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How to reliable beat NuNuNu, QD?

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This is a puzzle I currently can not solve. Maybe you guys have some answers. 
And yes, Rho's with Gama Vets would PS kill the Nu Squadron, but I don't see 2 boats with two bombers doing well against enough other stuff. 

Tips, strategies, experience, videos, etc anything is welcome. 

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It's tough, for sure. Two things I always try to look for:

  1. If you have a round where you can almost certainly strip Quickdraw's shields in relative safety, do so. Without the double-tap QD is merely very good rather than game-winning.
  2. Once the Gunboats have unloaded try to keep the pressure on one or two of them. They really want to break off and reload but that takes time. If you can pressure one you can kill it before it gets to reload. Unfortunately it's really difficult to do that and stop the others also reloading!

It's a very good list, with good durability and a devastating alpha strike. You really want to time your attack on Quickdraw so you're not taking too much damage in one round. I'd never shoot QD in the same round the alpha strike hits. My own list has tractor beams and ion cannons to try to control the engagement a bit more and I've found throwing a Gunboat onto a rock can often buy the time I need to deal with the rest of the list.

Maybe a very quick list will also help? Those Gunboats aren't too scary at range 1 and it takes a long time for them to turn around again.

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  • Dropping the target locks is definitely good if your squad includes the means to do that.
  • Consider the Nu gunboats a mini-swarm - the usual rules apply; force them to break up and come in separately such that they don't all get a shot at once.
  • Lacking the OS-1 title, they really, really don't want to have to SLAM, meaning that whilst getting behind them and forcing them to come about is bad for TIE bombers, it's catastrophic for a gunboat.
  • At range 1, a gunboat only packs a 3-dice primary attack, and it'll be loathe to spend a target lock if it's got one because it's got to get back out to range 3 of you to reacquire it if does.
  • Assuming a gunboat has fired a harpoon and rerolled it with its lock, then in theory it needs to:
    • Move and SLAM to extend the range
    • Move and reload to un-discard the missile
    • Move and lock to have a useable missile.
    • That's a minimum of 2 turns, maybe 3, before it can fire a second volley. Gunboats are tough for their cost but not that tough if you can keep on it.
  • I'm not sure I'd want to leave quickdraw alone, but on the other hand your opponent presumably wants you to duel quickdraw whilst the gunboats hang back and pelt you with harpoons, so doing the opposite to that is always a good starting point for a plan... 
  • Agree on hitting quickdraw en masse. The absolute worst thing you can do is fire the odd pot-shot at her and give her multiple extra free attacks. If you don't think you'll drop all three shields, it's probably worth hitting one of the gunboats instead if you have a choice.
  • Also note that assuming she has lightweight frame, the best place to engage the gunboats is at range 1 (no missiles and cannot target lock) whilst the best place to engage quickdraw is range 3 (where you get an extra green die against her primary weapon and she won't get one against yours). Which kind of reinforces the 'go for the gunboats' mindset.
Edited by Magnus Grendel

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it´s funny that this threads question is in the heads of many, while in my head all i want to know is how to beat Poe/Fenn/x  or Lowhrick/Fenn/x

Fenn is so ridiculously powerfull, and with 3BQD the only chance i see is to approach from at least 3-4 different angles. Otherwise Fenn destroys your Harpoonparty pretty quickly by blocking one modification and stripping a fokus with HSCP of another gunboat while poe stripped one TL and all you have is qd and not even 1 full modified harpoon shot

Edited by Taiowaa

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17 minutes ago, Jike said:

It's tough, for sure. Two things I always try to look for:

  1. If you have a round where you can almost certainly strip Quickdraw's shields in relative safety,

I agree with the first half of this sentence, if you get guns enough on quick draw to strip shields do it. I'd go further and say that if it's at the cost of losing one of your ships I would still recommend it. The longer you leave it, the less likely it is you will get a shot on him where you can reliably strip his shields. Hit him hard and hit him early.

