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[Article] Legacies - Spoiler Review So Far (Part 2)

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You are calling Aayla filler? Lets review, 3 damage sides, 10 health, a resource and a special that acts like a focus and mitigation and can chain other special abilities with that focus and you get all of this for what 11/14 pts? Nope, but she should cost that. She comes in cheaper than kanan at 9/12. She is straight up better than Yoda although she shouldn't be.

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1 hour ago, Mep said:

You are calling Aayla filler? Lets review, 3 damage sides, 10 health, a resource and a special that acts like a focus and mitigation and can chain other special abilities with that focus and you get all of this for what 11/14 pts? Nope, but she should cost that. She comes in cheaper than kanan at 9/12. She is straight up better than Yoda although she shouldn't be.

Yep, I think she'll be a good filler character; she's not one that you're going to build around, but she'll be good if you have a spare 12pts and want a damage-dealing blue character.  In the pairing with Qui-Gon Jinn (who is likely to be hot property once Legacies hits), in my opinion Aayla Secura wouldn't even be the second-best partner for him; I think Yoda or Kanan will be better.  But don't get me wrong, I think she is good, just not amazing.  

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I'd say Aayla's power is dependent on a) how good Indirect Damage ends up being, and b) who she can pair up with. She's comparable to New Phasma in terms of damage until Phasma's special upgrades, though the damage is indirect...But her special is also better than Phasma's focus. Oh, and she costs 2 points less than Phasma now. Rebels may not have the raw damage to push Indirect, but it wouldn't take much if we got a good partner for her to make her busted. Something like an 18 point Red character with a couple of effective 3 damage sides and she's probably coping a points increase, which I think definitely justifies more than a 3. 

I think Maul and especially Palp are overrated. Maul is good, but he's 'fair' - and so far Destiny has proven that fair characters don't dominate. Maybe he'll break the mold, but I don't think so. Palp I think people will find MUCH less powerful when they get their hands on him. You'll often only get to use his ability for one, at which point he's a better Jyn, but Jyn is really really bad, so that probably puts Palp at 'playable, but not good'. But really, he's a twenty point character capping out at 2 damage, and that's not enough when you've got characters at a much cheaper cost dealing the same kind of damage (seriously, Aayla at 12 points is one off matching his damage across her three sides).

Yoda is amazing. Even just looking at him as having 10 health, 2 focus and two resource sides, he's good. But the fact those resources sides are ALSO shields/focus/mill makes him in the running for best LS support character (really, Maz being his only competition). 

Maul's Lightsaber is Kylo's on crack. It's nuts. The only possible reason not to run it is if you don't think you can meet the modifier requirement. In an ironic twist, New Kylo is probably the best user of it. 

 

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Blue hero is gonna be broken and if people say it isn't they are delusional

Aayla special is bananas, I would rather have that than new phasma ablilty 

Plus she costs elite the same as jango 1 die, how does that work really

Yoda is broken already and he is well undercosted, him elite with elite ashoka or qui gon, should of been 14 to stop that

So now hero have aayla, Yoda, old Rey and Kanan who all are brilliant at 13 elite or under and good villain characters on the same cost as these are........ Oh wait they all got nerfed to "balance" the game 

Balancing doesn't mean shafting one side because it dominated with poor design, it means create equal sides

Unless villain get some cheap good elite red and yellow this set, the new guys in control have as much sense in balance as lucus did

People will disagree with me and that's fine, plus lets not even start on sabine

 

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2 hours ago, Abyss said:

I'd say Aayla's power is dependent on a) how good Indirect Damage ends up being, and b) who she can pair up with. She's comparable to New Phasma in terms of damage until Phasma's special upgrades, though the damage is indirect...But her special is also better than Phasma's focus. Oh, and she costs 2 points less than Phasma now. Rebels may not have the raw damage to push Indirect, but it wouldn't take much if we got a good partner for her to make her busted. Something like an 18 point Red character with a couple of effective 3 damage sides and she's probably coping a points increase, which I think definitely justifies more than a 3. 

