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The Elephant in the Room: how do you beat Kanan Fenn?

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12 hours ago, RampancyTW said:

Are we just pretending that RAC doesn't have a wingman here or what?

RAC takes 3 damage a turn the first couple of rounds, Kanan should be taking 4 from RAC + Wingman

If Kanan uses PS11 boost to get arc, he's lacking the evade or the focus and takes more damage from RAC.

You're right, if RAC/Ace plays like a complete moron and Kanan/Fenn plays well, Kanan/Fenn will win.  That's how games are supposed to work.

RAC's wingman is going to lose all offensive modifiers to Fenn, either with an ctual HotCop shot or his ability. Thus immaterial until either Kanan or Fenn is dead.

RAC's going to be taking a nearly fully modded primary (Maul+Ezra, Rey + Maul), 3.5-4.5 damage for R2-R1 respectively. Unless the ace has also managed to make R1 on Kanan (a gross error on the Kanan player's part) then the escort is going to be taking a TLT shot.

The simple fact is that the Kanan/Fenn build is designed to beat 2 ship lists. RAC/Palp?kylo is the single 2 ship list that really stands a chance due to all the tokenless modifiers, but the fact remains that one list can mitigate damage and the other can't. It's not about players skill.

9 hours ago, JasonCole said:

Quickdraw” (36)
Special Forces TIE (29), Veteran Instincts (1), Fire-Control System (2), Harpoon Missiles (4), Special Ops Training (0), Guidance Chips (0)

Rear Admiral Chiraneau (62)
VT-49 Decimator (46), Veteran Instincts (1), Emperor Palpatine (8), Kylo Ren (3), Engine Upgrade (4)

RAC has kylo assign damaged cockpit to Fenn, QD harpoons, palps a crit, has chips and reroll, so it *should be* 3-4 damage on Fenn with a crit included, Fenn can't dodge the crit, so he gets the PS0 crit assigned in the first exchange. This removes the ghost's boost at PS11. RAC or QD are gonna get a little pounded this round, but that's the price to pay to get Fenn's coordinate reduced in efficiency. After that, it's easier to deal with the Ghost. Not easy, but easier.

You could almost kill Fenn outright in the first exchange, or very nearly. THe Harpoon's only going to be firing 3 dice because of Kanan, so you're looking at 2 crits plus whatever you happen to roll naturally, so you've only got a 5% chance of missing entirely there, but your expected damage is only 1.6 if Fenn has a focus token. RAC does a similar amount of damage, assuming a R2 shot modded only by his ability. Fenn does some piddly damage to RAC, and the ghost does 4-6 damage to QD with primary and TLT fire.

QD gets a revenge shot, which is going to do about 1 damage at R2, leaving Fenn on either 1 hull or dead. It's immaterial either way, because next turn QD is going to die and RAC'll take more damage, and Kanan will only lose his shields. You're the looking at a 10-12 health RAC versus a 10 health double-tap Ghost with full mods at every round.

If RAC can then stay inside R2 each round while still getting an action he's got a chance, but otherwise Kanan's going to easily win the damage race.

Also keep in mind that Kanan can easily block RAC's move and, ithout Dauntless, the whole list goes down pretty much that turn since you can't Kylo anything, and only have a poor shot on Fenn (probably at R3).

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10 hours ago, Astech said:

RAC's wingman is going to lose all offensive modifiers to Fenn, either with an ctual HotCop shot or his ability. Thus immaterial until either Kanan or Fenn is dead.

If it's relying on tokens, it will.

If it has modifiers from another source (like A Score To Settle, Expertise, Predator, Lone Wolf, Marksmanship, Jonus, Howlrunner, Synced Turret, Palpatine, Kallus etc. not so much.

And we shouldn't worry so much, according to @Captain Pellaeon Twin Laser Turrets are ineffective against high agility ships, so take Whisper, Defenders, Interceptors etc and we're gold.

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7 minutes ago, FTS Gecko said:

If it's relying on tokens, it will.

If it has modifiers from another source (like A Score To Settle, Expertise, Predator, Lone Wolf, Marksmanship, Jonus, Howlrunner, Synced Turret, Palpatine, Kallus etc. not so much.

