Legion Rules Clarifications FAQ

[Imperial Advisor Arem Heshvaun 9,490]

Requesting admin to please sticky this here.

Please post your rules Questions and Answers here.   We are all learning together.  Hopefully Veterans help welcome in the newer players.

 

 

 

Imperial Players

Darth Vader has Relentless which reads, After you preform a move action, you may perform a free attack action.  Because of Luke Skywalker, you may think Darth Vader is limited to a melee attack.  He is not.  Saber Throw gives him a ranged attack. Darth Vader could, move as a first action, move again as a second action, then as a free action Force throw his lightsaber.

 

 

Here’s a simple one

Vehicles can not be Engaged in Melee combat.  They can move away even when in contact with enemy units.

 

As of right now, you can take an Aim action in Melee.  We may have a clarification on this later on.

[Vineheart01 6,403]

Just by the name alone the Aim in melee sounds fishy, even if it still makes sense to be a thing in context.

[Thraug 1,066]

Melee Aim action seems fine. You spend some time focusing on your attack before you strike, making it more likely to succeed? Instead of doing something else like focusing on "Dodge"ing an attack.

[ColMustang66 7]

44 minutes ago, Imperial Advisor Arem Heshvaun said:

Imperial Players

Darth Vader has Relentless which reads, After you preform a move action, you may perform a free attack action.  Because of Luke Skywalker, you may think Darth Vader is limited to a melee attack.  He is not.  Saber Throw gives him a ranged attack. Darth Vader could, move as a first action, move again as a second action, then as a free action Force throw his lightsaber.

I’m still having trouble with this one. The rules seemed pretty clear that the arrow icon indicated a ‘card action’. That card action THEN gives Vader an attack action. That seems to me to mean that Vader can’t use Saber Throw with Relentless. 

I’ve been too busy to keep up with the forums lately though, so if this was definitively answered I apologize. 

[UnitOmega 2,818]

It's an example used in the RRG, so it's definitely a thing.

Also, "card action" isn't defined as anything specific by the rules. It is a card-based ability which requires an action to activate. The text of Saber throw says basically "The action on this card is an attack action". Since it says it's an attack action, it's an attack action, no ifs, ands or buts. Anything keyed to "attack", "action" or "attack action" procs. 

[ColMustang66 7]

6 minutes ago, UnitOmega said:

It's an example used in the RRG, so it's definitely a thing.

Also, "card action" isn't defined as anything specific by the rules. It is a card-based ability which requires an action to activate. The text of Saber throw says basically "The action on this card is an attack action". Since it says it's an attack action, it's an attack action, no ifs, ands or buts. Anything keyed to "attack", "action" or "attack action" procs. 

Where did it clarify that? I may have missed it. All I found is this on page 17:

 

“If a card action provides a unit with either a move or an attack, performing that move or attack is different than performing a move action or attack action, even though the result is the same.”

That really makes it seems to me that in order to use saber throw you have to use an action to activate the card (which Relentless doesn’t give). Again, sorry if I missed something. 

[NeonWolf 942]

1 minute ago, ColMustang66 said:

Where did it clarify that? I may have missed it. All I found is this on page 17:

 

“If a card action provides a unit with either a move or an attack, performing that move or attack is different than performing a move action or attack action, even though the result is the same.”

That really makes it seems to me that in order to use saber throw you have to use an action to activate the card (which Relentless doesn’t give). Again, sorry if I missed something. 

RRG pg.41 under the Standby entry

Quote

For example, Darth Vader performs a move action to move
into range 2 of a unit of Rebel Troopers that have a standby
token. Before Vader can trigger relentless to perform
an attack with the “Saber Throw” upgrade card, the Rebel
Troopers spend their standby token to perform a move, taking
them beyond range 2 of Darth Vader. With no enemy unit in
range 1–2, Darth Vader can no longer perform an attack.

 

[ColMustang66 7]

8 minutes ago, NeonWolf said:

RRG pg.41 under the Standby entry

 

That answers it then! Thanks,

[Bohemian73 161]

I'm okay with Aim for melee, as I see that as focusing my melee attack. Many game allow some 'focus' to enhance melee or attack.

[KalEl814 1,510]

3 hours ago, Vineheart01 said:

Just by the name alone the Aim in melee sounds fishy, even if it still makes sense to be a thing in context.

If you've ever seen kids in a karate class, you'd know they many of them would benefit from aim tokens.

[Big Easy 429]

Standby action: Can you move with a cumbersome weapon-equipped unit, take a standby token, then later use that cumbersome weapon when the standby triggers? Cumbersome keyword says you cannot move and attack in the same activation, but it seems standby triggers in someone else's activation so it should be okay.