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27 minutes ago, Taiowaa said:

it´s funny that this threads question is in the heads of many, while in my head all i want to know is how to beat Poe/Fenn/x  or Lowhrick/Fenn/x

Fenn is so ridiculously powerfull, and with 3BQD the only chance i see is to approach from at least 3-4 different angles. Otherwise Fenn destroys your Harpoonparty pretty quickly by blocking one modification and stripping a fokus with HSCP of another gunboat while poe stripped one TL and all you have is qd and not even 1 full modified harpoon shot

If your problem is Fenn locking down your ability to spend tokens, there's always the option of not using harpoon missiles. Concussion Missiles are the same price and have a built-in blank-to-hit modifier that doesn't give a monkey's about Fenn Rau's ability.

 

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2 minutes ago, Suriel said:

What is NuNuNu, QD?

3 Nu Squadron pilots with Long Range Scanners and (usually) Harpoon Missiles and a cheap Quickdraw to taste (pick your two favourites out of Fire Control, Advanced Optics & Lightweight Frame plus a 1 point initiative bid or a 1 point elite upgrade)

Edited by Magnus Grendel

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22 minutes ago, Taiowaa said:

it´s funny that this threads question is in the heads of many, while in my head all i want to know is how to beat Poe/Fenn/x  or Lowhrick/Fenn/x

Fenn is so ridiculously powerfull, and with 3BQD the only chance i see is to approach from at least 3-4 different angles. Otherwise Fenn destroys your Harpoonparty pretty quickly by blocking one modification and stripping a fokus with HSCP of another gunboat while poe stripped one TL and all you have is qd and not even 1 full modified harpoon shot

This one I can answer: don’t rely too heavily on tokens to modify your dice. I’ve been enjoying flying a Ghost that packs Ezra and Maul and a TLT, and it laughs at Fenn and HSCP. There are plenty of other non-token modifiers out there, too. RAC, Lone Wolf, Predator, Dengar (crew), Score to settle, etc etc etc. 

——-

As for QDNuNuNu... I have put a lot of theoretical thought and study into it, but admittedly I have not actually ever flown against it, so I’ll steer clear of saying too much, however there are a few things I’ve figured out that might be helpful. 

Remember the rule of 11. Gunboats can only do a 3 straight at most their first turn (unless they want to forfeit their action). That means on the first turn they can only cover 4 base lengths, so you can safely cover 6 base lengths (a 5-straight for a small ship, 4 straight for a large ship) without them shooting at you. Turn 2, if you cover another 6 base lengths you will be at Range 1 of the boats or bumping. The next turn you are behind them, and that is a great place for you to be because the Nu’s can’t turn around very easily without forfeiting their shot. If you can pull this off you should be able to easily kill 1 or 2 gunboats before they ever get a chance to launch their Harpoons. 

The only way the Gunboat player can avoid this is if they line up all the way against the back edge of the map and then slow-roll. Most players don’t do that however, and instead deploy as far forward as they can. So watch for that, and exploit it. ;) 

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yeah, really the question is how to murder those stupid synergy and turret builds like Dash Poe. Gods, I hate that list so much. I use it everytime I want to wallop something though. Its sadly good against everything. 

Edited by Blail Blerg

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29 minutes ago, Herowannabe said:

The only way the Gunboat player can avoid this is if they line up all the way against the back edge of the map and then slow-roll. Most players don’t do that however, and instead deploy as far forward as they can. So watch for that, and exploit it. ;) 

That gunboat player usually just need QD + Two Harpoons to alpha strike one ship. This means that the gunboats are free to come from multiple angles, which means that you can always just jump into range 1 to one of them. 
See for example Ryan F in the toronto regional. 

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Is it just me or would this list be better suited using backdraft over QD?

I get the ps 11 is big vs aces, but aggressively overflying or using the title the ability at ps 8-9 to trigger harpoons and targeting syncs to help out the nu's (when they don't have a disabled token) should be decent surely?