And we shouldn't worry so much, according to @Captain Pellaeon Twin Laser Turrets are ineffective against high agility ships, so take Whisper, Defenders, Interceptors etc and we're gold.

A core To Settle is pretty uncommon. Expertise, predator, lone Wolf and kallus are all typically on ships kanan eats for breakfast - Defenders, Phantoms, Dash and so on, so no particular worries there.

High agility ships with autothrusters and focus tokesn need not worry, but Fenn takes away at least one of them, so the TLT is completely happy with the trade-off.

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31 minutes ago, gamblertuba said:

Saw a post on Facebook but it disappeared showing a Rey/Nym list that just destroyed Fenn/Kanan en route to winning a tourney but now I can't find it.  Anyone able to help?

NC I believe and it went through 2x Ghost/Fenn lists, both games about 20 minutes each.

 

X-Wing seems to be pretty close to the point where there are too many options for one to remain dominant for long.

Edited by MasterShake2

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Just now, RampancyTW said:

Wait, you mean Kanan/Fenn just doesn't automatically beat 2-ship lists?  Say it ain't so.

I mean Expertise Rey basically ignores everything Fenn does outside of the coordinated boost and easily outpaces a Ghost for damage. Toss on another ship that's good into the match and call it a day.

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Just now, MasterShake2 said:

I mean Expertise Rey basically ignores everything Fenn does outside of the coordinated boost and easily outpaces a Ghost for damage. Toss on another ship that's good into the match and call it a day.

Oh I totally get why it's a good matchup, I just find it hilarious when standard staple meta ships crush THE NEW BOGEYMAN

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I flew Rac / Quickdraw vs Fenn /kannan a few days ago

Rac / Vi, Kylo,Vade,Rebel captive, EU

Quic , Vi, Specops,FCS,Harpoons,LWF,Adv optics 

I just send rac down the throat of fenn, Killed him round 2 due to kanan spending focus, waited with quickdraw , Flew in when Fenn was dead , and allmoste took Kanan down 3 turns later, But the Rac was dead and i did a wrong 3 bank, so i messed upp bad. but i think it might be a tough nut to crack, but unbeatebel ? No, if u kill fenn fast you have a chanse 

 

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49 minutes ago, gamblertuba said:

Saw a post on Facebook but it disappeared showing a Rey/Nym list that just destroyed Fenn/Kanan en route to winning a tourney but now I can't find it.  Anyone able to help?

Probably something like this...if the Rey player doesnt keep the VCX in arc I am pretty sure the 4x TLT just melts the Falcon before it gets a chance to do anything. 

Rey — YT-1300 45
Expertise 4
C-3PO 3
Finn 5
Engine Upgrade 4
Millennium Falcon 1
Ship Total: 62
   
Captain Nym (Rebel) — Scurrg H-6 Bomber 30
A Score to Settle 0
Synced Turret 4
Harpoon Missiles 4
Guidance Chips 0
Ship Total: 38

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1 hour ago, MasterShake2 said:

NC I believe and it went through 2x Ghost/Fenn lists, both games about 20 minutes each.

 

X-Wing seems to be pretty close to the point where there are too many options for one to remain dominant for long.

Nashville regional.  His top 4 match was against Ghost/Fenn, won in 14 minutes, Final Match was against Ghost/Fenn and won in 18 minutes.

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1 hour ago, Boom Owl said:

Probably something like this...if the Rey player doesnt keep the VCX in arc I am pretty sure the 4x TLT just melts the Falcon before it gets a chance to do anything. 

Rey — YT-1300 45
Expertise 4
C-3PO 3
Finn 5
Engine Upgrade 4
Millennium Falcon 1
Ship Total: 62
   
Captain Nym (Rebel) — Scurrg H-6 Bomber 30
A Score to Settle 0
Synced Turret 4
Harpoon Missiles 4
Guidance Chips 0
Ship Total: 38

His list was:

Rey - Expertise, Finn, Kanan, and TFA Title (58)

Nym - VI, Autoblaster Turret, Harpoons, Bomblet, T. Simulator, Genius, G.Chips, Title (41)

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7 hours ago, MasterShake2 said:

I mean Expertise Rey basically ignores everything Fenn does outside of the coordinated boost and easily outpaces a Ghost for damage. Toss on another ship that's good into the match and call it a day.