I think Maul and especially Palp are overrated. Maul is good, but he's 'fair' - and so far Destiny has proven that fair characters don't dominate. Maybe he'll break the mold, but I don't think so. Palp I think people will find MUCH less powerful when they get their hands on him. You'll often only get to use his ability for one, at which point he's a better Jyn, but Jyn is really really bad, so that probably puts Palp at 'playable, but not good'. But really, he's a twenty point character capping out at 2 damage, and that's not enough when you've got characters at a much cheaper cost dealing the same kind of damage (seriously, Aayla at 12 points is one off matching his damage across her three sides).

Yoda is amazing. Even just looking at him as having 10 health, 2 focus and two resource sides, he's good. But the fact those resources sides are ALSO shields/focus/mill makes him in the running for best LS support character (really, Maz being his only competition). 

Maul's Lightsaber is Kylo's on crack. It's nuts. The only possible reason not to run it is if you don't think you can meet the modifier requirement. In an ironic twist, New Kylo is probably the best user of it. 

 

Maul and Palp are 2 different topics:

Maul: Good, not exactly the legendary you want to pull from your pack in a box if you didnt get 1-2 Yoda in that box (Less than 20$) regular dice side, and a relatively orienting ability that could have been worded like this: "Roll after opponent character only, force your opponent to mitigate support, upgrade or another characters dice."

Palpatine: Deck must be built around him, very strong: 3 damage side, free, an ability that looks all your dice in play for rebate... You will USE his ability each turn because you built a deck around that (Of course because you put him in the deck, you would have put someone else if not). Damage wise, he is cheaper that Old Vader, and has 3 damage side compared to 2... Value will be higher than maul (20-25$) but since his deck will be more difficult to build around than Maul, some might be unhappy to pull him as legendary in a box instead of someone else.

Yoda: Ultra strong (Not broken), similar to cousin "Maz", even more versatile, no blanks, very strong special you can rely on (2 dice, 2special per dice, 66% one special per roll)  low cost. Will fit in several actual deck, and will have several deck created with him. Ultra strong combined with high demand will make a 40-60$ (60$+ if more players joins during holidays and temporary shortage of expansion).

Maul light saber: No explanation here. Too easy to understand that this will be the 40-50$ upgrade in the set...

 

33 minutes ago, Plymouthdean86 said:

Blue hero is gonna be broken and if people say it isn't they are delusional

Aayla special is bananas, I would rather have that than new phasma ablilty 

Plus she costs elite the same as jango 1 die, how does that work really

Yoda is broken already and he is well undercosted, him elite with elite ashoka or qui gon, should of been 14 to stop that

So now hero have aayla, Yoda, old Rey and Kanan who all are brilliant at 13 elite or under and good villain characters on the same cost as these are........ Oh wait they all got nerfed to "balance" the game 

Balancing doesn't mean shafting one side because it dominated with poor design, it means create equal sides

Unless villain get some cheap good elite red and yellow this set, the new guys in control have as much sense in balance as lucus did

People will disagree with me and that's fine, plus lets not even start on sabine

 

Not "broken". On several points you are right. Yoda +anyone at 17- will be interresting. Might even give another life to underpowered older characters (Luminara comes to mind, other are possible). Yoda's not limited to blue partner also.

Chak

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Sheer fact the Maul's Saber is Villain and unique will keep it from 40-50$. I suspect it to be Z6 level expensive if not a few bucks more.

A LOT of blue villain players i know dont like doing sabers that much. They usually just abuse holocron for free abilities, to the point where i have to autoinclude Rend because 8/10 of the time its a holocron deck.
Blue heroes on the other hand tend to use sabers alot.

Course this is all in my area, ymmv.