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Nui (Nus? Nuses?) are very position - dependent, and like tight flying quite a bit due to their resiliency and firepower. However, there's not a thing on earth that will fly into a flung proton bomb. The same goes for quickdraw, since proton bombs literally laugh at QD's ability.

Either a Rebel bomber, Punisher (deathrain?) or Nym would be ideal, and can be highly useful in other matchups as well.

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1 hour ago, Astech said:

Nui (Nus? Nuses?) are very position - dependent, and like tight flying quite a bit due to their resiliency and firepower. However, there's not a thing on earth that will fly into a flung proton bomb. The same goes for quickdraw, since proton bombs literally laugh at QD's ability.

Either a Rebel bomber, Punisher (deathrain?) or Nym would be ideal, and can be highly useful in other matchups as well.

I would 100% fly Gunboats into a flung proton bomb to hit Nym with Harpoons.

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4 minutes ago, Biophysical said:

I would 100% fly Gunboats into a flung proton bomb to hit Nym with Harpoons.

Fair enough, but one Nu will die when Nym and Miranda hit a nu with their harpoons. This will leave Nym alive at the end of the turn, ready to fling a second bomb while dodging your arc, and Miranda is still happy. It's totally worth the trade though, you're right.

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22 minutes ago, Astech said:

Fair enough, but one Nu will die when Nym and Miranda hit a nu with their harpoons. This will leave Nym alive at the end of the turn, ready to fling a second bomb while dodging your arc, and Miranda is still happy. It's totally worth the trade though, you're right.

No, Nym (usually) dies from 2 harpoons and a 3 dice attack with focus. Trading one of your three gunboats for Nym is a decent deal even when you take a proton on more than just one ship. So unless you lose another one before you could scatter to reload and get new target locks … you basically have already won with this trade, because QD is extremely unpleasant for Miranda and again, just two harpoons with QD attacking on top is enough for Miranda as well. 

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1 hour ago, SEApocalypse said:

No, Nym (usually) dies from 2 harpoons and a 3 dice attack with focus. Trading one of your three gunboats for Nym is a decent deal even when you take a proton on more than just one ship. So unless you lose another one before you could scatter to reload and get new target locks … you basically have already won with this trade, because QD is extremely unpleasant for Miranda and again, just two harpoons with QD attacking on top is enough for Miranda as well. 

Agreed, even if Nym isn't dead, Quickdraw is awfully likely to kill him before he ever fires again.  

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5 hours ago, SEApocalypse said:

That gunboat player usually just need QD + Two Harpoons to alpha strike one ship. This means that the gunboats are free to come from multiple angles, which means that you can always just jump into range 1 to one of them. 
See for example Ryan F in the toronto regional. 

Oh good point. Like I said, I still haven’t ever actually played against it, so all my strategizing was done in my head or by myself on a playmat. I was referring specifically to if they cluster together (ish) and if you out PS the Nus. 

If they spread out (and you out PS them), then line up and go after the ship on the very end. Hypothetically, you should still be able to force a turn 2 engagement on that one ship while some/most of the remaining ships are out of range, unless they’re slamming around which is okay too because then they’re not attacking. Try to PS kill st least one Nu before it fires it’s Harpoons, preferably 2 if you can (by arc-dodging, range control, TL-ditching, bumping, and/or forcing range 1). If you can do that before losing more than 1/2 of your list you should be pretty good going into the end Game. 

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7 hours ago, SEApocalypse said:

This is a puzzle I currently can not solve. Maybe you guys have some answers. 
And yes, Rho's with Gama Vets would PS kill the Nu Squadron, but I don't see 2 boats with two bombers doing well against enough other stuff. 

Tips, strategies, experience, videos, etc anything is welcome. 

Barring list suggestions, just range control.  If you can't out-joust them, make them come to you on your preferred terms and prove they can do it well.

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