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Wardrobe Mistake in Magnificent Kimono(LOL) and Spies at Court

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11 hours ago, Tokhuah said:

Now, let's get back to this issue with the Shadowlands corrupted cloak.

It's how those corrupted by Shadowlands can tell others of their type. Like drawing a fish in the sand. :ph34r:

Or they were lazy and didn't think about it that morning.

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1 hour ago, RandomJC said:

It's how those corrupted by Shadowlands can tell others of their type. Like drawing a fish in the sand. :ph34r:

Or they were lazy and didn't think about it that morning.

Or the whole single earring thing?

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2 hours ago, RandomJC said:

It's how those corrupted by Shadowlands can tell others of their type. Like drawing a fish in the sand. :ph34r:

Did you not read the OP? That's a clear sign that they're undead! 

Maybe it's like vampires compulsively untying knots or stopping to pick up grain. They are compelled to wear their kimonos wrong by the very forces that brought them back from the grave.

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2 minutes ago, DarwinsDog said:

Did you not read the OP? That's a clear sign that they're undead! 

Maybe it's like vampires compulsively untying knots or stopping to pick up grain. They are compelled to wear their kimonos wrong by the very forces that brought them back from the grave.

Hey, I'm the one who suggested they were undead first. I agree.

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40 minutes ago, shosuko said:

Maybe its a seduction thing...  Like "Oh look, I'm so clumsy I wore my kimono wrong, I guess I better take this off and try again..."

You Scorpion think everything's a seduction thing!

...of course, if you're talking about people within your own clan, you're probably right.

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45 minutes ago, shosuko said:

Maybe its a seduction thing...  Like "Oh look, I'm so clumsy I wore my kimono wrong, I guess I better take this off and try again..."

Then you just wear the obi with the bow in the front!

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Shouting Banzai! - cultural appropriation, lack of respect, cultural imperialism

Having Eta in the game - fun, makes game grittier and darker, more realistic*

An improper depiction of the kimono - just a small mistake, nothing to talk about, "doesn't matter Rokugan is not Japan"

* - consider seeing a hypothetical game about fantasy not-america, with magical gunslingers and founding fathers who punch demons in the face...while also having black slaves constantly referred to using a N-word comboed with some other slurs. 

Edited by WHW

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2 hours ago, WHW said:

Shouting Banzai! - cultural appropriation, lack of respect, cultural imperialism

Having Eta in the game - fun, makes game grittier and darker, more realistic*

An improper depiction of the kimono - just a small mistake, nothing to talk about, "doesn't matter Rokugan is not Japan"

* - consider seeing a hypothetical game about fantasy not-america, with magical gunslingers and founding fathers who punch demons in the face...while also having black slaves constantly referred to using a N-word comboed with some other slurs. 

* so... Django?

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6 hours ago, WHW said:

* - consider seeing a hypothetical game about fantasy not-america, with magical gunslingers and founding fathers who punch demons in the face...while also having black slaves constantly referred to using a N-word comboed with some other slurs. 

Deadlands / Doomtown had some of this. There were magical gunslingers, undead and demons, etc. Abraham Lincoln was so badass that he maintained control over his undead form for years (the "Harrowed" undead in the setting are possessed by evil spirits that almost always take over completely and slaughter everyone), and was the head of an Old West 'Men in Black' style group. 

While none of the cards or fiction ever directly had anyone saying..er, 'Naggers', it did make it obvious that many people did use the term, and slavery was a real and ugly thing.

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18 minutes ago, Togashi Gao Shan said:

While none of the cards or fiction ever directly had anyone saying..er, 'Naggers', it did make it obvious that many people did use the term, and slavery was a real and ugly thing.

Emphasis on 'was'; Deadlands has gotten into trouble in the past for being seen as a Southern apologist setting, seeing as how slavery was abolished in record time and the CSA is seen as a legitimate and non-evil faction, with racism never raising its ugly head.

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10 hours ago, WHW said:

Shouting Banzai! - cultural appropriation, lack of respect, cultural imperialism

Sure, why not?

10 hours ago, WHW said:

Having Eta in the game - fun, makes game grittier and darker, more realistic*

Sure, why not?

10 hours ago, WHW said:

An improper depiction of the kimono - just a small mistake, nothing to talk about, "doesn't matter Rokugan is not Japan"

Sure, why not?

10 hours ago, WHW said:

* - consider seeing a hypothetical game about fantasy not-america, with magical gunslingers and founding fathers who punch demons in the face...while also having black slaves constantly referred to using a N-word comboed with some other slurs. 

I'd play that.

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On 9/26/2017 at 2:02 AM, roguefrog said:

Living people should not wear a kimono(or yukata) with the cross section RIGHT over LEFT...it should always be LEFT over RIGHT. There are two cards in the core set that violate this.

Dear L5R Art Director,
Don't let this happen again! 

Exhibit A:
L9F0X01.jpg
Exhibit B:
YT8LSjV.png

 

 

Nobody cares.

 

Sincerely,

The L5R player base.

