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thebigeb2589

I don't mind clarification but cmon

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First let me start with I'm no noob. I've been here since wave 1. This is not a post about me rage quitting x wing. This is not a post about me calling for a boycott on ffg. All I want to say is c'mon ffg get your ***** together. 

This hard errata nonsense is getting out of hand. Truthfully not one hard errata has ever messed with me personally but the fact that they ruin 100s of dollars at a shot is very upsetting. I know ppl who played 100$ for a raider just for palp. I know p who support local stores and only shop there, as a result they have paid 39$ a piece per jumpmaster. They try for wave after wave after wave for ppl to use bombs only to nerf adv. Slam and consequently the only rebel ship other than nym to be using them. I never thought Biggs was that bad cuz he was dead after the first round of engagement anyway and gave rebels a chance to get themselves set up without arc dodgers destroying their list by turn 2 planning phase. 

I'm not saying that the errata isn't helping rebalance but they need to seriously up their alpha testing and stop wasting their players money like this. If they keep it up they will piss enough ppl off that they will give this game a bad name and it could die off. I know sooo many ppl who refuse to even look at 40k even after investing 1000s because they are tired of rule book changes every quarter.

I think more than anything I'm just dissapointed. It used to be an easy game to play. Buy a ship. Do what the card said. Play a game. Now you gotta read through 25 pages of faq just to make sure your doing it right. Smh. Get it together guys. Seriously

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5 hours ago, RufusDaMan said:

I can't feel sorry for people who buy things because they are OP. I bought all my ships because I liked them, and I play them still, even if they are not great. My Punisher is one of my most frequently played ship.

If you bought triple jumpmasters, or even the raider, not because you wanted to play it, but because of the power it represented, you had it coming. If you only care about being powerful, and selectively buy the most broken things out there, don't be surprised if your **** is keep getting nerfed.

If your priority was about cool ships, you would rarely run into this problem.

You like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like thisYou like this 

Hey Rufus, guess what?

I like this. 

Edited by Celestial Lizards

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8 minutes ago, thebigeb2589 said:

I think more than anything I'm just dissapointed. It used to be an easy game to play. Buy a ship. Do what the card said. Play a game. Now you gotta read through 25 pages of faq just to make sure your doing it right. Smh. Get it together guys. Seriously

Also, all of the errata can actually be summarized in a single page. The rest of the 25 pages is clarification, and in my experience those are things we actually have to look up, and not the card changes (everyone knows them by heart). The game is not more complicated because of errata

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8 minutes ago, RufusDaMan said:

I can't feel sorry for people who buy things because they are OP. I bought all my ships because I liked them, and I play them still, even if they are not great. My Punisher is one of my most frequently played ship.

If you bought triple jumpmasters, or even the raider, not because you wanted to play it, but because of the power it represented, you had it coming. If you only care about being powerful, and selectively buy the most broken things out there, don't be surprised if your **** is keep getting nerfed.

If your priority was about cool ships, you would rarely run into this problem.

To your point, if you're in it for the tourny then I would expect to spend money on the every changing meta.  No arguments there.

But I bought the ships because they were cool and had nothing to do with Meta or being Over Powered.  Yet if I want to play Star War: X-Wing without making up my own rules or ignoring others, then, I too have to wade through 25 pages of an FAQ that contradicts itself.

While I don't agree with the Original Poster about the money part, and I've spent a lot, I do think this is getting carried away.  Sure we'd all like a balanced game. But really? An FAQ as big as the rules and multiple listings of the same card with different text in each place, and no way of knowing how long the rules is good for, etc.  For a casual player this is a bit ridiculous, not to mention how complex the 'simple' game is.

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34 minutes ago, Ken at Sunrise said:

To your point, if you're in it for the tourny then I would expect to spend money on the every changing meta.  No arguments there.

But I bought the ships because they were cool and had nothing to do with Meta or being Over Powered.  Yet if I want to play Star War: X-Wing without making up my own rules or ignoring others, then, I too have to wade through 25 pages of an FAQ that contradicts itself.

While I don't agree with the Original Poster about the money part, and I've spent a lot, I do think this is getting carried away.  Sure we'd all like a balanced game. But really? An FAQ as big as the rules and multiple listings of the same card with different text in each place, and no way of knowing how long the rules is good for, etc.  For a casual player this is a bit ridiculous, not to mention how complex the 'simple' game is.

If you're just there to play a Star Wars game, you really don't have to worry about the FAQ.  What's printed on the cards is good enough for casual play - full stop. 