I suspect villains to get some good 11-13cost characters, we still have red/yellow/potentially more gray characters to be spoiled and of course theres bound to be blues they didnt spoil. Villains right now have 2 11cost elites and it jumps all the way to 13 for oldkylo. They have way too big of a void in that area to let it stay that way. Blue heroes are going to be nasty i agree but i highly doubt it'll be to the same degree that was FN/NewPhasma/Plutt
Oh, Villains also only have 1 10pt elite.

Edited by Vineheart01

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5 hours ago, Chakan99939 said:

Maul and Palp are 2 different topics:

Maul: Good, not exactly the legendary you want to pull from your pack in a box if you didnt get 1-2 Yoda in that box (Less than 20$) regular dice side, and a relatively orienting ability that could have been worded like this: "Roll after opponent character only, force your opponent to mitigate support, upgrade or another characters dice."

Palpatine: Deck must be built around him, very strong: 3 damage side, free, an ability that looks all your dice in play for rebate... You will USE his ability each turn because you built a deck around that (Of course because you put him in the deck, you would have put someone else if not). Damage wise, he is cheaper that Old Vader, and has 3 damage side compared to 2... Value will be higher than maul (20-25$) but since his deck will be more difficult to build around than Maul, some might be unhappy to pull him as legendary in a box instead of someone else.

Yoda: Ultra strong (Not broken), similar to cousin "Maz", even more versatile, no blanks, very strong special you can rely on (2 dice, 2special per dice, 66% one special per roll)  low cost. Will fit in several actual deck, and will have several deck created with him. Ultra strong combined with high demand will make a 40-60$ (60$+ if more players joins during holidays and temporary shortage of expansion).

Maul light saber: No explanation here. Too easy to understand that this will be the 40-50$ upgrade in the set...

 

Palpatine2 is a regular Rare, not Legendary.  So he'll be like $5.

And the only time Legendary cards hit and keep anything even near $40-50+ these days is if they're ubiquitous neutral cards.  Ancient Lightsaber, X-8 Night Sniper, Force Speed, etc.  Any hero/villiain specific, and in particular character Legendaries where a player will only ever want 2, tend to cap at around $20.

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Anyone else see the release date on Amazon? If you go to leagacy booster boxes in Amazon they say releases January 31 and rivals says December 31 

Edited by Rafug9

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20 hours ago, Whingewood said:

Yep, I think she'll be a good filler character; she's not one that you're going to build around, but she'll be good if you have a spare 12pts and want a damage-dealing blue character.  In the pairing with Qui-Gon Jinn (who is likely to be hot property once Legacies hits), in my opinion Aayla Secura wouldn't even be the second-best partner for him; I think Yoda or Kanan will be better.  But don't get me wrong, I think she is good, just not amazing.  

Yeah, we all know Qui Gon is getting errata to once per round soon. He is already not interesting since he's about to get a saber in the gut. Also, she isn't a partner for Qui Gon. Her ability allows for abuse of specials since you can resolve hers - focus to a special, resolve that special. It is crazy they did this with her and Force Focus. There are some specials out there that are very good.

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5 hours ago, Mep said:

Yeah, we all know Qui Gon is getting errata to once per round soon. He is already not interesting since he's about to get a saber in the gut. Also, she isn't a partner for Qui Gon. Her ability allows for abuse of specials since you can resolve hers - focus to a special, resolve that special. It is crazy they did this with her and Force Focus. There are some specials out there that are very good.

Humm, "Complety broken, errata, overpowered".........

Of course because using 3 shield to do 3 damage is OP...

You know, Sabine and IG-88 each have a 3 gun side and 2 dice!!! Thats twice the damage without even combining cards.

Sorry i'm sarcastic, ?

Chak

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9 hours ago, RJM said:

Palpatine2 is a regular Rare, not Legendary.  So he'll be like $5.

And the only time Legendary cards hit and keep anything even near $40-50+ these days is if they're ubiquitous neutral cards.  Ancient Lightsaber, X-8 Night Sniper, Force Speed, etc.  Any hero/villiain specific, and in particular character Legendaries where a player will only ever want 2, tend to cap at around $20.

