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n00bzilla99

Dbl Arquitens List Critique

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What do you guys think of the following list?  Something I've been trying to fly to be pretty competitive.  The idea is to win the fighter game, and then use the Arquitens and Demo to blow up a ship or two for the victory.  JerJerrod makes it so I can use other commands besides maneuver if I sit at speed 3.

 

Arquitens Super Squads
Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 389/400

 

Assault Objective: Most Wanted
Defense Objective: Fighter Ambush
Navigation Objective: Superior Positions

 

[ flagship ] Arquitens-class Light Cruiser (54 points)
-  Moff Jerjerrod  ( 23  points)
-  Reinforced Blast Doors  ( 5  points)
-  Dual Turbolaser Turrets  ( 5  points)
= 87 total ship cost

 

Arquitens-class Light Cruiser (54 points)
-  Reinforced Blast Doors  ( 5  points)
-  Dual Turbolaser Turrets  ( 5  points)
= 64 total ship cost

 

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)
Demolisher  ( 10  points)
-  Ordnance Experts  ( 4  points)
-  Assault Concussion Missiles  ( 7  points)
= 77 total ship cost

 

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
= 23 total ship cost

 

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
= 23 total ship cost

 

1 Darth Vader ( 21 points)
1 Morna Kee ( 27 points)
1 Maarek Steele ( 21 points)
1 "Mauler" Mithel ( 15 points)
1 Captain Jonus ( 16 points)
1 Zertik Strom ( 15 points)

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The squadron selection is potent, that's for sure. I also think you're on the right track using ACMs since your DTTs will not be all that great at shield piercing damage either. My only serious reservation is that the Gozantis will be following the squadrons fairly closely. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but something you'll need to practice so that they don't wander too close to a large combatant. You also lack a way to keep Mauler moving short of just destroying anyone he initially engages. If you had the points margin, I'd suggest swapping the flotillas for a Quasar with Flight Controllers to help guarantee winning the squadron war, but things have to get trimmed for that to happen.

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I think you need Colonel Jendon in there to help you activate your squads. If you are serious about willing the squad war, you need to max out your squad compliment or at least come close to 134. Your ships need to be tooled to help your squads as well, something Arquitens don't really do. I would consider replacing one arc with a Quasar or Victory and upgrading your demolished to a Gladiator ii.

The blast doors on the Arquitens are not necessary, if they get caught in the main arc and range of something nasty, blast doors likely won't save them.

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6 hours ago, Rimsen said:

Drop Jonus and Zetrik for Jendon and Jumpmaster :)

I do think that dropping Jonus for a more serious Anti-Squad ace is a good idea.  Jonus' place was to break free once I wrap up the squad game and provide a much needed guaranteed dice manipulator for the red dice.  I did play a game against a gigantic squad build (all generics) and it took all game, but they cleaned my squads up, and I never tied his bombers down, which cost me a ship.  So having more anti-squad dice is probably a good idea.

I'm not entirely sold on a Jumpmaster though, I am almost thinking Chireneau.  The anti-squad armament just isn't enough, and its pretty easy to one-shot.

 

1 hour ago, anonymousguy said:

Put TRC and Needa on the flagship Arq.

Intel Officer on the Demo would be nasty.

Possibly if I had points left over from other changes.  The intel officer is an interesting thought... "Oh you want to brace? Well you only get one!"  That would be pretty nasty.

 

1 hour ago, Kristjan said:

I think you need Colonel Jendon in there to help you activate your squads. If you are serious about willing the squad war, you need to max out your squad compliment or at least come close to 134. Your ships need to be tooled to help your squads as well, something Arquitens don't really do. I would consider replacing one arc with a Quasar or Victory and upgrading your demolished to a Gladiator ii.

The blast doors on the Arquitens are not necessary, if they get caught in the main arc and range of something nasty, blast doors likely won't save them.

I think that you don't necessarily have to max.  But some more ship support would be a good idea.  I did try to run a Quasar, but its just too expensive in this list.

I've played a few games with this list, and the blast doors have been invaluable.  With Jerjerrod they are EXCELLENT at running around ships main arcs and skirting them at long range, so if I get hit by an X17's and have to take some hull damage for a single attack, I can blast doors away and then just engineer to move shields.