As for those who DO want to play competitively, the complexity of the FAQ wouldn't be an issue if they just made every alt. art card that they give away an updated version of the errata'd cards, and sold a 'tournament pack' with the updated ones.  Also, I still think it's the right time for a complete 2.0 overhaul of every ship using the philosophy of all the added upgrades, upgrade slots, maneuvers, mechanics, actions, and tokens.  

Edited by Arttemis

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2 minutes ago, Arttemis said:

Wouldn't be an issue if they just made every alt. art card that they give away an updated version of the errata'd cards, and sold a 'tournament pack' with the updated ones.

I'd be okay with new replacement cards. I'd even turn in my old ones.

But really the problem goes beyond the card text thought that's my biggest gripe. It is that fact that even the FAQ which is suppose to clear things up simply demonstrates how complex this game really is.

Edited by Ken at Sunrise

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I can't complain about the Jumpmaster nerf in particular. I was at the Evergreen Cup two weeks ago. It's team event, where three players bring one list from each faction and then rotate. Almost every team was flying some form of Jumpmaster for their Scum list. Most were Torp Scouts, but there were a few Dengars as well.

That ship has been broken since release. FFG has nerfed Deadeye, R4 Agromechs and Manaroo's pilot ability in their ongoing attempts to bring that ship under control. None of it has worked, because none of them addressed the core problem, which is that the chassis itself was just too cheap for everything it could do.

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8 minutes ago, Ken at Sunrise said:

I'd be okay with new replacement cards. I'd even turn in my old ones.

But really the problem goes beyond the card text thought that's my biggest gripe. It is that fact that even the FAQ which is suppose to clear things up simply demonstrates how complex this game really is.

Whilst I dont agree with your OP, I do agree that FFG owe it to new players to release the updated cards to read how it is supposed to read. It's only because we have been playing for a while that we know how /X7 now works for example. if you were new, didn't read the forums you could be forgiven if you thought that /X7 works the way it is written on the card. There has been talk that FFG can't release card only packs for licensing reasons, but surely if we already own the cards we can get them updated somehow.  

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4 minutes ago, PhantomFO said:

I can't complain about the Jumpmaster nerf in particular. I was at the Evergreen Cup two weeks ago. It's team event, where three players bring one list from each faction and then rotate. Almost every team was flying some form of Jumpmaster for their Scum list. Most were Torp Scouts, but there were a few Dengars as well.

That ship has been broken since release. FFG has nerfed Deadeye, R4 Agromechs and Manaroo's pilot ability in their ongoing attempts to bring that ship under control. None of it has worked, because none of them addressed the core problem, which is that the chassis itself was just too cheap for everything it could do.

Jumpmaster nerf, yeah I can't complain at all, but in the manner it was nerfed I can. At this point there is no component in the game that is not subject to change. Right now I would be perfectly fine with an errata that says Treat all straight maneuvers on Jumpmaster 5000 dials as white. I mean why not every thing else has already been done to the card and it is not the card but the dial that is the problem. YT-2400 now has a Mobile firing arc, sure. All out of arc attacks require attacker to spend a focus token. Go for it.

Edited by Marinealver

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1 hour ago, RufusDaMan said:

I can't feel sorry for people who buy things because they are OP. I bought all my ships because I liked them, and I play them still, even if they are not great. My Punisher is one of my most frequently played ship.

If you bought triple jumpmasters, or even the raider, not because you wanted to play it, but because of the power it represented, you had it coming. If you only care about being powerful, and selectively buy the most broken things out there, don't be surprised if your **** is keep getting nerfed.

If your priority was about cool ships, you would rarely run into this problem.

AMEN!

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1 hour ago, RufusDaMan said:

I can't feel sorry for people who buy things because they are OP. I bought all my ships because I liked them, and I play them still, even if they are not great. My Punisher is one of my most frequently played ship.

If your priority was about cool ships, you would rarely run into this problem.

 

1 hour ago, thebigeb2589 said:

Now you gotta read through 25 pages of faq just to make sure your doing it right.

 

57 minutes ago, Ken at Sunrise said:

To your point, if you're in it for the tourny then I would expect to spend money on the every changing meta.  No arguments there.

 Yet if I want to play Star War: X-Wing without making up my own rules or ignoring others, then, I too have to wade through 25 pages of an FAQ.

 

23 minutes ago, Arttemis said:

If you're just there to play a Star Wars game, you really don't have to worry about the FAQ.  What's printed on the cards is good enough for casual play - full stop. 

 

21 minutes ago, Ken at Sunrise said:

I'd be okay with new replacement cards.