Sorry for Pal, didnt notice.

Yoda: At last someone is challenging me!!! You bet 20$ I say 40-50$ MINIMUM (BTW Canadian dollar, please remove 30% from my numbers). Lets see who will be right.

Chak

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2 hours ago, Chakan99939 said:

Sorry for Pal, didnt notice.

Yoda: At last someone is challenging me!!! You bet 20$ I say 40-50$ MINIMUM (BTW Canadian dollar, please remove 30% from my numbers). Lets see who will be right.

Chak

Heh.  I was speaking in USD, so we're not actually that far apart.  But I think, sure, people hunting Yoda the first few weeks might pay $40.  But look at Thrawn.  He was hyped and selling for $40.  Now I can BIN on eBay for about $17 USD shipped.  History has shown exactly what kind of cards ride out the hype, and it's very rarely anything but neutral, all purpose legendaries.

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3 hours ago, RJM said:

Heh.  I was speaking in USD, so we're not actually that far apart.  But I think, sure, people hunting Yoda the first few weeks might pay $40.  But look at Thrawn.  He was hyped and selling for $40.  Now I can BIN on eBay for about $17 USD shipped.  History has shown exactly what kind of cards ride out the hype, and it's very rarely anything but neutral, all purpose legendaries.

Thrawn lost is gas petal when Unkar got nerfed that's why his price went down.  I tend to agree that Yoda will start high but I don't think he will settle lower than $30.  As for Maul, I also think he is going to settle around $17-$22.  Thrawn is still $33 on chance cube.

Edited by Jorgyn Ryss

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10 hours ago, RJM said:

Heh.  I was speaking in USD, so we're not actually that far apart.  But I think, sure, people hunting Yoda the first few weeks might pay $40.  But look at Thrawn.  He was hyped and selling for $40.  Now I can BIN on eBay for about $17 USD shipped.  History has shown exactly what kind of cards ride out the hype, and it's very rarely anything but neutral, all purpose legendaries.

Thrawn price was justified by first being a relatively popular character in the story and was indeed a good card. However, as good as he is, he is part, or was part, of a very specific kind of deck (Discard, or in rare caee, vehicule). 

Yoda's gonna be versatile to the death. Lets speak USD $, I maintain my point at 40-50$.

Chak

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Thrawn's price tanked because he has no percieved strong pairing any longer. He also, as of yet, is a one deck type pony.

Yoda can fit in more decks because of his low point cost. 13 points has been one of the most popular cost slots because they can fit in so many places. He can also play in  both damage and mill decks.

For that reason I agree he'll easily beat out Thrawn's pricing. If it wasnt for the initial AWK shortage Id say he will probably be the most expensive character in the game, but Vader might get to argue.

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On November 17, 2017 at 7:18 PM, Chakan99939 said:

Humm, "Complety broken, errata, overpowered".........

Of course because using 3 shield to do 3 damage is OP...

You know, Sabine and IG-88 each have a 3 gun side and 2 dice!!! Thats twice the damage without even combining cards.

Sorry i'm sarcastic, ?

Chak

I actually think Qui Gon is potentially too strong in the next set as mentioned earlier. Shields are uber efficient. When you can play multiple cards like take cover, caution and Luke's protection for free, then throw in synchronicity that is slightly situational but very doable (2 unblockable for ZERO cost). There is too much synergy here, like battlefields that give shield. Partner him with red, and you have spirit of rebellion and 1 cost air superiority, hero version of backup muscle. All this and you barely have to pay for anything.

Then the money can go to upgrades (not even sure that he needs them really unless you're doing double shotos) and mitigation. There's even amazing cards like sound the alarm for free. But I feel like there's not much that an opponent can do to prevent all that free shield/damage. Just my two cents..

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First turn for yoda/qui gon can go something like this.

