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Aedo

So, What's Your Exit Strategy?

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This topic might be kind of dangerous because it touches on a possibly sensitive demographic within the forum. But, here we go.

(This evidence is all anecdotal so if you can prove me wrong, that sounds great.)

It seems like there are a goodly number of people who have already decided that they don't like FFG's L5R. Their primary thesis is "If FFG uses the Genesys system for L5R, I'm out. Also, they're definitely going to use the Genesys system." They may well be right, but that's not actually the point of this thread. I'm interested in hearing from these people on the topic of what they intend to do about new L5R RPG. It looks like there's going to be the twelve week open beta during which FFG will (presumably?) be taking feedback from testers. After that, we don't really know.

I had originally thought to make this whole holier than thou speech about how you should go about influencing FFG to change their minds but then it occurred to me, you guys are all smart, you can probably figure out that yelling at the writers is not the most effective way to get them to change their minds. So, I ask you, in light of the upcoming preview of the L5R RPG what is your plan in looking at it and testing it out? And if it ends up being a lost cause, are you going to try and homebrew the new system/plotline, or is there a safe haven in 4E, or what?

Discussion is encouraged over mic drops, but mic drops are still allowed and will be scored by an independent panel of judges.

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   Just because FFG has the license, that doesn't invalidate previous editions.  There are still plenty of people playing 1st edition D&D, or modifications of it.  Pick up the books from your favorite edition (probably cheap, now), and run with that.

   'Cause let's face it, those of us who play the beta will not be causing any massive changes.  It's a beta, which means that the system is basically done, they just need to put some finishing touches on it.  They're not going to scrap the whole thing and start over.  When they tested the Star Wars games, they dealt with balance issues, modified talent trees, and one of the very first things they did was throw out the rule of "you can only have 3 specializations."  The core system stayed in place, and it will do the same here.  If it turns out that everyone hates how they handled Schools, or magic, or Iaijutsu, they may go back to the drawing board a bit, but don't expect, "Hm, there are a lot of complaints about the Narrative Dice System.  Let's just go back to Roll and Keep."

   As for me, if I don't care for it, I'll either go back to my Savage Worlds conversion, or just do it in Genesys.  After all, when I cracked open my first Star Wars Core Book, one of my first thoughts was,  "This could work for L5R!  Edge of the Emerald Empire!"

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I'm gonna beta the living crap out of this game. I have the club's best GM at my disposal and 3 of the most hardcore L5R players in a 100 miles radius. We will beta the game like no mortal man. 

If it still won't work then we have a whole homebrew system to carter to our wicked desires. 

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Test it, test it, test it until our fingers bleed from rolling dice... Banzai! Now in all seriousness, my group is very open minded and are willing to try something new, if it turns out that it doesn’t work, then we will revert to 4th since we have the collection.

It will be cool to create the same character concept using 4E (using the Core Book only) and FFG editions and compare them. How easy was to create a character, combat speed, spell casting, iaijutsu...

 

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Funny thing is I started a brand new campaign with 3 total newbies player (not Just l5r newbies but even total pen&paper newbies) 2 weeks ago using 4th ed. They got hooked by the end of the session. 2nd session is planned in 2 weeks. Depending on when the beta pops out I might be able to work out something using it by then.

good thing is they have no bias toward either the setting or the system yet, even though they see to enjoy R&K.

So we'll try our best to randori this beta. If it doesn't satisfy us, I'll get back to 4th ed.

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Ultimately if my group doesn't like the beta, we'll just return to 4th edition. We enjoy the star wars rules, but it remains to be seen if it will work to our satisfaction for L5R. YMMV. 

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15 minutes ago, Nitenman said:

Funny thing is I started a brand new campaign with 3 total newbies player (not Just l5r newbies but even total pen&paper newbies) 2 weeks ago using 4th ed. They got hooked by the end of the session. 2nd session is planned in 2 weeks. Depending on when the beta pops out I might be able to work out something using it by then.

good thing is they have no bias toward either the setting or the system yet, even though they see to enjoy R&K.

So we'll try our best to randori this beta. If it doesn't satisfy us, I'll get back to 4th ed.

Hey let us know how it goes. I’ll like to compare your group’s review with mine.

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Legend of the Five Rings has an easily accessed ruleset in 4th Edition, with plentiful copies both online and in hard copy, and a well-established and documented setting that is 20 years old and has its own in-depth wiki.

 

Fantasy Flight Games has one option: Make a game people have a reason to buy, because currently, players don't need anything FFG makes for this license.

There's no need for an "exit strategy." The onus is entirely on FFG to create an reason to enter in the first place.  I'll look at it, I'll test it. And if it doesn't measure up, I never needed a 5th Edition in the first place.