If both players are equally mid-skilled pilots then yes, Rey has a distinct advantage because the Ghost player will assume that like always they win the joust.

However, if both players are sufficiently smart, the Ghost player kites the edge of the asteroids/board and runs away from Rey, ideally trading range 3 fire but R2 is acceptable. At R2, Rey's doing 2.4 damage a turn. If the Ghost has Rey in arc (very likely in this scenario) at R2, then it's doing 2.45 damage with the primary, and the TLT will do something like 1.5 more. C-3P0 mitigates about half a damage, leaving the total at 3.5 damage from the Ghost and 2.5 from Rey. Considering that Rey has lower hull to begin with, it's a done deal at that point, with the only variable being Rey's wingman.

Thankfully Rey's too expensive to bring a good version of R2-D2 Poe to the table, so you're probably looking at Nym or a light Miranda as the escort, both of which melt to the double TLT.

6 hours ago, SEApocalypse said:

More fun is watching Rey with the new title. :)

Kanan lost this match up on turn 0 with asteroid placement. As mentioned previously, the VCX wants to run and take TLT pot shots and rear arc shots to prevent Rey from closing to R1. Instead, the rocks are spaced incredibly wide apart, with not even the typical 3-rock cluster in the centre of the board. Ideal for Rey's jousting intentions. The VCX player should have done everything he could to make a decent rock cluster and stuck to it, rather than turning in for the joust once Jan was dead.

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6 hours ago, Astech said:

However, if both players are sufficiently smart, the Ghost player kites the edge of the asteroids/board and runs away from Rey, ideally trading range 3 fire but R2 is acceptable. At R2, Rey's doing 2.4 damage a turn. If the Ghost has Rey in arc (very likely in this scenario) at R2, then it's doing 2.45 damage with the primary, and the TLT will do something like 1.5 more. C-3P0 mitigates about half a damage, leaving the total at 3.5 damage from the Ghost and 2.5 from Rey. Considering that Rey has lower hull to begin with, it's a done deal at that point, with the only variable being Rey's wingman.

You say this emboldened part, then immediately flip to the Rey player just plodding along behind the Ghost.  That doesn't seem very smart.

 

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13 minutes ago, gennataos said:

You say this emboldened part, then immediately flip to the Rey player just plodding along behind the Ghost.  That doesn't seem very smart.

Plodding along? The Ghost is faster than the Falcon, and has access to a PS 11 boost. There's literally nothing Rey can do about it. Half the time she's not even flying with engine upgrade.

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4 hours ago, Astech said:

Plodding along? The Ghost is faster than the Falcon, and has access to a PS 11 boost. There's literally nothing Rey can do about it. Half the time she's not even flying with engine upgrade.

She and her wingmate can murder fenn in a round if his greens cooperate or 1.5 if they don't, and he can't stop them from getting full mods.  ANd yes, plodding along.  If it's boosting every round it's limited to a very predictable set of moves, AND it's only evading with Fenn's help, which evaporates quickly under several 4 to 5 hit attacks.

Heck, Rey has a meaningful chance of kiling Fenn in one shot, if she gets range 1.  And she has a good chance of doing that, because he has a sharply limited dial when he's stressed from his ability, or a fairly limited dial even without stress,  and she has white sloops and in may situations is extremely hard to block, because she can do them in either direction and keep her arc in the right place, or do a slow forward move and do the same.

You really do tend to discount the idea that people fly competently against this thing.  Rey is a very solid counter; it's a tough job to stay out of her arc if she's flown even slightly competently, even with a higher-PS large base boost, and she WILL get 4 hits per round, most rounds if you can't.  The right wingmate will get 3 hits per round, and none of it will use tokens unless they're out of Rey's arc, in which case she uses TL, so one out of 4 mods for the list is token based (and she also loses a die, to be fair).

