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Snack Happy

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I just bought 3 cores. I never played this in the past. I played one game the other day. How do you guys go about choosing a faction? Why is loyalty to a clan important? Why did you pick your clan?

To give some comparison my favorite factions in Game of Thrones are Nights Watch, Lannister, and Stark.

My first leaning is Dragon, but the more I read the more I want to try some others.

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 Clan loyalty only matters if you think it should.

I play Crab. I like Lion/Crane/Scorpion best from a thematic point of view, but they were real powerhouse out of the core, and I hate playing the same thing as everyone else. I played many factions, wanted to play Unicorn, because no one wanted to play them, and frankly, it is obvious why...

Only one I liked the play style of was Crane/Crab and Phoenix.

I stayed with Crab because I just really love the way it plays. I like Phoenix too, but everyone and their mother wants to play phoenix now... (at least in my area)


For me, play style is more important then theme. I'm a scorpion at heart, but I really like the self sacrifice theme out of crab for some reason. (And gosh do I hate Crab thematically)

Edited by Seawhale

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Yes, loyalty only matters if you want it to. Even if you do like the idea of clan loyalty, I'd strongly suggest trying out different factions first, and see if something 'clicks'.

As for picking a faction...Well, I imagine most people pick along one of two main lines; thematic (These guys look cool!) or gameplay. If you're picking on theme, you probably don't need any help.

For gameplay purposes I don't think there are any direct comparisons to Thrones, simply because the games play very differently, though there are some obvious similarities.

Crab have NW defensive and Stark sacrifice themes, as well as some of Stark's 'permission' effects, so they might be a good starting place for you. Though it should be noted that Crab (or anyone at this stage) don't have a passive win condition like The Wall - that is, they can't just defend defend defend until they win. So while they are advantage by winning on defense, it's not the entire game plan.

Lion are currently similar to Core/1st Cycle Lannister, in the sense that all their guys are just better than everyone else and they are just very good at playing the basic game.

Scorpion feels like they'll probably be what Lannister is 'meant' to be, with them seeming to have a lot of Conflict characters and hand control. 

Phoenix are Martell. Probably the most obvious 'carry over'.

Dragon like to have big 'Voltron' characters and have an attachment focus. They don't really have a direct counterpart faction wise to Thrones (Targ is meant to be the 'attachment faction', but they've never really had it as a competitive theme).

Unicorn initially feel like Greyjoy, with a focus on going first and feeling like they are meant to be played aggressively. Instead of Stealth, they have lots of effects that let them move in and out of challenges. Unfortunately general consensus is that they are thoroughly underpowered right now, so it feels to me like their basic design concept doesn't really work.

Crane, I haven't really played enough against them to really have a feel for how they play at this stage.

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The great thing about having a full play set is you can play whatever you want.  If you really want to get into the clans I think reading the fictions that FFG put out there is a good start to get you a feel for the clans.  I would recommend reading some of the old fictions out there from the AEG days of the original game.  At least the Dawn of the Empire to the Day of Thunder to get an idea of how Rokugan was shaped and why the clans are the way they are.

I think the dynasty packs help better define what the clans can do, and I would recommend getting the dynasty packs to get a better understanding of each clan.  Then when you are really settled on the clan you like you can get their clan pack to further expand your options with them.

Personally I'm waiting to throw my full support behind Fu-Leng and the the Shadowlands.  Mantis and Naga are also clans/factions that appear to be on the horizon so maybe you end up liking one of those?  Just enjoy the game and I'm sure everything else will fall into place.

Edited by Ishi Tonu

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Why Clan Loyalty is important? Well do you like sports? do you know that feeling when your team wins a championship and you are extremely happy and want to go out screaming and celebrating, making fun of your friends (this is the best part absolutely) because you feel part of that victory, even if you are miles away from what is happening, you feel proud. This is L5R for me, and that's what makes this game different from other games with players who just want to play the best decks and win, that's what kept that game alive for so long, plus having an incredible lore.

With no loyalty is just another game.

Having access to all the cards is great, I like to play with all the clans, to get to know the opponents ways better, but if you just play without choosing a faction you will not be experiencing the full L5R experience, that's my opinion.

Also Lion is the best clan there's not much to think about..

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12 hours ago, Snack Happy said:

To give some comparison my favorite factions in Game of Thrones are Nights Watch, Lannister, and Stark.

My first leaning is Dragon, but the more I read the more I want to try some others.

 

Ok. The Crabs Are somewhat Nightwatch type clan. Dragons Are somewhat like Lannisters. Some big super characters, like good ole Tywin and Mountain type of deck. Starks... Maybe Cranes, but Cranes Are too political, but very bound to honor... Lion is Also about honor, but more horde deck so not very stark in there.

