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Daht

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44 minutes ago, WGNF911 said:

Does anyone care?  Or, have we all resolved that wave 7 will be the last wave Armada ever sees and goes the way of dust tactics (or whatever it was called). 

I care. Not that that does any of us any good. I don't think there's any call to be worried that they're ending Armada. I think we're simply suffering from an unforseen delay combined with incompetent customer relations.

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2 hours ago, Daht said:

... from the 3 month anniversary of an update to wave 7 being "in development"!

I think the time between 9/21 and 11/21 is 2 months. For in development but we are almost 3 months from our last article on 8/25.

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15 minutes ago, Thrindal said:

I think the time between 9/21 and 11/21 is 2 months. For in development but we are almost 3 months from our last article on 8/25.

It was in dvelopment before that.

I dont have the original date, but there was a date update to the 21st of September which happened afterwards.

 

basically, the "in development" happened sometime between the 25th of August and the 21st of September.

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8 hours ago, WGNF911 said:

Does anyone care?  Or, have we all resolved that wave 7 will be the last wave Armada ever sees and goes the way of dust tactics (or whatever it was called). 

I assume there will be one or two more releases after Wave 7. But maybe only in the next two years. Then FFG will drop Armada for sure. Meanwhile X-Wing will get 6-10 new expansions.

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1 hour ago, Norell said:

I assume there will be one or two more releases after Wave 7. But maybe only in the next two years. Then FFG will drop Armada for sure. Meanwhile X-Wing will get 6-10 new expansions.

If they were going to drop Armada why would they want to drag it out over the next two years? I really don't get why you would think it was ending. Care to elaborate?

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It seems clear that they invest less and less effort into Armada. The lack of articles, lack of reactions form the staff, lack of waves in general all point into this direction. FFG doesn't have an issue with production capacity for sure, it's enough to look at its Star Wars games. They have a brand new game about to be released while X-Wing, Destiny, the roleplaying games all get more frequent updates that Armada. So why would they treat Armada like that if they would plan with it for a long while?

It seems that they are diverting production resources from Armada to other games, that in itself slows down development cycles and it indicates that Armada is no longer a priority for them, they just don't have the backbone to say so.

And since the last squadron packs they seem to be VERY reluctant to tap into the EU and there aren't too many unreleased canon stuff left (other than TFA, but that's not Star Wars). Clone Wars doesn't matter because I think FFG has a clause in its license contract that they can't do any stuff from that era - they are very clearly avoid it in all of their games.

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22 minutes ago, Norell said:

And since the last squadron packs they seem to be VERY reluctant to tap into the EU and there aren't too many unreleased canon stuff left (other than TFA, but that's not Star Wars). Clone Wars doesn't matter because I think FFG has a clause in its license contract that they can't do any stuff from that era - they are very clearly avoid it in all of their games.

. . .

TFA is Stars Wars, regardless of whether you dislike it, and they haven't avoided the Prequels, they have ARC-170s in X-Wing. I don't think there's anything stopping them from adding ships of either era into Armada.

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32 minutes ago, Norell said:

Clone Wars doesn't matter because I think FFG has a clause in its license contract that they can't do any stuff from that era - they are very clearly avoid it in all of their games.

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latest?cb=20160801151538latest?cb=20160603063512latest?cb=20170315223723latest?cb=20170617010351

 

Just a couple off the top of my head.

There is nothing holding them back from the Clone Wars era.

 

 

Edited by kris40k

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1 hour ago, kris40k said:

latest?cb=20170906181748latest?cb=20160924150451RS01-258x300.png

 

latest?cb=20160801151538latest?cb=20160603063512latest?cb=20170315223723latest?cb=20170617010351

 

Just a couple off the top of my head.

There is nothing holding them back from the Clone Wars era.

 

 

That might be true, but I'd rather not be reminded of those dark days (both in terms of in-canon history and how rubbish the films were albeit Clone Wars was just about OK).

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3 hours ago, Norell said:

It seems clear that they invest less and less effort into Armada. The lack of articles, lack of reactions form the staff, lack of waves in general all point into this direction.

Have there ever been Armada articles? I wouldnt call it less and less....

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I don t know if FFG is going to drop Armada but it certainly feel like the old Games Workshop attitude with their specialist games. Even in the flgs in my area I hardly see Armada products on the shelves; maybe a broken range of odds and ends... i ve been looking to pick-up an ISD and an AF2 for a while but cant find them locally...

I am confident that the community will carry this great game in spite of FFG; there is so much talent between 3D printing artists, graphic designers and great scenarios ideas flooding this forum that it should keep this game going for a long long time...

Let game makers that are disconnecting from their gamers community wake up and smell the coffee :)

 

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On ‎11‎/‎19‎/‎2017 at 5:20 AM, Norell said:

I assume there will be one or two more releases after Wave 7. But maybe only in the next two years. Then FFG will drop Armada for sure. Meanwhile X-Wing will get 6-10 new expansions.