And Rey herself has a solid chance of blocking 2 of the 4 TLT shots per round, more with the right wingmate, when she's in arc - she's very likely to get 2 evades per attack, and 2/4 of those will be minimally modified, and she gets up to a good chance of 3 evades per attack if her wingmate is Lowhhrick, or Jan Ors crew is floating around somewhere.  FWIW, you also seem to be assuming a badly built Rey here; no optimal Rey uses C-3PO.  She uses Kanan and Finn, and probably Countermeasures/Crane or Countermeasures/Stim.  So in a crucial round they're functionally throwing 3 green dice with infinite focus against all your attacks, and one blank reroll to boot, and 4 red dice with equally good mods as the Ghost on its primary.  If you're not using Kanan you lose the ability to keep arc, and if you're not using Finn both your damage and your defence are tanked.

If your basic assumption is (as throughout this thread it seems to be) that the Fenn/Ghost player plays perfectly and everyone else plays like a stupid newbie who doesn't understand either Fenn/Ghost or their own list or indeed build their own list effectively, then yes, Fenn/Ghost will win every time. 

If you assume two players of equal skill and equal proficiency with their own lists, Fenn/Ghost is tough for many opponents and many lists, but has very difficult matchups of its own too.  Rey/Wingmate is one of them.  In particular, Rey/Lowhhrick, which mitigates a lot of the damage Fenn/Ghost throws and ignores entirely most of that list's own mitigation, as well as winning the damage race. 

Fenn is a distinct weak point in the list, having a single defensive ability most rounds (his own pilot ability, as he's spending his action coordinating the ghost most rounds), not many hit points, and no repositioning, and a sharply limited dial because of the stress from his ability; without him the Ghost loses much of its sting, because it has a donut hole and no way to keep higher PS ships out of it.

42 minutes ago, Arma Quattro said:

Actually a decimator with fanatical devotion  might contrast hotcop pretty well. Not to mention  that it will make an eyeball unblockable in attack.

Hux is a terrible thing to do to a deci, it doesn't have the greens to support carrying him.  FD invalidating HSCP is neat, but it's not worth the penalty of having to use Hux when there's no good platform for him.

Hux would be great if the Empire had a crew ship with green turns.  Or indeed, even more than one speed of green bank.

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6 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

She and her wingmate can murder fenn in a round if his greens cooperate or 1.5 if they don't, and he can't stop them from getting full mods.  ANd yes, plodding along.  If it's boosting every round it's limited to a very predictable set of moves, AND it's only evading with Fenn's help, which evaporates quickly under several 4 to 5 hit attacks.

Heck, Rey has a meaningful chance of kiling Fenn in one shot, if she gets range 1.  And she has a good chance of doing that, because he has a sharply limited dial when he's stressed from his ability, or a fairly limited dial even without stress,  and she has white sloops and in may situations is extremely hard to block, because she can do them in either direction and keep her arc in the right place, or do a slow forward move and do the same.

You really do tend to discount the idea that people fly competently against this thing.  Rey is a very solid counter; it's a tough job to stay out of her arc if she's flown even slightly competently, even with a higher-PS large base boost, and she WILL get 4 hits per round, most rounds if you can't.  The right wingmate will get 3 hits per round, and none of it will use tokens unless they're out of Rey's arc, in which case she uses TL, so one out of 4 mods for the list is token based (and she also loses a die, to be fair).

And Rey herself has a solid chance of blocking 2 of the 4 TLT shots per round, more with the right wingmate, when she's in arc - she's very likely to get 2 evades per attack, and 2/4 of those will be minimally modified, and she gets up to a good chance of 3 evades per attack if her wingmate is Lowhhrick, or Jan Ors crew is floating around somewhere.  FWIW, you also seem to be assuming a badly built Rey here; no optimal Rey uses C-3PO.  She uses Kanan and Finn, and probably Countermeasures/Crane or Countermeasures/Stim.  So in a crucial round they're functionally throwing 3 green dice with infinite focus against all your attacks, and one blank reroll to boot, and 4 red dice with equally good mods as the Ghost on its primary.  If you're not using Kanan you lose the ability to keep arc, and if you're not using Finn both your damage and your defence are tanked.

