Thrawn I guess I'll start

[Ardaedhel 10,844]

59 minutes ago, RobertDD said:

Spend a command dial AND command tokens

Incorrect.

Quote

A ship can spend both a command dial and a command token to combine their effects

inb4 "but the rulebook was written before the card so the card designer probably didn't know the rules!"

Edited September 18, 2017 by Ardaedhel

[RobertDD 42]

22 hours ago, Ardaedhel said:

Incorrect.

inb4 "but the rulebook was written before the card so the card designer probably didn't know the rules!"

I stand corrected. I found the quote in the rulebook. No more than one token per command resolve it is.

[Wax Maniacal 10]

Apologies if this was already covered,

Gonzanti with comms net.  Thrawn Dial is Concentrate Fire.  Gozanti dial is Squadron.  

Can the Gozanti tokenize the Thrawn command and send the Concentrate Fire token? and then use the squad command of course.  

Thanks

[Drasnighta 26,832]

3 hours ago, Wax Maniacal said:

Apologies if this was already covered,

Gonzanti with comms net.  Thrawn Dial is Concentrate Fire.  Gozanti dial is Squadron.  

Can the Gozanti tokenize the Thrawn command and send the Concentrate Fire token? and then use the squad command of course.  

Thanks

No.

Thrawn dials cannot be tokenized.

This is Because they can only be turned into tokens “on reveal” and they are not revealed by the ship, only added to it.

Edited March 2, 2018 by Drasnighta

[Wax Maniacal 10]

Thanks that is what I thought, I just couldn't find it anywhere for sure.  

[BiggsIRL 6,725]

Point of Order:

1)  Thrawn's dial gain effect isn't a "reveal" - so you can't do things like convert it into a token, discard it to remove all raid tokens, or use any upgrades that say "when you reveal a command"

2)  Thrawn's dial gain cost IS a reveal - "At the start of each Ship Phase, you may reveal and discard 1 of those dials."  This means you (the ship Thrawn is on) is revealing a command dial.  However, because it is revealed by the Thrawn upgrade card and it isn't part of activating a ship, the only thing you are able to do with the dial is discard it.  Because a reveal happens, you are able to trigger other upgrade cards that have "when you reveal a command" triggers as follows:

Commandant Aresko - If he's not on Thrawn's flagship but nearby, he can be used to grab a token.

Director Isard - If she is on the flagship, she can look at an enemy ship's command dials, then look again on the flagship's activation.

Taskmaster Grint - If Thrawn reveals the command matching your token, you gain the appropriate token.

Skilled First Officer - Can technically be triggered at this time to discard the top card of your assigned Command Dials, but has no effect on the Thrawn dial.  Maybe useful if you're worried he is going to be discarded by a Vader (boarding team) but mostly an academic thought.

Veteran Captain - Much the same as Skilled First Officer.  You can trigger him here to gain a command token.  Might be useful to do to give yourself a token just in time to use it with a Fleet Command.

Defense / Weapons Liaisons - You can discard a command token to change your dial to the commands shown in their card.  Hey, even Thrawn makes mistakes.

Wing Commander, etc - You can change your dial to the associated command instead.

**Dual Turbolaser Turrets Addendum** - It is possible that all upgrade cards work like Dual Turbolaser Turrets, in that the entire effect must be performed before other cards may be used.  (Though DTT merely states that other dice modification effects cannot be used, not no effects at all.)  If so the Liaisons and Wing Commander type cards will not function at all, as by the time you are able to trigger then, the dial will already have been discarded.
 

[Drasnighta 26,832]

Agreed as RAW

Acknowledged by designer as Unintended ?

[BiggsIRL 6,725]

**Crew Panic Addendum** - Before you reveal a command dial, you must either suffer 1 damage or discard that dial.  If you discard it, do not reveal a dial this round.

Rules as written allows you to do the following:

1) Declare your intent to reveal a Thrawn dial.
1a) Discard that dial without revealing it.
1b) Later that turn, activate Thrawn's flagship.
1c) You are not allowed to reveal a command dial during the reveal command dial step.  You also do not discard any dials at this time (as you couldn't reveal one to begin with)
1d) You end your activation without having used any dials from your stack.  It is possible in this way that you will not add any new command dials during the Command Phase next turn.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

5 minutes ago, BiggsIRL said:

**Crew Panic Addendum** - Before you reveal a command dial, you must either suffer 1 damage or discard that dial.  If you discard it, do not reveal a dial this round.

Rules as written allows you to do the following:

1) Declare your intent to reveal a Thrawn dial.
1a) Discard that dial without revealing it.
1b) Later that turn, activate Thrawn's flagship.
1c) You are not allowed to reveal a command dial during the reveal command dial step.  You also do not discard any dials at this time (as you couldn't reveal one to begin with)
1d) You end your activation without having used any dials from your stack.  It is possible in this way that you will not add any new command dials during the Command Phase next turn.

Again, totally legit...

... just Why?

 

..Why on earth would you hurt yourself so much deliberately?

 

“Drink a pint of concrete and harden the **** up, Princess... Take the one **** damage...”

Edited March 5, 2018 by Drasnighta

[BiggsIRL 6,725]

Just now, Drasnighta said:

Why on earth would you hurt yourself so much deliberately?

 

“Drink a pint of concrete and harden the **** up, Princess... Take the one **** damage...”

Maybe you did Navigate / Squadron / Squadron, and you don't need a Navigate this turn, but you DEFINITELY need it next turn.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

6 minutes ago, BiggsIRL said:

Maybe you did Navigate / Squadron / Squadron, and you don't need a Navigate this turn, but you DEFINITELY need it next turn.