I doubt it.  Armada is doing well, and making profit.  It may be the bastard child of the family, but they still care.  X-wing is their first born who is on track for Harvard.  Destiny is their third born who has a scholarship to State.  Legion is the newborn, and they have high hopes.  Armada is that 2nd child that gets forgotten.  He did ok at school, but X-wing and Destiny got better grades, so Armada didn't get praised for it.  He did ok at sports, but X-wing and Destiny were team captains.  Armada will end up going to community college, and getting a decent job, and having a good life.  Meanwhile X-wing's success is stressful and his relationship is constantly on the rocks.  Destiny has been riding high on his glory days from high school and dealing with various addictions and on-again/off again relationships with ex-girlfriends.  Armada never hears from the parents, but knows deep down inside that they still love him.

Armada is a top 5 miniatures game.  FFG is really hoping Legion can push a competitor off that list so they can claim 3 of the top 5 games under their umbrella.  Even if Armada only broke even, they'd likely keep the game on life support just to maintain that status.  Have 3 of 5 gives them serious cred, and draws more attention from other games.  It also becomes a draw to new IPs.  This company took the SW IP and made 3 super successful miniature games out of it...maybe we should consider them.

Armada suffers in the SW IP due to the focus.  In the OT, we saw what, 5 or 6 capital ships in the movies?  But we saw 4 rebel fighters and a rebel freighter.  We saw 4 types of imperial tie fighters and an imperial shuttle. (I may be forgetting something here so my numbers might be a little off).  The games have typically centered around fighters.  Even those that had capital ships didn't offer much beyond what we saw in the OP.  The comics and books also cared more about the fighters, and for good reason.  Stories tend to follow a couple key people.  So put them in personal transports and keep the scope of the story under control.  When you stick them in a capital ship with hundreds of other people, you risk losing track of your focus.

Due to all of that, Armada only has a few pieces to draw from.  So they take their time, and they do it right.  They create well thought out, balanced units that stand the test of time.  Destiny has already set plans for retiring sets.  X-wing stuff is all over the place.  X-wing pieces come out OP and dominate the scene or are totally under powered and never get played.  Older stuff is forgotten as power creep decimates it's usefulness only for FFG to release new stuff that requires you to buy more stuff to make an older unit halfway viable (only to have it again fade away due to power creep).

Does Armada get the attention from FFG that it should? No.  But it's not likely to see it go anywhere any time soon.

I'm guessing Ep8 and 9 along with the other movies will open up some new material (much like rebels and rogue one did), and allow FFG to put a little more oomph into the Armada lineup.

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7 minutes ago, GrandAdmiralCrunch said:

Honestly, things could be worse. We have an exciting wave on the way. 

Do we get treated as well as we should? No? Are we sweating bullets like Imperial Assault wondering if we will ever get more content? Also No. 

And then there is the redheaded, one eyed, buck-tooth adopted child LCG. We are just happy it is still listed on the website, it is worse than IA for doom & gloom, which sucks because IMO it is their best card game.

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Personally, as a player of both X wing and Armada, I'm much happier with how Armada is handling releases.  I'm absolutely fine with the long breaks in releases - it's much more preferable over X wing's "yet's just give them ships no one has ever heard of, and implement such a power creep that everyone flies them" approach.

 

The fact that almost every ship is recognizable to a semi-hardcore fan is great imo.  The only real exceptions I can think of would be: Assault Frigate Mark II, Gladiator Star Destroyer, MC30, Interdictor and Artquitens... Sure, you might argue with my list here, but the fact still remains the same - most of the ships are recognizable, and almost all are viable with certain fleet styles.

 

There really shouldn't be as many capitol ship designs out there compared to fighters.  If we take a look at the US Navy and compare it to Armada, you have Aircraft Carriers, Cruisers, Destroyers, Frigates, Patrol Ships, and Submarines as the large classification of ships.  Due to the money and cost of each of these ships, while they're all unique and individual (think VSD-1 vs. VSD-2), they pretty much have the same design (or two designs if they're phasing one out and a new one in).  Take subs for example, there are 4 classes of subs in service right now - one is being phased out, one was a failed replacement (only 3 exist), one is being phased in, and one is a large variation (twice the size of the others).  If we compare that to Armada, you can think of the phased out and the phased in as the VSD1 and VSD2, and then the super sub the ISD (though they would actually probably compare to Destroyers not subs).  Actually, the comparison would be Aircraft Carrier = Quasar, Destroyer = ISD, Cruiser = GSD, Frigate = VSD, Patrol = Arquitens/Raider, Subs = Interdictor.  Or something like that.

