifle should not be able to pin an entire squad.. But hey, no worries mate, was just curious if people think this mechanic is on point. I don't personally, but that's what house rules are for. ;-) 

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9 minutes ago, veiv said:

The word volume is the key. One rifle should not be able to pin an entire squad.. But hey, no worries mate, was just curious if people think this mechanic is on point. I don't personally, but that's what house rules are for. ;-) 

One rifle will kill you just as dead as ten.

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2 hours ago, veiv said:

Does anyone think that suppression should be tweaked a bit? As it stands, even a depleted unit can suppress a full strength unit even if it's in heavy cover, or more basic, any unit that is attacked has extremely high odds of being suppressed regardless of cover, strength etc. I could see the logic of the threshold being 1 for vehicles but for infantry standard weapons in particular it seems low. Maybe at least a red def die when in cover. Thoughts?

 

Well, to be honest, a single stormtrooper does not have the best chance of suppressing anyone ;) We start seeing trooper units with higher courage (albeit Spec Forces) that does not care for a single suppression (it's actually beneficial to them!) and if they get two, they only have to drop one in their Rally step to become fully operational again. Thus said, I don't get what you mean by "red die when in heavy cover" - as such defense boost would not stop suppression).

As others stated above, if a unit is taking direct, accurate fire (you need to roll sth!), it deserves to get a suppression token. Also, in my games so far, if a unit was reduced to a single model it usually had better things to do (run away with claimed token, or if it had to stay in place near objective, just Dodge and sit there praying Luke will come to stop Vader from getting close and choking you). Single trooper means he got fired at least a bit, so there is a good chance of him being suppressed himself, and killing might not be a priority.

For now i find the suppression mechanic a really cool addition to the game, though it worries me a bit how will they cope with inevitable droid units. If all droids will be getting a "-" courage value, than eventual CIS infantry would have to be appropriately terrible in other areas :P Also, I love how Commanders interact with courage - last game I played the supply objective (one with troopers claiming tokens) and Disarray deployment. My Rebel Troopers manged to claim one token and duck for some heavy cover. Their defense rolls were superb, but they quickly amassed a ton of suppression (at critical point they had like 6 tokens) so I had to sprint Luke across the battlefield, forsaking the opportunity to kill some other stormies, just to lead by example and prevent my key unit from panicking :D

That commander part is also where I see most people getting confused, I've seen on this forums a few times folks mentioning Vader's "no suppression bubble", which is simply wrong, as it's only "no panic zone" and only the Dark Lord himself cannot get suppressed - which is fitting in my opinion :)

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1 minute ago, Shanturin said:

Well, to be honest, a single stormtrooper does not have the best chance of suppressing anyone ;) We start seeing trooper units with higher courage (albeit Spec Forces) that does not care for a single suppression (it's actually beneficial to them!) and if they get two, they only have to drop one in their Rally step to become fully operational again. Thus said, I don't get what you mean by "red die when in heavy cover" - as such defense boost would not stop suppression).

As others stated above, if a unit is taking direct, accurate fire (you need to roll sth!), it deserves to get a suppression token. Also, in my games so far, if a unit was reduced to a single model it usually had better things to do (run away with claimed token, or if it had to stay in place near objective, just Dodge and sit there praying Luke will come to stop Vader from getting close and choking you). Single trooper means he got fired at least a bit, so there is a good chance of him being suppressed himself, and killing might not be a priority.

For now i find the suppression mechanic a really cool addition to the game, though it worries me a bit how will they cope with inevitable droid units. If all droids will be getting a "-" courage value, than eventual CIS infantry would have to be appropriately terrible in other areas :P Also, I love how Commanders interact with courage - last game I played the supply objective (one with troopers claiming tokens) and Disarray deployment. My Rebel Troopers manged to claim one token and duck for some heavy cover. Their defense rolls were superb, but they quickly amassed a ton of suppression (at critical point they had like 6 tokens) so I had to sprint Luke across the battlefield, forsaking the opportunity to kill some other stormies, just to lead by example and prevent my key unit from panicking :D

That commander part is also where I see most people getting confused, I've seen on this forums a few times folks mentioning Vader's "no suppression bubble", which is simply wrong, as it's only "no panic zone" and only the Dark Lord himself cannot get suppressed - which is fitting in my opinion :)

I was just about to ask if I missed something or if i was playing it correct, you just answered it :)

Leaders courage are counted for Panic, not suppression!

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18 hours ago, Shanturin said:

Well, to be honest, a single stormtrooper does not have the best chance of suppressing anyone ;) We start seeing trooper units with higher courage (albeit Spec Forces) that does not care for a single suppression (it's actually beneficial to them!) and if they get two, they only have to drop one in their Rally step to become fully operational again. Thus said, I don't get what you mean by "red die when in heavy cover" - as such defense boost would not stop suppression).

As others stated above, if a unit is taking direct, accurate fire (you need to roll sth!), it deserves to get a suppression token. Also, in my games so far, if a unit was reduced to a single model it usually had better things to do (run away with claimed token, or if it had to stay in place near objective, just Dodge and sit there praying Luke will come to stop Vader from getting close and choking you). Single trooper means he got fired at least a bit, so there is a good chance of him being suppressed himself, and killing might not be a priority.

For now i find the suppression mechanic a really cool addition to the game, though it worries me a bit how will they cope with inevitable droid units. If all droids will be getting a "-" courage value, than eventual CIS infantry would have to be appropriately terrible in other areas :P Also, I love how Commanders interact with courage - last game I played the supply objective (one with troopers claiming tokens) and Disarray deployment. My Rebel Troopers manged to claim one token and duck for some heavy cover. Their defense rolls were superb, but they quickly amassed a ton of suppression (at critical point they had like 6 tokens) so I had to sprint Luke across the battlefield, forsaking the opportunity to kill some other stormies, just to lead by example and prevent my key unit from panicking :D

That commander part is also where I see most people getting confused, I've seen on this forums a few times folks mentioning Vader's "no suppression bubble", which is simply wrong, as it's only "no panic zone" and only the Dark Lord himself cannot get suppressed - which is fitting in my opinion :)

Played 1st real game today at LGS and it was great fun. The suppression mechanic didn't play out as onerous as I thought it would. Fwiw - What meant by a red def die was the for the rally throw as opposed to the white when in heavy cover. 

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I was worried about suppression before I played.  But I just played my first game and suppression is one of my favorite things about this game.  It very well might be the reason that Stormtroopers cost more than rebel troopers (they can stand next to Vader and ignore it all).  I also like how a single suppression token isn’t that bad.  But if you can concentrate some fire on a single unit you can shut it down hard core with multiple suppression token.  And since this game is about objective and not just killing your enemies suppression is a great way to control you enemies and keep them from doing things, which is really why you want to kill them in the first place.

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4 minutes ago, Hrathen said:

I was worried about suppression before I played.  But I just played my first game and suppression is one of my favorite things about this game.  It very well might be the reason that Stormtroopers cost more than rebel troopers (they can stand next to Vader and ignore it all).  I also like how a single suppression token isn’t that bad.  But if you can concentrate some fire on a single unit you can shut it down hard core with multiple suppression token.  And since this game is about objective and not just killing your enemies suppression is a great way to control you enemies and keep them from doing things, which is really why you want to kill them in the first place.

Yeah vaders immunity to panic is amazing! Rememer though that it ONLY applies to the panic tests, the stormtroopers can still be suppressed just as easily!

 

My though as to why stormies are more expensive is due to their red defense dice and inherent PRECISE. This combination, imo, seem more effective then the white defense dice and NIMBLE of the rebel counterpart.

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