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ktflory

Why I learned to stop worrying and love the Raider

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I had my first "real" game today, after playing against myself or friends all week.

https://flic.kr/s/aHsm99wBtD

Mission: Superior positions

Imperials (me) 397 pts
ISD1 AKA "X-mas tree one"
-Motti
-Tua
-Extended hangars
-Rapid Launch bays
-Reinforced blast doors
-overload Pulse
-Avenger
-a few other things I never used

Raider 1
-expanded launchers
-Impetuous

Raider 1
-expanded launchers

Rhymer
Morna Kee
Generic Decimator
Marek Steele
Generic Defender

Rebels (the other guy) 399 points
Pelta Command Ship
-Sato
-Cant remember the rest

Scout Hammerhead
-Don't remember

Scout Hammerhead
-Don't remember


Torpedo Hammerhead
-Don't remember

Torpedo Hammerhead
-Still don't remember

-Blount
-3 generic Z-95s
-2 Y wings
-Scurrg Bomber
-2 A wings
-3-4 x wings

I narrowly had initiative, I misread the mission card and believed I could get my raiders behind his Pelta, then noticed it said fighters after he chose it. Well, he had twice as many squadrons as me so the plan was to get my ISD1 beside his Pelta, pop the rapid launch bay card with my squadron ball and pound his backside until it died. I messed up maneuvers out of the gate and ended up with my raiders entangled but managed to avoid a collision, but it meant they were too far back to screen the ISDs backside from fighters. This may have worked in my favor because he split the fighters up into 3 groups, leaving mostly only the slow bombers to go after my ISD. The raiders must have looked easy to kill I guess, but the fighters never caught up until I had already killed most of his ships. In round 3 I popped my 5 squadrons out early due to a poorly timed squadron command, my messed up maneuver in round 1 coming back to haunt me. My squadron ball would basically not move from this spot for the entire game, although the two Decimaters did jump from one side of the formation to the other at one point. I used Rhymer to turn the squadron ball into an anti-ship weapon and took out his first Hammerhead, injuring a second. Next turn his Pelta gets into range and just WRECKS my ISD front with black dice thanks to upgrade cards. His squads take my shields to 0 on all arcs. Round 4, my ISD1 vaporizes Phoenix Home with one shot. Overload killed all his defense tokens and avenger prevented him from discarding them. A side arc shot further wounded Hammerhead #2. I believe at this point I turned my Raiders around to begin harassing his two remaining Hammerheads and softening up fighters. Since his X wings, Y wings and A wings were all trapped between my squadron ball and the ISD I managed to kill a few fighters and hurt the rest pretty badly. He retaliated and I lost Rhymer. Then I turned the 2 Decimators towards the wounded Hammerhead and annihilated it. Meanwhile all his surviving Y wings, X wings, and Scurrg were wailing on my unshielded ISD. It survived with 2 criticals and 7 regular damage. Round 5, I use reinforced blast doors, and a repair token w/ dial to heal a total of 5 damage. ISD still has no shields but has 10/14 hull points remaining (Thanks Motti!) I manage to get my Raider in to screen the ISD butt from fighters, do some damage, and wound Hammerhead #3. Morna Kee and Decimators finish it off, the defenders go back to killing squadrons on the ISD. Some minor action goes on on the other side of the game area with the 4 Z-95s, my raider kills 3/4. Round 6 is basically maneuvering, trying to avoid collisions, but in the squadron phase, Morna Kee and random decimator kill Hammerhead #4 by shooting through a hole left by one of my raiders.

Final Count:
Imperials lost Rhymer tie bomber, gained 1 victory token

Rebels lost all ships, most squads except 2 x wings, 1 z-95, and Scurrg but gained 4 victory tokens


I feel like I got really lucky when he split his fighters up to try and hunt my raiders. If his squadrons had gone after my fighter ball I'm sure they would all be dead. The raiders are just too quick for squadrons without a squadron command to catch. His Pelta was also left totally unscreened, if one of the hammerheads had been on the side of it he probably could have used the opening made by the Pelta's barrage to kill the ISD before I had a chance to use my engineering command, token, and reinforced blast doors. I may have still been able to kill all his ships without the ISD but not without my 2 decimators and 2 defenders, and he would have won a points victory if I had lost them.