 

-----------------------------

I appreciate all the replies though, and you've all given me some great feedback to consider!  Thanks :) 

I look forward to any other replies.

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On 9/4/2017 at 2:39 PM, Rimsen said:

Let us know when you could fly the fleet :) I'm really interested!

I made a few changes to the list and flown it quite a bit recently.  It has been VERY successful.  I have not lost a match while flying this fleet.

 

Arquitens Super Squads
Faction: Galactic Empire 
Points: 396/400

 

Assault Objective: Most Wanted 
Defense Objective: Hyperspace Assault
Navigation Objective: Superior Positions

 

[ flagship ] Arquitens-class Light Cruiser (54 points)
-  Moff Jerjerrod  ( 23  points)
-  Reinforced Blast Doors  ( 5  points)
-  Dual Turbolaser Turrets  ( 5  points)
= 87 total ship cost

 

Arquitens-class Light Cruiser (54 points)
-  Dual Turbolaser Turrets  ( 5  points)
59 total ship cost

 

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)
 Demolisher  ( 10  points)
-  Ordnance Experts  ( 4  points)
-  Assault Concussion Missiles  ( 7  points)
= 77 total ship cost

 

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Admiral Chiraneau
= 33 total ship cost

 

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
= 23 total ship cost

 

1 Darth Vader ( 21 points)
1 Morna Kee ( 27 points)
1 Maarek Steele ( 21 points)
1 "Mauler" Mithel ( 15 points)
Soontir Fel (18 points)
1 Zertik Strom ( 15 points)

 

Notes and Thoughts:

I decided not to change the Flagship.  I went with the Reinforced Blast Doors, and I am loving the upgrade.  The number of times that I have been able to Blast Doors away a near death is worth every single point that I paid for it.

I did take the Blast Doors off of Arquitens number 2 because without anything important,  it doesn't make sense to put the Retrofit on.  I saved the points for Chiraneau.

Demolisher with ACM's and JerJerrod does crazy amounts of Damage and is SUPER manueverable.  I've been able to triple-tap Victory's, Assault Frigates, MC80's (luckily) and do heavy amounts of damage, or outright kill them.  It is the hammer to the anvil of the Arquitens.

I decided to fly Admiral Chiraneau on the Gozanti, and fly the two with the Squad Blob.  Between the Mithel / Chiraneau combo and Black Flak from the Gozanti's combined with the potent ace's, I hardly have any problems taking down other squad blobs, or at least keeping them pinned down until the end of the game.

For the Squads: I took Jonus out, and replaced him with Soontir Fel.  With the Two Advanced Aces and Fel / Mithel, I can deal a lot of Auto Damage to things like Biggs Blobs.  Between the Mithel Damage and Fel damage, its pretty potent.  Morna Kee has also single handedly won games for me.  Three damage from a squad on a ship hurts so, so much.  Her and Stele are crazy good.

 

Fleets I've Flown Against:

-6 Activation Admonition.  (MC30, CR90's, Salvation, Pelta w/Entrapment Formation, Flotilla, Z95's)  I won this game by easily killing squads, then using my squads to help chip away at ships.  Salvation with TRC's hurts very badly.  But because of JerJerrod's ridiculously awesome manueverability enhancements, I was able to fly circles around him, and I won 8-3.

- Ackbar Doom Pickle (3 Flotillas + TRC90 and 100pts of Squads with Strategic)  Won 7-4 by Purposefully picking 2nd and forcing him to play my missions (all tokenless) so he couldn't farm free points.  In this game, JerJerrod really shined in enabling me to fly into the weak arcs of the doom pickle and pin it in place using rams.

- Imperial Generic Squad Blob (Flight Controllers plus tons of Generics and Bombers)  I won 6-5 by holding his squads in place (before I switched to Fel) and took out his VSDI carrier to come out with the win.

-Madine Liberty (LMC80, Admonition, 2 Flotillas, 2 Awing Aces, 2 Xwings + Rogue Squad).  My squads ripped through his squads pretty easily, and I destroyed his LMC80, then took down Admonition by feinting to the right, and hard turning left with JerJerrod.  I lost both of my flotillas, and a few squads, but it was like 80 ish points.  I cruised to a 9-2 win.

