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Tie Avenger, please...

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If the avengers end up as perfect as the Gunboat did I'll be a very content imperial player.

 

It's a bit hard to see where the Avenger will stand out over the silencer, as the silencer does what I imagined the avenger to be.

 

Then again, they gave the Gunboat a SLAM when it never actually had one (that was the missile boat). So... TIE Avenger with slam and missiles? 3/3/2/2? Missiles, systems slot?

Edited by Norsehound

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On 1/14/2018 at 11:29 PM, Zeoinx said:

I rather have the Tie Droid from Rogue Squadron games before the Avenger.

Tie_D_1.jpg

I think it would bring unique gameplay and bring a return to swarm lists again.

Not to totally hijack the thread but these Tie/Ds look absolutely sweet. Hello Shapeways, my old friend...

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While I would love to see a TIE Avenger, as others have said, it would be hard to find it a place in the game FFG has created. There are only a finite number of dials and stat combinations that can be assigned for a small-base TIE-chassis ship, and most of them have been used already.

When the TIE Avenger reigned supreme, in the mid-90s, it was still called the TIE Advanced; Darth Vader's TIE fighter was its prototype, not the first of a full production line in its own right. Unfortunately, for reasons that I have to assume are primarily related to merchandising, "Darth Vader's TIE Fighter" was eventually canonized as its own class of ship, and that became the TIE Advanced, at which point the original TIE Advanced had to be re-branded as the TIE Avenger. After X-Wing Alliance, LucasArts moved away from space combat sims, and we didn't see much of the TIE Avenger. Then, some years later, Disney came along and threw out the entire EU, came out with a cartoon which introduced us to the TIE Advanced Prototype (a prototype to the prototype! HA), and made a new series of films which included a TIE Avenger on steroids, and here we are.

I just thank my lucky stars that we got an Assault Gunboat.

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Alright, so everyone is in agreement, New Wave

Rebel : N1 Starfighter, with at lest  one generic Pilot

             Royal Naboo Starship - Episode One Version - Diplomatic Ship, buffs allies

 

Empire : Tie Avenger

                Tie Droid

                Tie Scout

 

Scum : Star Jewel

              Rihkxyrk assault fighter - Will take up the Tie Defender or B-Wing Role for the Scum Faction, a heavly armored and armed ship.

Edited by Zeoinx

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5 hours ago, Zeoinx said:

Alright, so everyone is in agreement, New Wave

Rebel : N1 Starfighter, with at lest  one generic Pilot

             Royal Naboo Starship - Episode One Version - Diplomatic Ship, buffs allies

Empire : Tie Avenger

                Tie Droid

                Tie Scout

Scum : Star Jewel

              Rihkxyrk assault fighter - Will take up the Tie Defender or B-Wing Role for the Scum Faction, a heavly armored and armed ship.

I would prefer the N-1 without generics.

Instead of the TIE Scout, the TIE Hunter.

And no Star Jewel... there are some much better Scum huge ships out there (like the Crusader-class, or the Interceptor-class).

Rihkxyrk looks great, but isn't it the same role the Kimogila got? 

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18 minutes ago, RampancyTW said:

Anybody have any of the FO-themed TIE Hunter-esque fanart that was floating around before TLJ?  That thing looked baller and I want it, even if it doesn't actually exist.

*doing some Google-Fu*

Here you go.

tumblr_o7b5rmhs381t30i0wo1_1280.jpg

 

 

Edited by Odanan

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31 minutes ago, TheVeteranSergeant said:

That First Order Interceptor seems like an incredibly good piece of starship engineering considering how much of the Star Wars universe is filled with narrow openings ideal for flat, wide space ships as opposed to taller, more square ones.

It's such a pretty design; I've always liked the Hunter since I saw it all those years back in Rebel Strike and would be so happy if this F/O Interceptor made its way into the new canon/X-wing.

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6 hours ago, Rakky Wistol said:

My two favorite things to say used to be 
#nevergunboat and #neveravenger...

I was wrong only half the time...Silencer, me thinks solidifies me on the remaining point.

FFG released the Starwing without mentioning the word "gunboat" a single time in its packaging, upgrade cards, pilot cards or release articles. So your first hashtag still stands true, and will remain true forever. :D
Also, you could even go with the #nevermissileboat hashtag, being pretty sure that you'll be right. :)

Now, regarding the lack of role for the Avenger, people, just imagine what would we have thought if one year ago they had told us:
"In one year they'll release the gunboat and its most used pilot, the one winning tournaments, will be PS 2, have worse dial than the TIE Bomber, be 2 points more expensive, have 1 single hit point more, and be equipped with a single missile and Long Range Scanners. It will have SLAM and titles, but mostly not use them at high competitive levels."

We would have thought that would be ridiculous, right? Why then using that when you could use a TIE Bomber for fewer points with the exact same configuration? For just 1 more hitpoint?

Why weren't we seeing as many PS TIE Bombers with Harpoons and Long Range Scanners? It's not because of Harpoons weren't available before the gunboat. They came out with Guns for Hire.
I think the key is on the Reload action, that didn't exist before now. That action alone gave the cheap missile carrier gunboat a niche, even when the TIE Bomber was already there.