 

Now, compare that to the number of fighters... You're no longer going to have ship to ship variations as much.  Each aircraft is going to be built the same.  The changes may be what ordnance is carried.  The Navy itself has the F35-C, F-18C, F-18E/F, EA-18G, E-2C, P-8A, P-3C, C-2A... And then let's not forget that there's also the airforce that really should be rolled into that as well.  They can be classified as Strike (aka bomber), Fighters, Electronic Warfare fighters, Coordination, Coordination/Electronic carriers, transports.  So you can see, each one basically has its own purpose, there are 6 types and 8 aircraft - but two are being phased in and out - dropping it down to 6.  But as I said - you'd have to take into account the Airforce, who's going to have the same 6 types, but different fighters for the roles.  And then the fact that there are more purpose built ships in Star Wars for planetary vs. space combat.  And it makes sense that there would be numerous fighters compared to ships... Though let it be known, in Armada, there are 8 squadrons (excluding the villains because they're hired hands basically) - /ln (cheap fighter), /x1 (experimental), /in (fighter phased out), /sa (strike), /d (fighter phased in), /p (electronic warfare), VT-49 (coordination), Lambda (transport)... Really, it's not that different from reality.  

 

And now I question the purpose of this post.

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6 hours ago, Khyros said:

Personally, as a player of both X wing and Armada, I'm much happier with how Armada is handling releases.  I'm absolutely fine with the long breaks in releases - it's much more preferable over X wing's "yet's just give them ships no one has ever heard of, and implement such a power creep that everyone flies them" approach.

 

The fact that almost every ship is recognizable to a semi-hardcore fan is great imo.  The only real exceptions I can think of would be: Assault Frigate Mark II, Gladiator Star Destroyer, MC30, Interdictor and Artquitens... Sure, you might argue with my list here, but the fact still remains the same - most of the ships are recognizable, and almost all are viable with certain fleet styles.

 

There really shouldn't be as many capitol ship designs out there compared to fighters.  If we take a look at the US Navy and compare it to Armada, you have Aircraft Carriers, Cruisers, Destroyers, Frigates, Patrol Ships, and Submarines as the large classification of ships.  Due to the money and cost of each of these ships, while they're all unique and individual (think VSD-1 vs. VSD-2), they pretty much have the same design (or two designs if they're phasing one out and a new one in).  Take subs for example, there are 4 classes of subs in service right now - one is being phased out, one was a failed replacement (only 3 exist), one is being phased in, and one is a large variation (twice the size of the others).  If we compare that to Armada, you can think of the phased out and the phased in as the VSD1 and VSD2, and then the super sub the ISD (though they would actually probably compare to Destroyers not subs).  Actually, the comparison would be Aircraft Carrier = Quasar, Destroyer = ISD, Cruiser = GSD, Frigate = VSD, Patrol = Arquitens/Raider, Subs = Interdictor.  Or something like that.

 

Now, compare that to the number of fighters... You're no longer going to have ship to ship variations as much.  Each aircraft is going to be built the same.  The changes may be what ordnance is carried.  The Navy itself has the F35-C, F-18C, F-18E/F, EA-18G, E-2C, P-8A, P-3C, C-2A... And then let's not forget that there's also the airforce that really should be rolled into that as well.  They can be classified as Strike (aka bomber), Fighters, Electronic Warfare fighters, Coordination, Coordination/Electronic carriers, transports.  So you can see, each one basically has its own purpose, there are 6 types and 8 aircraft - but two are being phased in and out - dropping it down to 6.  But as I said - you'd have to take into account the Airforce, who's going to have the same 6 types, but different fighters for the roles.  And then the fact that there are more purpose built ships in Star Wars for planetary vs. space combat.  And it makes sense that there would be numerous fighters compared to ships... Though let it be known, in Armada, there are 8 squadrons (excluding the villains because they're hired hands basically) - /ln (cheap fighter), /x1 (experimental), /in (fighter phased out), /sa (strike), /d (fighter phased in), /p (electronic warfare), VT-49 (coordination), Lambda (transport)... Really, it's not that different from reality.  

 

And now I question the purpose of this post.

Modern weapons of war are developed and changed out every couple decades with a couple exceptions(I'm looking at you grandpa B-52). Navy ships do last longer(30 to 40 years) but even then they're upgraded insanely to the point where the guts barely look the same after a decade. All of that happens because we(modern humanity) has been in an insane tech uptick since the industrial revolution and it's continued at even faster paces(my favorite example is thumb drives, look at the past 10 years of development when it was "cool" that they could hold 16m now they come as big as 4 TB's). 

Star wars is a static universe technologically. They've either hit a wall, developed everything possible or lost the capability of innovating beyond their current point of tech. In legends this was so bad that things in KotOR are nearly the same level of tech as "modern"(long time ago) times. 

I'm not saying i don't like Armada's ship release schedule, I don't mind only getting 1/2 waves / year BUT, better communication and "extras" like campaigns are what we're pining for. No one disagrees that X-wings release schedule is crazy town, I've argued for a while now that X-wing DESPERATELY needs a second edition to fix its weird "urban sprawl" of space ships.   

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I disagree that it's static. You have the Venator, replaced by the Victory I, replaced by the Victory II, replaced by the Imperial I, replaced by the Imperial II... all in about 25 years.

 

You have the Headhunter replaced by the T65 X wing, the B replacing the Y. And the creation of the A. Looking forward another 20 years shows the /FO replacing the /LN, the T-70 and T-85 replacing the T-65, and something going on with the A wing... they are not at a steady state of technology.

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