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What he said ^

 

A word of wariness though - it may be easy to think "oh, we'll change all things and it will give people a reason to buy!", but it would be wrong - if you change the elements that make players comfortable and familiar with a RPG, they will just go away (I'm looking at you, D&D 4th) and search for alternatives.

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I love the setting of L5R and have enjoyed the very unique and story based system built in 4E, I have seen too much of recycled systems used form one game to the next with FFG but I come here all the time to check out their products because they are inventive, creative, and have very very good art work on their games and designs. I do hope they do NOT recycle a used system or simply "hack" an old one to a better 'edition', I had hoped that they would carry L5R to greater heights BEING that this company (FFG) has done an excellent job of recreating an ancient game into a modern marvel. Don't let us down FFG!!! I already lost interested because of the ending of the GamesworkShop contract but I assume that was all business, because those games were AMAZING. L5R is ALSO a relic of a game that needs to be modernized (but with respect and renewal, not flashy pages and resurfaced systems). Good luck, and thanks for reading!

                                                                                                 --A FFG lover, Warhammer Lover, L5R Lover, Arkham Horror (Living Card Game) Lover, game system and design and developer lover...

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It will be what it is. If the beta is good like R&k 4th revised, or a new system that wows me then I will give it a shot.

If its Genesys or SWFFG then I'll go back to playing 4th.

Not too worried about it here.

1. I have every book from 1st to 4th in dead tree or PDF.

2. Not going to be forced to play it to get a group since everyone I know  in my area hates SWFFG.

3. I have some fixes/house rule that seem to fix a lot of problems with 4th. (Little Truths by SEAN C. RILEY, and some others)

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11 hours ago, Aedo said:

So, I ask you, in light of the upcoming preview of the L5R RPG what is your plan in looking at it and testing it out? And if it ends up being a lost cause, are you going to try and homebrew the new system/plotline, or is there a safe haven in 4E, or what?

Here is/was my daily L5R involvement. 

1) Friend says "Hey, they have a new version of L5R on drivethruRPG.

2) I said, "Oh, I haven't followed L5R since it was sold. This is exciting, hopefully it doesn't use any stupid custom dice like some of those other FFG titles do.

3) I downloaded the game and see in the welcome on first page after ToC that it has custom dice.

4) close out the PDF and come to forum to complain about custom dice.

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I understand the skepticism being expressed here, but I would like to remind everyone what happened with Dark Heresy 2nd edition.  They were working on a dramatic shift, the internet went into a rage, and they went to a refinement of the old system.  Despite the dark cloud of negativity on this thread, I would encourage everyone to take the word "Beta" seriously.

However, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater either.  I would like to say that with some refinement this system would be a lot of fun.  Just test it out, don't freak out about the things you don't love right now, and test the mechanics they highlight.

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15 hours ago, The Grand Falloon said:

After all, when I cracked open my first Star Wars Core Book, one of my first thoughts was,  "This could work for L5R!  Edge of the Emerald Empire!"

Lay your hands on Fly Casual if you want to do so. The rules for  Showdowns in there (intended for gunslingers) also work perfectly for Iaijutsu duels, too, with perception/intimidation and willpower checks leading up to one-blow attacks with a special extra-lethal triumph/advantage table* to spend all the advantages and triumphs you built up whilst glaring at one another through the drifting cherry blossoms.

 

* As in, options include:

  • Draw a weapon as an incidental
  • Upgrade the attack dice pool
  • Auto-kill any non-nemesis enemy you cause damage to in the attack

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5 hours ago, Inquisitor Huntingmoon said:

I understand the skepticism being expressed here, but I would like to remind everyone what happened with Dark Heresy 2nd edition.  They were working on a dramatic shift, the internet went into a rage, and they went to a refinement of the old system.  Despite the dark cloud of negativity on this thread, I would encourage everyone to take the word "Beta" seriously.

However, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater either.  I would like to say that with some refinement this system would be a lot of fun.  Just test it out, don't freak out about the things you don't love right now, and test the mechanics they highlight.

At this point though, they probably have committed to manufacturing those custom dice, so I'd assume that any hope of a pure d10-based system is flown.

Edited by Laurence J Sinclair
Repetition

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On 10/5/2017 at 7:40 AM, Laurence J Sinclair said:

At this point though, they probably have committed to manufacturing those custom dice, so I'd assume that any hope of a pure d10-based system is flown.

The problem with 4E wasn't the rules but the lore and setting.  Too much lore focus on mighty figures and not enough on what kinds of things low levle characters find themselves doing.

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