LoS and cover: Yes I know we don't have hard and fast rules due to the apparent "Generally 50%" and "draw a line from base through terrain and each one gives you cover" confusion, but in our game we played it conventionally where you draw the line for cover but if after doing that, the true LoS did not block at least 50% of at least half of the unit, there was no cover bonus given. Based on the RRG I believe this is justified, but I do think the other way is justified too. We just erred on the side of what made more sense looking at the board. This meant that it was hard for vehicles to get cover, even though there were multiple pieces of terrain between them and their attacker (something that is referred to specifically in the RRG).

 

Force Pull allows the puller to move all of the unit's minis into cohesion (rather than the pullee), correct?

When assigning wounds from an attack that comes from a fixed firing arc, do the wound rules (wounds go on wounded units first) override firing arc rules? I know with LoS rules, you can't assign rules to a wounded unit that you can't see, but I didn't know if it's the same for fixed firing arcs.

[dukncuver 71]

19 minutes ago, Big Easy said:

Standby action: Can you move with a cumbersome weapon-equipped unit, take a standby token, then later use that cumbersome weapon when the standby triggers? Cumbersome keyword says you cannot move and attack in the same activation, but it seems standby triggers in someone else's activation so it should be okay.

LoS and cover: Yes I know we don't have hard and fast rules due to the apparent "Generally 50%" and "draw a line from base through terrain and each one gives you cover" confusion, but in our game we played it conventionally where you draw the line for cover but if after doing that, the true LoS did not block at least 50% of at least half of the unit, there was no cover bonus given. Based on the RRG I believe this is justified, but I do think the other way is justified too. We just erred on the side of what made more sense looking at the board. This meant that it was hard for vehicles to get cover, even though there were multiple pieces of terrain between them and their attacker (something that is referred to specifically in the RRG).

 

Force Pull allows the puller to move all of the unit's minis into cohesion (rather than the pullee), correct?

When assigning wounds from an attack that comes from a fixed firing arc, do the wound rules (wounds go on wounded units first) override firing arc rules? I know with LoS rules, you can't assign rules to a wounded unit that you can't see, but I didn't know if it's the same for fixed firing arcs.

It seems all you need is to have one mini of the unit in the firing arc to be able to shoot all of them. Page 28 for fixed front acr says, if part of the mini is in the firing arc then the whole unit is.  I think I'm interpreting this correctly, what do others think?

[Big Easy 429]

4 minutes ago, dukncuver said:

It seems all you need is to have one mini of the unit in the firing arc to be able to shoot all of them. Page 28 for fixed front acr says, if part of the mini is in the firing arc then the whole unit is.  I think I'm interpreting this correctly, what do others think?

I agree that only one mini in the defending unit has to be in arc in order to perform the attack, but do wounds get assigned to the wounded mini in that unit (out of arc) or to a new mini?

If this were a question about LoS and attacks, the answer would be yes, wounds only go to minis you can see. If after assigning all wounds there are no more visible minis, the remaining wounds are canceled. My question is if firing arcs work the same way.

Edited March 23, 2018 by Big Easy

[azavander 150]

owners choice

 

Pg 47 in RRG

 

When a player’s unit suffers wounds, that player chooses a mini from that unit and assigns wound tokens to that mini until either all wounds are suffered or that mini is defeated. If there are unassigned wounds remaining after a mini is defeated, the player choses another mini from the same unit and repeats this process until either every mini in the unit is defeated or all wounds have been suffered.

[Big Easy 429]

29 minutes ago, azavander said:

owners choice

 

Pg 47 in RRG

 

When a player’s unit suffers wounds, that player chooses a mini from that unit and assigns wound tokens to that mini until either all wounds are suffered or that mini is defeated. If there are unassigned wounds remaining after a mini is defeated, the player choses another mini from the same unit and repeats this process until either every mini in the unit is defeated or all wounds have been suffered.

From the same page in the RRG, doesn't mention Firing Arc:

• During an attack, if line of sight to a mini in the defender is blocked from all minis in the attacker, that mini in the defender cannot suffer wounds.
• A mini with at least one wound token assigned to it is wounded. When assigning wound tokens, wounded minis must be chosen to suffer wounds before minis that do not have wound tokens. If the unit leader is wounded, it must be chosen to suffer wounds before minis that do not have wound tokens. If two or more minis in the same unit are wounded, the unit with more wounds must be chosen to suffer wounds before minis with fewer wounds

[azavander 150]

2 minutes ago, Big Easy said:

From the same page in the RRG, doesn't mention Firing Arc:

• During an attack, if line of sight to a mini in the defender is blocked from all minis in the attacker, that mini in the defender cannot suffer wounds.
• A mini with at least one wound token assigned to it is wounded. When assigning wound tokens, wounded minis must be chosen to suffer wounds before minis that do not have wound tokens. If the unit leader is wounded, it must be chosen to suffer wounds before minis that do not have wound tokens. If two or more minis in the same unit are wounded, the unit with more wounds must be chosen to suffer wounds before minis with fewer wounds

I think we are in agreement?  Basically firing arc determines if you can attack the unit.  IE at least one mini in the unit inside of the arc allows you to target the entire unit.  The owner of the target minis gets to choose where the wounds are applied, following the wound rules, IE one is already wounded apply there first, and if nobody sees it then it can take damage.