If your basic assumption is (as throughout this thread it seems to be) that the Fenn/Ghost player plays perfectly and everyone else plays like a stupid newbie who doesn't understand either Fenn/Ghost or their own list or indeed build their own list effectively, then yes, Fenn/Ghost will win every time. 

If you assume two players of equal skill and equal proficiency with their own lists, Fenn/Ghost is tough for many opponents and many lists, but has very difficult matchups of its own too.  Rey/Wingmate is one of them.  In particular, Rey/Lowhhrick, which mitigates a lot of the damage Fenn/Ghost throws and ignores entirely most of that list's own mitigation, as well as winning the damage race. 

Fenn is a distinct weak point in the list, having a single defensive ability most rounds (his own pilot ability, as he's spending his action coordinating the ghost most rounds), not many hit points, and no repositioning, and a sharply limited dial because of the stress from his ability; without him the Ghost loses much of its sting, because it has a donut hole and no way to keep higher PS ships out of it.

Hux is a terrible thing to do to a deci, it doesn't have the greens to support carrying him.  FD invalidating HSCP is neat, but it's not worth the penalty of having to use Hux when there's no good platform for him.

Hux would be great if the Empire had a crew ship with green turns.  Or indeed, even more than one speed of green bank.

Sure, Rey can murder Fenn, but while that's happening Kanan is murderising Rey's escort, which will take 2 rounds max. If Rey is shooting Kanan, then she's only actually attacking with 2 dice (except at R1, which is really unlikely), meaning that with perfect rolls and double direct hits she could 1-shot Fenn. However, it's more likely Rey will do 1-2 damage, leaving Fenn pretty healthy for the next turn.

White sloops don't help Rey maintain close range on a ship that's running away and moves after her. Again, Fenn can simply guarantee range 2 shots by flying directly away from Rey.

Both Maul and Ezra are "when attacking" abilities, which operate on the same principle as accuracy corrector, so we're looking at 4 fully modded TLT shots, provided they all hit. In the perfect storm situation (Rey's got both Fenn and Kanan in arc and has triggered Glitterstim and countermeasures) Kanan's TLT shots have only a 20% chance of doing 2 damage, but 50% chance of doing one. That's a great turn for the Rey player, save that n such a turn its an obvious move to target the escort ship instead - halving the health of anything that can fit in the remaining 37 points.

That Expertise/Finn/Kanan/Countermeasures/Glitterstim build is pretty much the most expensive thing you can make in the rebel faction. It leaves you room for a 37 point ace - which isn't even enough for BB-8 Poe or Bomblet Miranda. In saying you're pretty much limited to just Lowhrick as an effective escort.

This gives Kanan a ridiculously easy objective - bump Rey, and pound Lowhrick on the first combat round. With the PS 11 boost on the previous round, Kanan can all but guarantee this happening, or alternatively force Rey to swerve around Kanan, thus losing half her mods. So sure, Fenn'll die on the next turn (unless he cleverly avoids combat entirely), but Rey's much more expensive escort is now gone, and Kanan is running from Rey while winning on points.

At that point, since Rey doesn't have C-3P0, every single range band of attacks goes in kanan's favour, save for the one turn Rey triggers her super-combo. Kanan has a doughnut wedge, which is entierly different to Dash's doughnut hole, and it's seriously hard to exploit for a large-base ship with a single repositioning action.

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7 minutes ago, Astech said:

Both Maul and Ezra are "when attacking" abilities, which operate on the same principle as accuracy corrector, so we're looking at 4 fully modded TLT shots, provided they all hit.

It doesn't work this way. 

TLT only has one 'after defending' trigger point, so Maul's stress removal only happens after both shots have taken place, and only happens once per use of TLT.  So once you've used him on the first shot, you are blocked from using him again for the second shot of that TLT.  Accordingly, you get a single reroll on 2 out of 4 of your TLT shots, or two rerolls on one out of four, at best, if you want to keep using him every round.  Ezra keeps working, as long as you use Maul on the first shot of each TLT use, so you're getting 2 dice of reroll per TLT barrage, and 1 eyeball to crit per shot.  It's good mods but it's not as reliable as you're implying.  It's about the same as AC on average.  WHich is pretty solid, for sure.