Edited by ktflory

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6 hours ago, ktflory said:

I had my first "real" game today, after playing against myself or friends all week.

https://flic.kr/s/aHsm99wBtD

Mission: Superior positions

Imperials (me) 397 pts
ISD1 AKA "X-mas tree one"
-Motti
-Tua
-Extended hangars
-Rapid Launch bays
-Reinforced blast doors
-overload Pulse
-Avenger
-a few other things I never used

Raider 1
-enhanced armament
-Insidious

Raider 1
-Enhanced Armament

Rhymer
Morna Kee
Generic Decimator
Marek Steele
Generic Defender

Rebels (the other guy) 399 points
Pelta Command Ship
-Sato
-Cant remember the rest

Scout Hammerhead
-Don't remember

Scout Hammerhead
-Don't remember


Torpedo Hammerhead
-Don't remember

Torpedo Hammerhead
-Still don't remember

-Blount
-3 generic Z-95s
-2 Y wings
-Scurrg Bomber
-2 A wings
-3-4 x wings

I narrowly had initiative, I misread the mission card and believed I could get my raiders behind his Pelta, then noticed it said fighters after he chose it. Well, he had twice as many squadrons as me so the plan was to get my ISD1 beside his Pelta, pop the rapid launch bay card with my squadron ball and pound his backside until it died. I messed up maneuvers out of the gate and ended up with my raiders entangled but managed to avoid a collision, but it meant they were too far back to screen the ISDs backside from fighters. This may have worked in my favor because he split the fighters up into 3 groups, leaving mostly only the slow bombers to go after my ISD. The raiders must have looked easy to kill I guess, but the fighters never caught up until I had already killed most of his ships. In round 3 I popped my 5 squadrons out early due to a poorly timed squadron command, my messed up maneuver in round 1 coming back to haunt me. My squadron ball would basically not move from this spot for the entire game, although the two Decimaters did jump from one side of the formation to the other at one point. I used Rhymer to turn the squadron ball into an anti-ship weapon and took out his first Hammerhead, injuring a second. Next turn his Pelta gets into range and just WRECKS my ISD front with black dice thanks to upgrade cards. His squads take my shields to 0 on all arcs. Round 4, my ISD1 vaporizes Phoenix Home with one shot. Overload killed all his defense tokens and avenger prevented him from discarding them. A side arc shot further wounded Hammerhead #2. I believe at this point I turned my Raiders around to begin harassing his two remaining Hammerheads and softening up fighters. Since his X wings, Y wings and A wings were all trapped between my squadron ball and the ISD I managed to kill a few fighters and hurt the rest pretty badly. He retaliated and I lost Rhymer. Then I turned the 2 Decimators towards the wounded Hammerhead and annihilated it. Meanwhile all his surviving Y wings, X wings, and Scurrg were wailing on my unshielded ISD. It survived with 2 criticals and 7 regular damage. Round 5, I use reinforced blast doors, and a repair token w/ dial to heal a total of 5 damage. ISD still has no shields but has 10/14 hull points remaining (Thanks Motti!) I manage to get my Raider in to screen the ISD butt from fighters, do some damage, and wound Hammerhead #3. Morna Kee and Decimators finish it off, the defenders go back to killing squadrons on the ISD. Some minor action goes on on the other side of the game area with the 4 Z-95s, my raider kills 3/4. Round 6 is basically maneuvering, trying to avoid collisions, but in the squadron phase, Morna Kee and random decimator kill Hammerhead #4 by shooting through a hole left by one of my raiders.