My point is that the TIE Avenger can create its own role by adding some new mechanic or ability to the game that doesn't exist right now. After all, the game does have something more than dial->action->attack nowadays.
The Empire has Advanced, Interceptors, Silencers, and Advanced Prototypes. All of them are arcdodgers, crowding the same role.
But none of them have, for example:

  • something that lets them microjump somewhere else in the table once per game (allowing for some feint maneuvers that can leave an opponent out of place),
  • or attack bomb/mine tokens ("once per round, immediately after a bomb token is deployed inside your firing arc at range 1-3, you may perform an attack against it (agility 3). If the attack hits, the bomb token immediately detonates. You may not attack again this round")
  • or are specially strong against ordnance secondary weapon attacks ("When defending from a torpedo or missile attack, if the attacker is in your firing arc, you may also roll your attack dice in addition to your defense dice. If you do so, treat your hit and crit results as evade results, but you cannot attack again this round")
  • or that do something especially cool with beam weapons ("You may equip one Beam cannon for 0 squad points. When performing an attack with a Beam secondary weapon, if instructed to cancel dice, do not do it")
  • or have a Countermeasure action ("When performing a Countermeasure action, assign a countermeasure token to your ship. When a ship with any amount of countermeasure tokens is defending against a torpedo or missile attack, they roll 1 extra die at range 1, 2 extra dice at range 2, and 3 extra dice at range 3 or higher. Countermeasure tokens are discarded during the End phase.")
  • or have some kind of controlled regeneration ("Once per round, after defending, if you lost 1 shield token, you may recover 1 shield")
  • or can do something that is illegal for other ships ("Once per round in which you performed a green maneuver, when you perform a barrel roll, you may perform another barrel roll.")
  • or are especially good at chasing targets ("Enemy ships in your firing arc at range 1-2 cannot perform boost or barrel roll actions if their Agility score is lower than yours.")
  • or great against those ships that ignore the core principles of the game ("Enemy ships in your firing arc at range 1-3 roll 2 fewer attack dice when attacking out of arc, and cannot perform actions before revealing their dial")

The devs can just make up anything that would give the TIE Avenger some unique twist that is out of reach for the other imperial arcdodgers and that makes it excel at something that no other ship does.

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1 hour ago, Azrapse said:

FFG released the Starwing without mentioning the word "gunboat" a single time in its packaging, upgrade cards, pilot cards or release articles. So your first hashtag still stands true, and will remain true forever. :D
Also, you could even go with the #nevermissileboat hashtag, being pretty sure that you'll be right. :)

Now, regarding the lack of role for the Avenger, people, just imagine what would we have thought if one year ago they had told us:
"In one year they'll release the gunboat and its most used pilot, the one winning tournaments, will be PS 2, have worse dial than the TIE Bomber, be 2 points more expensive, have 1 single hit point more, and be equipped with a single missile and Long Range Scanners. It will have SLAM and titles, but mostly not use them at high competitive levels."

We would have thought that would be ridiculous, right? Why then using that when you could use a TIE Bomber for fewer points with the exact same configuration? For just 1 more hitpoint?

Why weren't we seeing as many PS TIE Bombers with Harpoons and Long Range Scanners? It's not because of Harpoons weren't available before the gunboat. They came out with Guns for Hire.
I think the key is on the Reload action, that didn't exist before now. That action alone gave the cheap missile carrier gunboat a niche, even when the TIE Bomber was already there.

My point is that the TIE Avenger can create its own role by adding some new mechanic or ability to the game that doesn't exist right now. After all, the game does have something more than dial->action->attack nowadays.
The Empire has Advanced, Interceptors, Silencers, and Advanced Prototypes. All of them are arcdodgers, crowding the same role.
But none of them have, for example:

  • something that lets them microjump somewhere else in the table once per game (allowing for some feint maneuvers that can leave an opponent out of place),
  • or attack bomb/mine tokens ("once per round, immediately after a bomb token is deployed inside your firing arc at range 1-3, you may perform an attack against it (agility 3). If the attack hits, the bomb token immediately detonates. You may not attack again this round")
  • or are specially strong against ordnance secondary weapon attacks ("When defending from a torpedo or missile attack, if the attacker is in your firing arc, you may also roll your attack dice in addition to your defense dice. If you do so, treat your hit and crit results as evade results, but you cannot attack again this round")
  • or that do something especially cool with beam weapons ("You may equip one Beam cannon for 0 squad points. When performing an attack with a Beam secondary weapon, if instructed to cancel dice, do not do it")
  • or have a Countermeasure action ("When performing a Countermeasure action, assign a countermeasure token to your ship. When a ship with any amount of countermeasure tokens is defending against a torpedo or missile attack, they roll 1 extra die at range 1, 2 extra dice at range 2, and 3 extra dice at range 3 or higher. Countermeasure tokens are discarded during the End phase.")
  • or have some kind of controlled regeneration ("Once per round, after defending, if you lost 1 shield token, you may recover 1 shield")
  • or can do something that is illegal for other ships ("Once per round in which you performed a green maneuver, when you perform a barrel roll, you may perform another barrel roll.")
  • or are especially good at chasing targets ("Enemy ships in your firing arc at range 1-2 cannot perform boost or barrel roll actions if their Agility score is lower than yours.")
  • or great against those ships that ignore the core principles of the game ("Enemy ships in your firing arc at range 1-3 roll 2 fewer attack dice when attacking out of arc, and cannot perform actions before revealing their dial")

The devs can just make up anything that would give the TIE Avenger some unique twist that is out of reach for the other imperial arcdodgers and that makes it excel at something that no other ship does.

FFG, read this!

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There are plenty of mechanics the Empire doesn't have access to that make sense on the Avenger. Bullseye arc was just introduced. And in the online X-Wing vs Tie Fighter game the Avenger shields could regen faster than previous games. So a shield regen title with lower shield total makes sense, 2 or even 1 

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