Yep.  Gotta say I agree with all of the above.  So, mostly I follow Arttemis's suggestion.  If we play the game mostly right, I'm good with that.

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I own 4 jumpmasters and the only comment I have is that the Punishing one title should grant a salvage mech and torp slot.  It's unique... not a problem.

Other than that I mostly find ADV slam distasteful due to how far it removes the card from its intent.  Not only does it not work as in the advertisement... now it doesn't even work at all.  I would rather have just had it assign a stress token so at least it made some sense and you could fly more than 1 ship.  I don't care so much if this makes Kwing swarms non-tourney viable but at least it would make some sense in regards to the design intent of the card.

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1 hour ago, thebigeb2589 said:

First let me start with I'm no noob. I've been here since wave 1. This is not a post about me rage quitting x wing. This is not a post about me calling for a boycott on ffg. All I want to say is c'mon ffg get your ***** together. 

This hard errata nonsense is getting out of hand. Truthfully not one hard errata has ever messed with me personally but the fact that they ruin 100s of dollars at a shot is very upsetting. I know ppl who played 100$ for a raider just for palp. I know p who support local stores and only shop there, as a result they have paid 39$ a piece per jumpmaster. They try for wave after wave after wave for ppl to use bombs only to nerf adv. Slam and consequently the only rebel ship other than nym to be using them. I never thought Biggs was that bad cuz he was dead after the first round of engagement anyway and gave rebels a chance to get themselves set up without arc dodgers destroying their list by turn 2 planning phase. 

I'm not saying that the errata isn't helping rebalance but they need to seriously up their alpha testing and stop wasting their players money like this. If they keep it up they will piss enough ppl off that they will give this game a bad name and it could die off. I know sooo many ppl who refuse to even look at 40k even after investing 1000s because they are tired of rule book changes every quarter.

I think more than anything I'm just dissapointed. It used to be an easy game to play. Buy a ship. Do what the card said. Play a game. Now you gotta read through 25 pages of faq just to make sure your doing it right. Smh. Get it together guys. Seriously

Palpatine is still good.  He's in a lot of the top imperial lists no less.  He's just used *differnetly* than he used to be.  The same will be true of the jumpmaster.  You can still fly a jumpmaster quite effectively with this nerf.  You probably will NOT fly 3 of them anymore though.   Miranda couldn't care less about the advanced lsam nerf, that really only kills triple k-wing bombres.  Biggs was bad because he limited design space.  And in a list like FSR, you can shoot at the list for an entire tournament game and have  iggs still be alive.

28 minutes ago, Marinealver said:

Jumpmaster nerf, yeah I can't complain at all, but in the manner it was nerfed I can. At this point there is no component in the game that is not subject to change. Right now I would be perfectly fine with an errata that says Treat all straight maneuvers on Jumpmaster 5000 dials as white. I mean why not every thing else has already been done to the card and it is not the card but the dial that is the problem. YT-2400 now has a Mobile firing arc, sure. All out of arc attacks require attacker to spend a focus token. Go for it.

There was really no way for them to fix the jumpmaster without changing some component that previously hadn't been changed before.  The cost, the upgrade slots, the dial, SOMETHING had to change.

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7 minutes ago, VanderLegion said:

 

Palpatine is still good.  He's in a lot of the top imperial lists no less.  He's just used *differnetly* than he used to be.  The same will be true of the jumpmaster.  You can still fly a jumpmaster quite effectively with this nerf.  You probably will NOT fly 3 of them anymore though.   Miranda couldn't care less about the advanced lsam nerf, that really only kills triple k-wing bombres.  Biggs was bad because he limited design space.  And in a list like FSR, you can shoot at the list for an entire tournament game and have  iggs still be alive.

There was really no way for them to fix the jumpmaster without changing some component that previously hadn't been changed before.  The cost, the upgrade slots, the dial, SOMETHING had to change.

Yup and JM5Ks are still OP. Watch +2 point increase and treat all straight maneuvers as white. Then it will finally be dead. Oh and make Dengar Pilot skill 8.

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1 minute ago, Marinealver said:

Yup and JM5Ks are still OP. Watch +2 point increase and treat all straight maneuvers as white. Then it will finally be dead. Oh and make Dengar Pilot skill 8.

Pretty sure jumpmasters will be fine.  Dengar will be strong, might see bumpmasters, probably not much else.  No torp boats, dengar can't do 3 speed maneuvers (or any kind of turn to the right) and get k4.  The ship doesn't need to be DEAD, just not OP

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10 minutes ago, Marinealver said:

Yup and JM5Ks are still OP. Watch +2 point increase and treat all straight maneuvers as white. Then it will finally be dead. Oh and make Dengar Pilot skill 8.