Read about the lore about the clans From the rulebook and introduction about their strong point and weaknesses and see what do you like.

I used to play Unicorns with heavy Archer cavalry there in the old days. Unicorns today... i still like them but They seems to lack resious oomph that They did have in the past. Normally the unicorn did go to fight, the change the targed and then again. Now the movement that unicorn did have is tempered down so much that their biggest strong point is a Little bit meh... But I am sure that it will get better. 

All in all it is about you Gaming style. I did like movement and surprice attacks and unicorn did take that manouvering so well in the past. There were so much speed in there. 

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Loyalty to a clan isn't important - but it is quite fun.  Since the game and story are hooked pretty close together many people enjoy being invested in their clans.  FFG isn't likely to go as far as AEG did to foster clan loyalty, we used to declare our clans and receive clan-only letters lol

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12 hours ago, Abyss said:

Phoenix are Martell. Probably the most obvious 'carry over'.

Really? What gives you that impression?

Phoenix focus on large uniques; most successful Martell decks (combo withstanding) have focused on a plethora of smaller characters.
Phoenix focus on Glory, which you could equate to domination in AGoT. Martell have never cared for dom. If anything, that's a Baratheon thing.
The only card that is absolutely a carry over from AGoT is Display of Power / Vengeance for Illia.

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Clan loyalty is an important part of this games experience.

L5R is really a rpg lcg where players through tournament results get to influence how the story goes. That is why the game has achieved its impressive longevity despite some very rough patches. We old5r players are heavily invested in the story and our clan and it keeps us coming back.

Thereby I believe you get the most out of the l5r gaming experience by immersing yourself in the story and the best way of doing that in my opinion is to have a faction you identify with in setting. How this manifests itself in your gaming though is entirely up to you. You may limit yourself to a single clan in official tournaments or you may be an agent of your clan by becoming a mercenary of a more competitive or allied clan to affect the storyline choice you want.

In choosing a clan i always prioritised fluff over gameplay. I wanted a clan that spoke to me as a person. When I was younger I liked the anti-hero nature of the scorpion, but as I grew and matured I found my home in the mountains amongst Togashi, Mirumoto and Agasha. The Dragon are in essence a clan of secluded academics with a more philosophical and post modernist bent than the Phoenix who are more spiritual and dogmatic. I have always felt that the Crab guard the empire's borders, the crane the empire's culture, the lion the empire's head, the scorpion the empire's shadows, the unicorn the empires horizons, the Phoenix the empire's soul and the dragon, we guard the empire's future by occasionally guiding the train back onto the rails. But that's just my take on it.

Anyhow, I really encourage you and any new players to invest in this story line aspect of this game. It is this attachment to story and character which makes l5r a special game and the l5r community such a wonderful and fulfilling group.

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You guys all have some awesome input. I watched Matt Colvilles video about l5r and I think that was part of my tipping point. That and I only play GoT with one person not that it isn't fun but spice of life and all. Follow up questions for the loyalists. What makes you loyal to your clan? While you answer I will start searching for the illustrious lore.

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6 hours ago, theaficionado said:

Really? What gives you that impression?

Phoenix focus on large uniques; most successful Martell decks (combo withstanding) have focused on a plethora of smaller characters.
Phoenix focus on Glory, which you could equate to domination in AGoT. Martell have never cared for dom. If anything, that's a Baratheon thing.
The only card that is absolutely a carry over from AGoT is Display of Power / Vengeance for Illia.

Admittedly, it's changed with the first cycle, but as the dedicated Martell player in our meta, everybody told me I was a Scorpion in L5R (Mostly because they all think I like being a ****, if I had to guess). After two games, I told them they were all wrong and I was absolutely a Phoenix player. Comparisons between Core Set Phoenix and Martell:

Like Martell, Phoenix don't have an obvious 'do this' game plan. They've got lots of cards that do different things, that come together as a single package. They work off card synergies, rather than direct power.  The Phoenix stronghold is a great example, it essentially doesn't do anything by itself but becomes very powerful under the right circumstances, which is usually how Martell is designed.

Phoenix and Martell are both 'soft' control, with fewer point and click answer card (or they are more situational).  They tend to require a bit more subtlety to work compared to more direct options in other factions.

Phoenix characters often have lower stats and there are no real 'big ball of stat' or pure beat stick characters; this is similar to the 'Martell Tax' where Martell characters often have worse icons/lower strength than characters in other factions. Granted, it's a bit different with Phoenix because the lower stats generally correspond with Glory; so those characters actually become huge stat sticks if they get honoured. The fact that this is more reliable is why I feel the first cycle makes them less Martell like.