Final Count:
Imperials lost Rhymer tie bomber, gained 1 victory token

Rebels lost all ships, most squads except 2 x wings, 1 z-95, and Scurrg but gained 4 victory tokens


I feel like I got really lucky when he split his fighters up to try and hunt my raiders. If his squadrons had gone after my fighter ball I'm sure they would all be dead. The raiders are just too quick for squadrons without a squadron command to catch. His Pelta was also left totally unscreened, if one of the hammerheads had been on the side of it he probably could have used the opening made by the Pelta's barrage to kill the ISD before I had a chance to use my engineering command, token, and reinforced blast doors. I may have still been able to kill all his ships without the ISD but not without my 2 decimators and 2 defenders, and he would have won a points victory if I had lost them.

Dude! You can't have Insidious, or Enhanced Armament on Raiders!! Maybe it's only typo? 

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2 hours ago, schmidty1701 said:

Dude! You can't have Insidious, or Enhanced Armament on Raiders!! Maybe it's only typo? 

Bad memory lol, should be Impetuous and expanded launchers. I didn't have my list in front of me when typing.

Edited by ktflory

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Hey there! Glad you decided to take the time to write this up!

One thing however, you mention shooting a hammerhead out of your side with your Overload Pulse Avenger, but also that you used Overload Pulse to exhaust all of the Pelta's defense tokens before being destroyed by the front arc of your ISD. Unfortunately, the upgrade cannot be used as described. The "Spend Defense Token" phase happens before you resolve the crit effect for Overload Pulse (which happens right after defense tokens are spent), so your opponent should have been able to spend all of his tokens on his Pelta if he wanted, and only had any remaining green tokens exhausted by the crit when it came into effect. That is, primarily, why one doesn't see overload pulse in hardly any lists. Unless it is attached to a small dice payload (like a CR90B or a Raider-I/II) where the defender doesn't want to use his or her defense tokens, the defender simply can negate the whole crit effect by spending all their defense tokens on the overload pulse crit salvo. Overload Pulse also does not cause already exhausted defense tokens to be discarded, it only works to turn them green to red.

Currently, one can get around most of this restriction by using Boarding Troopers instead of Overload Pulse on the ISD to spend the defense tokens PRIOR to inflicting damage allowing you to use Avengers effect on a target with your big ship without the assistance of a side arc shot (since if you can overload pulse the tokens with your side arc, and then follow that up with your front arc, while the side arc would not benefit from OP your front would) or another ship to set up the overload pulse. Another optiong is using ISD with Avenger and squadrons commanded by Admiral Sloane to send non-rogue squadrons at the target in the hopes of getting an accuracy to spend the defense tokens, which makes them unusable later when Avenger goes ahead and shoots that target.

 

 

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59 minutes ago, BrobaFett said:

 Unfortunately, the upgrade cannot be used as described. T

 

Thanks for the info, this makes sense. I'll be sure to use it properly from now on.

So can you eliminate the effect of OP by using a contain token, basically turning the crit dice into damage?

EDIT: Nope you can't, it says non standard effects from upgrades are not affected, only face up damage cards.

 

Edited by ktflory

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The wording on the wiki is misleading- it should say "defense tokens that allow you you to avoid a crit" rather than tokens that can be spent "before" or "after" the crit. If you scatter all dice are cancelled so no crit effect can proc, because it is spent before the damage. Same is true for the evade, it cancel the whole dice before damage. While the contain doesnt cancel the dice, it prevents the standard crit effect making the damage face up. While a brace is still declared before the crit comes into effect, you can't decide to reduce the damage by the half with the crit haha.

It matters because if you brace and from 4 and a crit to 2 and them both to hull, and the face up card you drew is injured crew and you decide to discard your brace, you still have already gained the benefit from it on that attack. If you somehow took the crit before you used brace (as the wiki language could be incorrectly understood) you would have to discard the green brace and be disallowed from using it. This is NOT the case.

Also, to your point about contain stopping OP, that is what the damage control officer is there for. Damage control officer allows the contain to cancel all crit effects- overload pulse, assault proton/concussion missles, all of them.

Edited by BrobaFett

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