[TzazikiMann 5]

Hi there,

 

we just had our first game and some questions came up that I could'nt answer:

1. When and how do vehicles pivot?

We played it like a movement action. So you spend 1 action to pivot 90°.

 

2. How do Speeder Bikes maintain cohesion? Do they have a leader?

 

Hope you can answer me

[Big Easy 429]

1 minute ago, azavander said:

I think we are in agreement?  Basically firing arc determines if you can attack the unit.  IE at least one mini in the unit inside of the arc allows you to target the entire unit.  The owner of the target minis gets to choose where the wounds are applied, following the wound rules, IE one is already wounded apply there first, and if nobody sees it then it can take damage.

We definitely aren't disagreeing, but I think this is worth being specifically addressed by FFG. I played it as if firing arc and LoS are distinct mechanics for the purposes of determining whether a mini can be assigned wounds--that is, I had LoS to a wounded mini (out of arc) so that mini has to get the wound, per the wound rules. But I do wonder if the spirit of the rule and the common sense application would be that if you can't fire at a specific mini in a unit because it's out of arc, how could it be assigned a wound? This is the exact reasoning and rule for if you can't see a mini because it's behind a wall. You could roll 15 crits on the attack but it's not getting hit by any of them because no part of the mini is visible. Firing arcs are like LoS for weapons, and that mini would be "invisible" to the AT-RT's weapon in this case, so you could argue it shouldn't get a wound even though it otherwise would due to having already taken wounds.

[Big Easy 429]

Just now, TzazikiMann said:

1. When and how do vehicles pivot?

We played it like a movement action. So you spend 1 action to pivot 90°.

Pivot is a move action, when you take it you can spend one action to pivot the base up to 90° in either direction (p. 37 RRG).

2 minutes ago, TzazikiMann said:

2. How do Speeder Bikes maintain cohesion? Do they have a leader?

Speeder bikes do have a leader and must maintain cohesion AND the same orientation as the leader.

[azavander 150]

4 minutes ago, Big Easy said:

We definitely aren't disagreeing, but I think this is worth being specifically addressed by FFG. I played it as if firing arc and LoS are distinct mechanics for the purposes of determining whether a mini can be assigned wounds--that is, I had LoS to a wounded mini (out of arc) so that mini has to get the wound, per the wound rules. But I do wonder if the spirit of the rule and the common sense application would be that if you can't fire at a specific mini in a unit because it's out of arc, how could it be assigned a wound? This is the exact reasoning and rule for if you can't see a mini because it's behind a wall. You could roll 15 crits on the attack but it's not getting hit by any of them because no part of the mini is visible. Firing arcs are like LoS for weapons, and that mini would be "invisible" to the AT-RT's weapon in this case, so you could argue it shouldn't get a wound even though it otherwise would due to having already taken wounds.

I think i actually do agree with you LoS and Arc are two different mechanics, in my mind, 1 can i target the Unit, yes, so how many minis in the unit do I have LoS to, any of those are eligible to suffer wounds, follow wound application rules

Edited March 23, 2018 by azavander

[Vineheart01 6,403]

Vehicle pivot was mentioned to be "instead of moving normally" in the "Learning to Play" book. While i know that can be a bit confusing since the RR doesnt say it, FFG has flopped on that before (the RR for RWM doesnt say jack squat about Siege Upgrades, but the L2P does)
Pg19 of the L2P under Vehicle Movement
Worth noting (since i did that flop) that you cant pivot as a comp move, that has to be full speed.

Edited March 23, 2018 by Vineheart01

[Daigotsu Armbarred 0]

Do keywords stack? IE, cam you give Stormtroopers (who have Precise 1) the upgrade Targeting Scopes (which gives Precise 1)?

 

I seem to recall reading something about stacking in the RR but can't seem to find it now.

[Big Easy 429]

9 minutes ago, Daigotsu Armbarred said:

Do keywords stack? IE, cam you give Stormtroopers (who have Precise 1) the upgrade Targeting Scopes (which gives Precise 1)?

 

I seem to recall reading something about stacking in the RR but can't seem to find it now.

Yes, it stacks.

[UnitOmega 2,818]

The intent is clearly they stack but I don't think the RRG actually says that yet. 

[Big Easy 429]

Vader still gets suppression tokens (and resulting cover) as normal, yeah?