Core Phoenix tended to win via attrition; particularly Tsukane promotes you to play the attrition based 'Long Game'. She's not a passive win condition (ala The Wall or Bara Dominance) but she definitely gives you more and more advantage as the game goes on. Martell is usually attrition based and gets stronger the longer the game goes.

It should be required to scream ELIA!!! any time you play Display of Power.

You're right though, that the 'Shugenja' theme fleshed out in the first cycle is currently very different from what we got in the Core Set (To me, Phoenix are the closest faction to having two distinct, viable playstyles).

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Considering L5R is a story driven game where unlike AGOT the story is not written in advance, clan loyalty matters as wining important championships with your favorite clan will give you opportunity to decide next story turning points in your caln's favor. It will all depend on how much FFG will involve the community on the storyline evolution.

Beyond that, it's also a matter of personnal preference because again unlike AGOT (which I have the feeling is, as a setting a bit of a western mirror to Rokugan, still with some notable differences), the ideologies and behaviors along values between clans are fundamentally different. It's unlikely you will like the philosophy of every clan, you will naturally tend to prefer one or two of them. In a setting where honor and face is so important, you will see that each clan has its own way to define honor. Every clan treasures honor (yes, even Scorpion) but sees it as a completely different thing.

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On ‎19‎.‎12‎.‎2017 at 7:50 AM, Snack Happy said:

I just bought 3 cores. I never played this in the past. I played one game the other day. How do you guys go about choosing a faction? Why is loyalty to a clan important? Why did you pick your clan?

To give some comparison my favorite factions in Game of Thrones are Nights Watch, Lannister, and Stark.

My first leaning is Dragon, but the more I read the more I want to try some others.

There are two reasons why clan loyalty is important for a lot of people:

1) Casual: People like to identify themselves with something, especially if they are invested in the world. Every clan is their own community and the feeling of being part of that is a big motivator.

2) Competitive: If you get the hatamoto title, you will lose it if you Change your clan at a sanctioned tournament.

 

Nights Watch=Crab
While Lannister and Stark don't have a direct counterpart in L5R, I think that Scorpion has some gameplay elements incommon with Lannister and Lion with Stark.

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On 12/19/2017 at 7:50 AM, Snack Happy said:

I just bought 3 cores. I never played this in the past. I played one game the other day. How do you guys go about choosing a faction? Why is loyalty to a clan important? Why did you pick your clan?

To give some comparison my favorite factions in Game of Thrones are Nights Watch, Lannister, and Stark.

My first leaning is Dragon, but the more I read the more I want to try some others.

When I started the old CCG, the very first pack I bought was a Mantis pack. I think I liked the art and the idea of simply sniping all my enemies. :) I really liked them, but I never managed to win against my friends. So I started to delve into the lore, read the books (I strongly recommend that you read them. I know that the story will unfold differently this time, but the books are still good and provide a very good insight into every clan) and eventually sided with the Crab clan. Although I also had two mantis decks, one unicorn and one lion (the more diversity the better in a small group of players), I mainly used my Crab Berserker deck, simply because I loved (and still do love) them. So when the LCG was announced, there was not even the slightest doubt which clan to play (since Mantis are not available anyway). I have not seen any players in my area, though, that put much weight on loyalty because of the clan communities. I felt it is more of the opposite, the fiercest battles were inner clan battles at the two tournaments that I attended so far. But maybe that's different in other countries, bigger playgroups or at bigger tournaments.  

I cannot really compare the game to GoT because I didn't watch the series and I never played the game (I read four of the books, though). 

Try every clan of the core set to find out which play style you like the most. However, it is possible that the play styles will change over the course of additional cycles and clan packs (and maybe even deluxe boxes or something like the old Training Grounds/Battle of Kyuden Tonbo). I also recommend to read all the fiction that has been released for the new L5R so far (if you haven't already). See here for an eBook version

 

Edited by ichaos1985

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On 12/19/2017 at 0:21 AM, Seawhale said:

 Clan loyalty only matters if you think it should.
 

Disagree. Without clan loyal you are an honorless dog. A ronin, literally lower than the heimin. Choose, or toil forever in a world that wants you worse than dead ;) 

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6 hours ago, cheapmate said:

Really?? When was this announced?

It hasn’t. But they have been mentioned in a couple of fictions, specially Mantis, so everybody is just assuming they’ll appear as playable factions (or at least as neutral cards) sooner or later. 

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