-Double JerJerrod Victorys (VSDIIs with a Quasar + Flotilla and a Light TIE Fighter Cover).  I took first player in this matchup as well, and JerJerrod again really showed why he is so awesome on Arquitens, by allowing me to continually skirt the long range of the VSD's.   I did have to eat the Disposable Capacitors, but thankfully, the damage wasn't enough to permanently cripple the Arquitens.  The Demolisher trucked a Victory in a ridiculous JJ enabled manuever, and I was able to KO the Quasar and Squads as well.  I only lost Darth Vader in the game, but my opponent won Intel Sweep.  I won 8-3.

-Ackbar Conga Line (Doom Pickle with Home One + 2 AFB, Flotilla, No Squads)  I took first player, but both my opponent and I both recognized that I misplayed this game pretty badly.  JerJerrod is amazing though, and the Blast Doors + JerJerrod allowed my Flagship to escape with no hull damage.  His lack of squads let me use my squads to attack his AFB + Doom Pickle and Significantly Damage their shields.  Demolisher then came in (thanks to the magic of Jerjerrod) and was able to triple tap a Frigate and stay in the weak arc of the Pickle long enough to chip it's shields away.  From the Squads, I learned that Morna Kee is an absolute beast against ships, and I really don't feel like leaving home without her anymore.  I had to trade the Demolisher and cheap Arquitens, but I won 7-4.

---------------------------------------------------

I've been winning pretty consistently after I made the changes.  I am looking for people to suggest fleet Archetypes that might be difficult for me to take down, so I can fly my fleet against it.

 

Thanks for reading!

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26 minutes ago, n00bzilla99 said:

I've been winning pretty consistently after I made the changes.  I am looking for people to suggest fleet Archetypes that might be difficult for me to take down, so I can fly my fleet against it.

I would expect this fleet to be weak against ship-heavy fleets, ISD and double-ISD fleets in particular. Cracken fleets may also present a challenge, however I'll need to run numbers on that.

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57 minutes ago, PT106 said:

I would expect this fleet to be weak against ship-heavy fleets, ISD and double-ISD fleets in particular. Cracken fleets may also present a challenge, however I'll need to run numbers on that.

I have my next matches then!  I will follow up with reports!

Edited by n00bzilla99

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2 hours ago, JJs Juggernaut said:

1 Assault Frigate, 1 MC30, and 3 GR-75s

Thank you sir, could you detail the upgrades too @JJs Juggernaut?  I'd love to take on the list true to how it was played (although I know player experience is a big part!) as part of my quest to test mine against lists of all archetypes.

Also, big fan of Thrawn :)

Edited by n00bzilla99

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Points: 400/400

[ flagship ] Assault Frigate Mark II B
- General Dodonna
- Flight Controllers

MC30c Torpedo Frigate
- Admonition
- Ordnance Experts
- H9 Turbolasers
- Assault Proton Torpedoes

GR-75 Medium Transports
- Bright Hope
- Toryn Farr
- Bomber Command Center

GR-75 Medium Transports
- Bomber Command Center

GR-75 Medium Transports
- Leia Organa
- Comms Net

8 Y-Wings
2 YT-1300s
2 HWK-290s

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7 hours ago, JJs Juggernaut said:

Points: 400/400

[ flagship ] Assault Frigate Mark II B
- General Dodonna
- Flight Controllers

MC30c Torpedo Frigate
- Admonition
- Ordnance Experts
- H9 Turbolasers
- Assault Proton Torpedoes

GR-75 Medium Transports
- Bright Hope
- Toryn Farr
- Bomber Command Center

GR-75 Medium Transports
- Bomber Command Center

GR-75 Medium Transports
- Leia Organa
- Comms Net

8 Y-Wings
2 YT-1300s
2 HWK-290s

Would you swap a BCC for Gallant Haven in the Post stacking BCC Era?

Edited by n00bzilla99

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I liked the original list so decided to try it out yesterday. I made a few tweaks

Arquitens CL, Moff JJ, RBD, DTTs
Arquitens CL, Needa, TRC
GSD-1, Demolisher, OE, APT
Gozanti, Boosted Comms, Vector
Gozanti, Boosted Comms
Bossk, Vader, Zertek, Dengar, Mauler, Fel

A solid win v Madine, Defiance, Salvation, Garels Honour, GR75, 4 A-Wings & 4 Y-Wings. I was first player in Superior Positions. 