- roll yoda and make sure to hit on one special

- resolve specials for 2 resources and 1 or 2 shields (depending if you needed to focus)

- plop on two shotos (or any 2 cost upgrades like vibros if you want. Jedi robes would also be excellent here)

- roll qui gon

- play synchronicity if you have shield and melee sides

- play 0 cost cards to generate shields to get qui gon to 3 shields

- play Ataru strike

- resolve remaining dice

 

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3 hours ago, Finnish said:

resolve specials for 2 resources and 1 or 2 shields (depending if you needed to focus)

Cannot pick the same option twice, its worded identical to force training.

You pick two of the following, not do the following until you have done 2 things. It goes you no window to do the same one twice.

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35 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:

Cannot pick the same option twice, its worded identical to force training.

You pick two of the following, not do the following until you have done 2 things. It goes you no window to do the same one twice.

Sorry, here's the sequence,

resolve first special and take 1 resource, potentially turn second die to a special (or take a shield)

Resolve second die special in same action. Take resource and shield

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10 hours ago, Finnish said:

I actually think Qui Gon is potentially too strong in the next set as mentioned earlier. Shields are uber efficient. When you can play multiple cards like take cover, caution and Luke's protection for free, then throw in synchronicity that is slightly situational but very doable (2 unblockable for ZERO cost). There is too much synergy here, like battlefields that give shield. Partner him with red, and you have spirit of rebellion and 1 cost air superiority, hero version of backup muscle. All this and you barely have to pay for anything.

Then the money can go to upgrades (not even sure that he needs them really unless you're doing double shotos) and mitigation. There's even amazing cards like sound the alarm for free. But I feel like there's not much that an opponent can do to prevent all that free shield/damage. Just my two cents..

 

10 hours ago, Finnish said:

First turn for yoda/qui gon can go something like this.

- roll yoda and make sure to hit on one special

- resolve specials for 2 resources and 1 or 2 shields (depending if you needed to focus)

- plop on two shotos (or any 2 cost upgrades like vibros if you want. Jedi robes would also be excellent here)

- roll qui gon

- play synchronicity if you have shield and melee sides

- play 0 cost cards to generate shields to get qui gon to 3 shields

- play Ataru strike

- resolve remaining dice

 

Humm you know in game it rarely works like this:

After step 2: Opponent can resolve a 2 damege side to pop your shield

After step 6: Opponent can use a 3 damage side to pop all thise 3 shields

Thats 2 dices for your opponents, no cards. You've used dices AND cards. 

Qui-Gon will probably revive thanks to that expansion, and he will have very good synergy (Good doesnt mean broken).

Chak

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I agree. To reiterate, I think he is potentially too strong. He's not broken but very consistent. For the opposing player to roll 3 damage means a 17 point or 20 point character and potentially having to pay resource or life (Vader) for that damage - assuming rerolls break even for both players. Hitting shield means it slows the Aggro. Qui gon player can also play removal and mitigate if the trade off is one card and no resource cost like sound the alarm.

The advantage for qui gon is multiple ways to do damage for 0 cost with dice (yoda) and cards. This often leaves his dice and upgrades alone to do damage, and the 4 damage sides on his dice (since I count shield sides as damage) is also very consistent. 

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For once, I'm much more impressed with the Heroes than the Villains.

Maul will see play because he is Maul.  But for one extra cost you can have 2P Kylo, so he has a pretty narrow band of potential partners.  Palpatine's ability seems cool, but it depends on rolling mixed damage, and we've already found with Jyn that a 20 point character with no more than 2s doesn't generate enough damage.  Maul's Lightsaber is the only Villain card revealed in this batch which really excites me, because it can deal a good amount of damage even without the Power Action.

Meanwhile Heroes get some awesome characters.  Yoda is a no-miss Swiss Army Knife.  Aayla Secura has the same Melee damage sides as 2P Rey, Dooku and Ventress, PLUS 2 Indirect damage, for three less points.  I'm a bit worried that they are over-correcting for the apparent Villain bias in the first sets.

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