Not even close to OP anymore. They're finally priced in line with their closest analogues: the Wild Space Fringer and the Outer Rim Smuggler. It was obscene that the JM5K basically just traded a point of shielding, a missile and a cannon slot for two Torpedoes, an astromech, an Illicit slot, an EPT and a point of pilot skill, while also clocking in at five points cheaper than the Fringer, and was better in every category but crew space compared to the ORS.

Now the Fringer is a much better comp, especially with Smuggling Compartments to give it an Illicit slot. For five points and -1 PS, you get a Shield Upgrade, a cannon slot and a missile. That's closer to being fair.

It'll need to be seen if Dengar is still strong without free K4 target locks after a speed-3 maneuver, but he still has a great pilot ability, high pilot skill, and a decent statline.

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2 hours ago, RufusDaMan said:

I can't feel sorry for people who buy things because they are OP. I bought all my ships because I liked them, and I play them still, even if they are not great. My Punisher is one of my most frequently played ship.

If you bought triple jumpmasters, or even the raider, not because you wanted to play it, but because of the power it represented, you had it coming. If you only care about being powerful, and selectively buy the most broken things out there, don't be surprised if your **** is keep getting nerfed.

If your priority was about cool ships, you would rarely run into this problem.

Scurrgs and Defenders were two of my favourite ships from the entire EU since forever.

You can imagine my dissapointment when Defenders showed up as crap, but it was actually even worse when they suddenly became the ship du jour - suddenly the fact that it was cool did not matter, because it was powerful. Scurrg left me in a similar quandry - love the ship, but not when it's absolutely everywhere.

Mostly I hope they patch the Punishing One title so that the upgrade cards in the pack are legal again; I don't mind crazy super-Dengars that take their lil' Astromech buddy along for the ride.

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3 minutes ago, Reiver said:

Scurrgs and Defenders were two of my favourite ships from the entire EU since forever.

You can imagine my dissapointment when Defenders showed up as crap, but it was actually even worse when they suddenly became the ship du jour - suddenly the fact that it was cool did not matter, because it was powerful. Scurrg left me in a similar quandry - love the ship, but not when it's absolutely everywhere.

Mostly I hope they patch the Punishing One title so that the upgrade cards in the pack are legal again; I don't mind crazy super-Dengars that take their lil' Astromech buddy along for the ride.

Heck, even just make the Punishing One title like the Havoc: you can only take non-unique astromechs.

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2 hours ago, RufusDaMan said:

If you bought triple jumpmasters, or even the raider, not because you wanted to play it, but because of the power it represented, you had it coming. If you only care about being powerful, and selectively buy the most broken things out there, don't be surprised if your **** is keep getting nerfed.

"If you define yourself by your power to destroy life and create NPE, then you have nothing." - Obi-Wan to Maul, Star Wars rebels

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1 minute ago, Reiver said:

Scurrgs and Defenders were two of my favourite ships from the entire EU since forever.

You can imagine my dissapointment when Defenders showed up as crap, but it was actually even worse when they suddenly became the ship du jour - suddenly the fact that it was cool did not matter, because it was powerful. Scurrg left me in a similar quandry - love the ship, but not when it's absolutely everywhere.

Mostly I hope they patch the Punishing One title so that the upgrade cards in the pack are legal again; I don't mind crazy super-Dengars that take their lil' Astromech buddy along for the ride.

Okay, that legit sucks. :/ But that's what happens when the pricing is "based" on the relative power of the ships, instead of their availability in lore. Rarer and more powerful ships become the staple, because we don't field a whole galaxy wide army, just a couple of ships. This means we will see more Silencers than TIE/LN-s.

I think the nerfs are harsh, but necessary for a balanced game. It's a shame about the Punishing One, but if that's the price of a more diverse game... so be it.

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47 minutes ago, VanderLegion said:

Pretty sure jumpmasters will be fine.  Dengar will be strong, might see bumpmasters, probably not much else.  No torp boats, dengar can't do 3 speed maneuvers (or any kind of turn to the right) and get k4.  The ship doesn't need to be DEAD, just not OP

I don't know, throw Expertise, Dengar Crew, and title on the other pilots and you have a really nice turret who has full mods on every attack (barring stress dealing) without an action. Flavor it with Tel or Manny's ability or the Scout's price (44 for this build) and I think you still have a super solid addition to the team.

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