Edited by Mad Cat

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Coming in hot with another set of battle updates!


-Double ISD, 4 activations, minimal tie fighter coverage.  This was a much closer game than it needed to be.  My DTT arquitens missed on 8/10 red dice over 2 turns.  That was just abysmal.  If it had hit even 1 more of those reds, the game would have easily been 7-4 or 8-3.  Alas, those are the (red) dice sometimes, and this game just proved that Morna Kee and Steele are absolute monsters if left unchecked.  Won 6-5 in a Hyperspace Assault.

-JJ's Juggernaut List, we put lando on the Admontion and used Boosted Comms on the AFMB.  My Mithel placement was superb, and despite the intel, I was able to pin his squadrons down pretty well, which prevented them from bombing me into oblivion.  He did get a Y-Wing to bomb me, but was turn 6, and only did a single damage.  I did use my Arquitens to pin his AFMB in place and then came in with a Demolisher triple tap, and critted on all three attacks.  That decided the game.  My opponent was inexperienced with the list, so I am attributing some of the win to his squadron placement.  I won 6-5 in (his) Superior Positions match.

-Cracken Swarm.  2 TRC90s with Cracken, super admonition with Lando and Salvation with Spinals.  2 Awing aces + 2 yt2400s as Squads.  My squads did what they do best, and ate his pretty quickly.  His ships did a good job of flakking and killed Vader and Kee.  Jerjerrod really shined this game, allowing me to weasel my way out of some really sticky situations, and it allowed my Demolisher to chase down Admonition for a kill shot on turn 6.  Salvation had no choice but to fly into an unactivated demolisher, which took full advantage of that and obliterated him.  Salvation was the most wanted, and he had to chase down a flotilla.  He eventually got the flotilla, but the damage was done, I won 8-3 in a Most Wanted match.

-6 Activation DeMSU no squad Ozzel list.  Demolisher, 2 Raiders, 1 Flotilla, Double Arquitens, no squads.  My opponent chose Hyperspace Assault, so I put Morna Kee and Vader in Hyperspace with the Demolisher.  In popped my Demolisher on T2, and it became a battle of mine chasing his.  I won that out, and I had to sacrifice JJ in order to complete it, but I managed to pull down one of his Arquitens and one of his Raiders along with Demolisher.  I snuck out a very close 6-5 victory.

----------------------------------------------------------

So after all the different fleets I've flown against, I have emerged (10-0) with this list, and it plays to my strengths and things that I like.  It's very tactical, has a good combo of Long Range and Short Range, very powerful squads and flotillas to escort them, and the missions are very challenging for opponents.  I went second in 3 of  these games, and I still felt like I had no trouble in particular with anything.   JerJerrod continues to be my favorite Imperial Commander after flying this list.  I was looking for a way to sneak the Needa and TRC's on the other Arquitens, but I don't like having a zero bid, so any suggestions are welcome for consideration!

Thanks for reading, and if you have more fleets that I should face, let me know!  :D

Edited by n00bzilla99

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Your list has inspired me to want to try the following next time I play.

 

Quote

 

Shoot, Move, Repeat
Author: Karneck

Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 400/400  

Commander: Moff Jerjerrod

Assault Objective: Most Wanted
Defense Objective: Hyperspace Assault
Navigation Objective: Superior Positions

 

[ flagship ] Arquitens-class Light Cruiser (54 points)
-  Moff Jerjerrod  ( 23  points) 
-  Reinforced Blast Doors  ( 5  points) 
-  Enhanced Armament  ( 10  points) 
= 92 total ship cost

 

Arquitens-class Light Cruiser (54 points)
-  Reinforced Blast Doors  ( 5  points) 
-  Enhanced Armament  ( 10  points) 
= 69 total ship cost

 

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)
 Demolisher  ( 10  points) 
-  The Grand Inquisitor  ( 4  points) 
-  Ordnance Experts  ( 4  points) 
-  Assault Concussion Missiles  ( 7  points) 
= 81 total ship cost

 

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
-  Admiral Chiraneau  ( 10  points) 
= 33 total ship cost

 

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
= 23 total ship cost

 