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7 hours ago, Togashi Gao Shan said:

Deadlands / Doomtown had some of this. There were magical gunslingers, undead and demons, etc. Abraham Lincoln was so badass that he maintained control over his undead form for years (the "Harrowed" undead in the setting are possessed by evil spirits that almost always take over completely and slaughter everyone), and was the head of an Old West 'Men in Black' style group. 

While none of the cards or fiction ever directly had anyone saying..er, 'Naggers', it did make it obvious that many people did use the term, and slavery was a real and ugly thing.

There's actually a blurb in the modern Deadlands book that goes into how racism and racial tension all just evaporated shortly after literal demons and dragons started appearing in the US. Likely added to give GMs an excuse to avoid having to actually incorporate uncomfortable themes into a game for "historical accuracy" purposes.

But yeah, the Deadlands/Doomtown folk are arguably more progressive than the modern United States (spoken from the perspective of a US citizen).

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3 hours ago, Lysamus said:

There's actually a blurb in the modern Deadlands book that goes into how racism and racial tension all just evaporated shortly after literal demons and dragons started appearing in the US. Likely added to give GMs an excuse to avoid having to actually incorporate uncomfortable themes into a game for "historical accuracy" purposes.

But yeah, the Deadlands/Doomtown folk are arguably more progressive than the modern United States (spoken from the perspective of a US citizen).

Ugh. I haven't read the more modern Deadlands books, only the first and I think second edition stuff.

Shadowrun tried a similar thing, saying that the appearance of "Meta human" variances of the human genome (orcs, trolls, dwarves and elves) led to most ethnic racism going away, and being replaced by things l like The Humanis Policlub (KKK for 'normal' humans).  I never believed that would happen. Oh, there would definitely be violent anti-Meta groups, and sometimes violent counter-groups in response. However, I'm sure that even if such a thing were to happen, there would still be plenty of ethnic bigotry and discrimination.

In any case, Shdaowrun is a futuristic setting, and Deadlands deals with an "alternate history", so I find its issues more troublesome. I do remember the whole CSA thing that Laurence J Sinclair mentioned being quite distasteful to me.  The Confederacy just freed the slaves - before the North - and ended most racism as soon as they were truly independent? Ridiculous. 

Edited by Togashi Gao Shan

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Just because OP's argument was delivered in the least tactful manner one could have envisioned, does not make it an invalid argument. Indeed it is important to get the details right, subtle though they might be to people less familiar with the cultures that have inspired Rokugan, because those who are familiar will recognize them. And we're trying to get to a place where we are not ashamed of the cultural appropriation that is necessary for L5R to exist, which can only happen if the cultures being borrowed from are instilled accurately and authentically into the setting.

I didn't notice the error on these cards. But my seamstress sure did.

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On 9/27/2017 at 11:02 PM, WHW said:

Shouting Banzai! - cultural appropriation, lack of respect, cultural imperialism

Having Eta in the game - fun, makes game grittier and darker, more realistic*

An improper depiction of the kimono - just a small mistake, nothing to talk about, "doesn't matter Rokugan is not Japan"

* - consider seeing a hypothetical game about fantasy not-america, with magical gunslingers and founding fathers who punch demons in the face...while also having black slaves constantly referred to using a N-word comboed with some other slurs. 

Are the people minimizing the kimono, or pointing out the OP's overreaction the same people who have problems with the other two items you listed?  

People can separate potentially offensive fiction from their everyday lives.   What part of this nonexistent faux-America game crosses the kimono barrier?   Can we get away from the American Civil War and go back to goofy conversation about passionate opinions on kimonos?

On 9/28/2017 at 5:02 PM, Togashi Gao Shan said:

In any case, Shdaowrun is a futuristic setting, and Deadlands deals with an "alternate history", so I find its issues more troublesome. I do remember the whole CSA thing that Laurence J Sinclair mentioned being quite distasteful to me.  The Confederacy just freed the slaves - before the North - and ended most racism as soon as they were truly independent? Ridiculous. 

A new nation freed of economically damaging policies couldn't eventually find a better way to manage its labor? I feel like this has happened before...   It's not unthinkable, but I definitely understand why people would think it's improbable.  Can we get away from the American Civil War and go back to goofy conversation about passionate opinions on kimonos?

2 hours ago, Ide Yoshiya said:

And we're trying to get to a place where we are not ashamed of the cultural appropriation that is necessary for L5R to exist, which can only happen if the cultures being borrowed from are instilled accurately and authentically into the setting.

 

Do the ancestors of the Phoenicians know you're using written language? Are they ok with this? Can we get away from the PC buzzwords and go back to goofy conversation about passionate opinions on kimonos?

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1 hour ago, qwertyuiop said:

Do the ancestors of the Phoenicians know you're using written language? Are they ok with this? Can we get away from the PC buzzwords and go back to goofy conversation about passionate opinions on kimonos?

What word might I have used instead so as to avoid getting you all up in arms about it? My argument is not that cultural appropriation is bad, but that when done poorly it can be very cringeworthy to people like myself who want to adore this setting in every way. For a pre-tumblr expression of what I'm talking about, look up the classic play, The Mikado, and specifically the political conversation regarding it.

Edited by Ide Yoshiya

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