--

Correction of your misunderstanding of the rules aside, Rey's pilot ability with Finn is better than 3PO, assuming you get it even half the times you're attacked, which is a very good assumption.

Again, you're assuming everything goes perfectly for Fenn/Ghost and the Rey player plays like a moron.  Getting bumped by the Ghost on the approach is playing way worse than your opponent.  Only getting her ability for one round of the game is playing way worse than your opponent.  Allowing the Ghost/Finn player to set up the rocks such that Rey doesn't have a nice big empty space to play in is playing way worse than your opponent.  Etc etc etc.  Be charitable.  Assume that the opponents of the list you like are playing with equal skill.

Assuming that everyone who plays against this list is a going to do so far better than their opponent doesn't foster meaningful discussion.

Anyone can win with any list if their opponent plays the game far worse than they do.

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35 minutes ago, Astech said:

Sure, Rey can murder Fenn, but while that's happening Kanan is murderising Rey's escort, which will take 2 rounds max. If Rey is shooting Kanan, then she's only actually attacking with 2 dice (except at R1, which is really unlikely), meaning that with perfect rolls and double direct hits she could 1-shot Fenn. However, it's more likely Rey will do 1-2 damage, leaving Fenn pretty healthy for the next turn.

So your list has again Maul, Ezra, Kanan and Engine Boost :D
I am just waiting that you say that the Syn-Turret on Range 1 will murder Rey :D

Yes, that Ghost-Fenn list is a lot more versatile than people make it sound, but each of them comes with unique weaknesses and strengths. Just throwing all strong points of the list together and than call it unbeatable is ... well. 104 point list when you mix all the good stuff together in one list. Either you have boost or you have Kanan or you give up on Maul/Ezra. Your $1 shop comparison with unbeatable prices comes again to mind. It's a scam. ;-)

 

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9 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

TLT only has one 'after defending' trigger point, so Maul's stress removal only happens after both shots have taken place, and only happens once per use of TLT.  So once you've used him on the first shot, you are blocked from using him again for the second shot of that TLT.  Accordingly, you get a single reroll on 2 out of 4 of your TLT shots, or two rerolls on one out of four, at best, if you want to keep using him every round.  Ezra keeps working, as long as you use Maul on the first shot of each TLT use, so you're getting 2 dice of reroll per TLT barrage, and 1 eyeball to crit per shot.  It's good mods but it's not as reliable as you're implying.  It's about the same as AC on average.  WHich is pretty solid, for sure.

Correction of your misunderstanding of the rules aside, Rey's pilot ability with Finn is better than 3PO, assuming you get it even half the times you're attacked, which is a very good assumption.

Again, you're assuming everything goes perfectly for Fenn/Ghost and the Rey player plays like a moron.  Getting bumped by the Ghost on the approach is playing way worse than your opponent.  Only getting her ability for one round of the game is playing way worse than your opponent.  Allowing the Ghost/Finn player to set up the rocks such that Rey doesn't have a nice big empty space to play in is playing way worse than your opponent.  Etc etc etc.  Be charitable.  Assume that the opponents of the list you like are playing with equal skill.

I understand your interpretation of the rules, and upon further examination of the timing chart I believe an FAQ entry is in order. According to the Maul card, he rerolls dice (in this case, a single die) in the "modify attack dice" step, gaining a stress. The attack then hits, which is checked in between steps 6 and 7 of the timing chart, which is before the "perform this attack twice" that occurs after step 7. Because the attack hit (therwise TLT wouldn't do damage here) maul's second clause triggers, leading to the removal of a stress token. Then the "attack twice?" clause triggers, repeating the whole process.

Thus, kanan can get a single reroll and Ezra on every TLT shot, assuming each one hits.

I believe you're basing your interpretation off the precedent of munitions failsafe and cluster missiles, where both attacks have to miss for the missile to be retained, but it's a separate rule entirely.