1 "Mauler" Mithel ( 15 points) 
1 Zertik Strom ( 15 points) 
1 Soontir Fel ( 18 points) 
1 Darth Vader ( 21 points) 
1 Valen Rudor ( 13 points) 
1 Colonel Jendon ( 20 points) 

= 102 total Squadrons cost

 

 

Edited by Karneck

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@Karneck, I'd be careful about using Arquitens with Enhanced Armament without some form of re-rolls on your red dice.  Nothing is more off-putting then watching your 5 red dice show up blank :(

Otherwise, looks pretty decent.  With your squad comp, I might definitely try to sneak in a Needa + TRC, and maybe stay with DTT on the other Arquitens.  JJ is pretty handy at letting you be able to yaw without Nav Commands so you can spam CF's in the 2-5 turns when you really need 4 red's out the side.

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53 minutes ago, n00bzilla99 said:

@Karneck, I'd be careful about using Arquitens with Enhanced Armament without some form of re-rolls on your red dice.  Nothing is more off-putting then watching your 5 red dice show up blank :(

Otherwise, looks pretty decent.  With your squad comp, I might definitely try to sneak in a Needa + TRC, and maybe stay with DTT on the other Arquitens.  JJ is pretty handy at letting you be able to yaw without Nav Commands so you can spam CF's in the 2-5 turns when you really need 4 red's out the side.

What about pulling Darth out of the squadrons, and then have him replace Jerjerrod? You'd have to put something in Darth's place in the squadrons, but at least then you'd have a re-roll.

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@n00bzilla99

My concern was MC30's running Mothma and/or Admo or Foresight. 4 dice means you'll lose one to evade, then still have to drill past redirects. I'm kinda for the "go big or go home" play with it. Also nothing like using DTT and still rolling a blank. Also with Needa + TRC, nothing like seeing an evade wash it away, most rebels run evade ships. Heck, you can't do shot per shot vs a CR90's, it's an encounter i usually end up losing (Those double evades...).
Also this list shines as 1st player, I left a bid in to get it.
I agree, it's the exact reason why this list works, Moff J IS your nav command after turn one (when you bank a nav token). So yeah, just spam CF's like you say. 5 red is terrifying from such a small ship. 

 

@deogg
List wouldn't work, you wouldn't be able to do CF's every round to pour the damage out and out circle large ships, or to out circle MC30's and Glads. Reason why Jendon is in there, once the squad game is won (hopefully), Jendon and Goz's can still push out damage to anything trying to give chase.

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13 hours ago, deogg said:

What about pulling Darth out of the squadrons, and then have him replace Jerjerrod? You'd have to put something in Darth's place in the squadrons, but at least then you'd have a re-roll.

Darth is far too valuable of a Squadron to pull as a Commander.  I highly recommend that instead of EA, he uses DTT, or TRC's.

 

9 hours ago, Karneck said:

@n00bzilla99

My concern was MC30's running Mothma and/or Admo or Foresight. 4 dice means you'll lose one to evade, then still have to drill past redirects. I'm kinda for the "go big or go home" play with it. Also nothing like using DTT and still rolling a blank. Also with Needa + TRC, nothing like seeing an evade wash it away, most rebels run evade ships. Heck, you can't do shot per shot vs a CR90's, it's an encounter i usually end up losing (Those double evades...).
Also this list shines as 1st player, I left a bid in to get it.
I agree, it's the exact reason why this list works, Moff J IS your nav command after turn one (when you bank a nav token). So yeah, just spam CF's like you say. 5 red is terrifying from such a small ship. 

@deogg
List wouldn't work, you wouldn't be able to do CF's every round to pour the damage out and out circle large ships, or to out circle MC30's and Glads. Reason why Jendon is in there, once the squad game is won (hopefully), Jendon and Goz's can still push out damage to anything trying to give chase.

The key to beating a mon-mothma double shrimp list is getting the MC30's to spend their tokens on the red dice, then come in for the kill with demolisher.  Being second player is actually pretty hand in doing that.  Morna Kee and Maarek Steele will help a ton as well.  I'm not seeing any significant bid?  It seems that your list was 400/400.

I'm not a fan of using Jendon in this list. While he doesn't hurt it, I prefer to have a 6th more powerful squad, rather than have 5 and one repeat it's attack.  I also run my flotillas behind my squads so they have black flakk back up.

------------------------

Just my $.02 .

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