Rey is absolutely better with Kanan, but putting in 3-PO for the "worst case" damage calculations was fair I thought.

A large base ship setting up a block on another large base ship that needs to maintain arc to do enough damage, while you have access to the boost action is absurdly easy. You literally line up and joust them, and move to block both sloops, thus leaving them with no option but to bump or break off. Skill isn't really involved here - it's just going to happen in the case of a jousting start to the game.

If the kanan player does the intelligent (and obvious thing) and brings 3 large rocks there's nothing the Rey player can do to prevent them from making a cluster of 4 rocks minimum, closely spaced. Rey can't go through it, and Kanan is perfectly happt to keep skirting around it. Again, no skill required, just basic competency in creating a dense asteroid field.

The Rey player's entire goal is to shoot a target in her arc and not have her die. Yyou beat a Rey list by denying her one o both of these things. The trick with a Rey list like this is that their only real choice is what maneuver the rather predictable Falcon does each turn, leading to the ease of blocks and the obvious asteroid placement.

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3 minutes ago, Astech said:

I understand your interpretation of the rules, and upon further examination of the timing chart I believe an FAQ entry is in order. According to the Maul card, he rerolls dice (in this case, a single die) in the "modify attack dice" step, gaining a stress. The attack then hits, which is checked in between steps 6 and 7 of the timing chart, which is before the "perform this attack twice" that occurs after step 7. Because the attack hit (therwise TLT wouldn't do damage here) maul's second clause triggers, leading to the removal of a stress token. Then the "attack twice?" clause triggers, repeating the whole process.

Thus, kanan can get a single reroll and Ezra on every TLT shot, assuming each one hits.

Fortunately, it's already in the FAQ.  Page 22.  At the bottom.  It's not 'my interpretation' of anything.  And even before this specific interaction was FAQed, it wasn't, and hasn't been since the timing chart came out more than a year ago.  When 'after attacking/defending' takes place has been very clear since then.

5 minutes ago, Astech said:

A large base ship setting up a block on another large base ship that needs to maintain arc to do enough damage, while you have access to the boost action is absurdly easy. You literally line up and joust them, and move to block both sloops, thus leaving them with no option but to bump or break off. Skill isn't really involved here - it's just going to happen in the case of a jousting start to the game.

If the kanan player does the intelligent (and obvious thing) and brings 3 large rocks there's nothing the Rey player can do to prevent them from making a cluster of 4 rocks minimum, closely spaced. Rey can't go through it, and Kanan is perfectly happt to keep skirting around it. Again, no skill required, just basic competency in creating a dense asteroid field.

The Rey player's entire goal is to shoot a target in her arc and not have her die. Yyou beat a Rey list by denying her one o both of these things. The trick with a Rey list like this is that their only real choice is what maneuver the rather predictable Falcon does each turn, leading to the ease of blocks and the obvious asteroid placement.

And Rey is happy to keep slooping in place in the clear areas, which if there's a nice cluster of 4 rocks, will be about half the board.  Stalemate.  Not to mention that a good Rey player will bring debris, which she can use to break up the dense rock clusters such that she can use Kanan to ignore about half of it and still get good shots without getting stressed, where the Ghost cannot move without losing its (crucial) actions. 

You're also implying that it's trivial to block Rey , which it really isn't.  When she can 3-sloop left, 3-sloop right, do a 1 forward, or a 4 straight, there's no one position you can drop your Ghost in that covers all that ground.  And yes, you shouldn't be getting your Ghost into the position where it has to block all those possible moves - but Rey has the flexbility of dial to force you to.  You have to engage her sometime.

It's by no means an unwinnable encounter for Fenn/Ghost, but it's definitely an uphill struggle.  The big things that Fenn/Ghost does are mitigating token-based dice modification, and doing consistent damage of their own.  Rey/Low has strong answers to both.  As do many other lists.

Fenn/Ghost is one of the best lists in the game at the moment, but it still has weaknesses to exploit.

And once again: anyone can win when their opponent plays worse than them.  Winning when they're not letting you is the trick.

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