“Suck. It. Up.”

 

You’d basically be killing a bonus for your whole fleet to fix a mistake fir for your flagship which has taken hull damage and may not be long fir for this world ANYWAY... since you won’t be repairing it this turn without outside help, and not to it’s full capability to do so regardless...

 

I will admit that me not seeing a positive scenario doesn’t preclude one existing - I just can’t see it...

 

EDIT: with all of those Firs you’d think a lumberjack of me... but I’m okay...

Edited March 5, 2018 by Drasnighta

[BiggsIRL 6,725]

That one is probably academic.

But I like playing around with the rules to see what crazy things you COULD do, and this is the only combination of things I can think of that would keep you from changing your command stack at all.  I had to play it through to make sure it didn't accidentally break the game by letting you somehow just NOT ACTIVATE your flagship.  Fortunately that is not the case.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

1 minute ago, BiggsIRL said:

That one is probably academic.

But I like playing around with the rules to see what crazy things you COULD do, and this is the only combination of things I can think of that would keep you from changing your command stack at all.  I had to play it through to make sure it didn't accidentally break the game by letting you somehow just NOT ACTIVATE your flagship.  Fortunately that is not the case.

It’s intetesring since the “check” on a ship being activated is a dial on its ship card, which this doesn’t have, but again, there is no concrete 100% “check all ships have activated” step - just an statement on how to progress when they have.... verification in the rule set is assumed, not mandated.

[BiggsIRL 6,725]

2 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

It’s intetesring since the “check” on a ship being activated is a dial on its ship card, which this doesn’t have, but again, there is no concrete 100% “check all ships have activated” step - just an statement on how to progress when they have.... verification in the rule set is assumed, not mandated.

The thing is it also states in "Ship Activation" that a ship can only activate once per round.  So even if the "check" of the ship not having a faceup dial on the ship card passes, you still can't (infinitely) activate the ship.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

Just now, BiggsIRL said:

The thing is it also states in "Ship Activation" that a ship can only activate once per round.  So even if the "check" of the ship not having a faceup dial on the ship card passes, you still can't (infinitely) activate the ship.

Yep, not Infinitely, but even proving >1 becomes problematic.

 

“Unca, Biggs and I were playing around, and it just broke....”

 

Poor ruleset didn’t see it coming ?

[BiggsIRL 6,725]

Comedy option:  Thrawn ruins your entire fleet.  Effort post incoming.

[BiggsIRL 6,725]

So... You reveal and discard a command dial from Thrawn.

"When a command dial is spent or discarded, it is placed faceup on the ship’s ship card and remains there until it is assigned as a new command during the next Command Phase."

Okay, so that command dial you just discarded for Thrawn is placed faceup on your ship card.

"A ship with a faceup command dial on its ship card cannot be activated."

So, your flagship now CAN'T ACTIVATE this turn.

All your other ships gain a command dial matching the one your flagship discarded.  They are either spent or discarded during their activation.  They also reveal another command dial during this time.  It is also either spent or discarded.  There are now 2 faceup command dials on their ship's ship card, and 1 on the flagship (which has not activated).

"(it) remains there until it is assigned as a new command during the next Command Phase."  "A ship must be assigned command dials until it has a number of command dials equal to its command value."

There is no rule saying you pull off extra command dials from your ships.  All your ships have a single command dial faceup on their ship's ship card.

"A ship with a faceup command dial on its ship card cannot be activated."

Your ships cannot activate.

Ever.

[BiggsIRL 6,725]

10 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

Yep, not Infinitely, but even proving >1 becomes problematic.

 

“Unca, Biggs and I were playing around, and it just broke....”

 

Poor ruleset didn’t see it coming ?

Uncle Dras... I... uh...

I don't know how to tell you this.

[Undeadguy 5,749]

40 minutes ago, BiggsIRL said:

**Crew Panic Addendum** - Before you reveal a command dial, you must either suffer 1 damage or discard that dial.  If you discard it, do not reveal a dial this round.

Rules as written allows you to do the following:

1) Declare your intent to reveal a Thrawn dial.
1a) Discard that dial without revealing it.
1b) Later that turn, activate Thrawn's flagship.
1c) You are not allowed to reveal a command dial during the reveal command dial step.  You also do not discard any dials at this time (as you couldn't reveal one to begin with)
1d) You end your activation without having used any dials from your stack.  It is possible in this way that you will not add any new command dials during the Command Phase next turn.

Wouldn't this be limited to the ship? The ship reveals the dial vs Thrawn reveals the dial. If Thrawn is revealing it, it doesn't work. I didn't keep up with this thread so I'm not sure on that verdict.

 

6 minutes ago, BiggsIRL said:

So... You reveal and discard a command dial from Thrawn.

"When a command dial is spent or discarded, it is placed faceup on the ship’s ship card and remains there until it is assigned as a new command during the next Command Phase."

Okay, so that command dial you just discarded for Thrawn is placed faceup on your ship card.

"A ship with a faceup command dial on its ship card cannot be activated."

So, your flagship now CAN'T ACTIVATE this turn.

All your other ships gain a command dial matching the one your flagship discarded.  They are either spent or discarded during their activation.  They also reveal another command dial during this time.  It is also either spent or discarded.  There are now 2 faceup command dials on their ship's ship card, and 1 on the flagship (which has not activated).

"(it) remains there until it is assigned as a new command during the next Command Phase."  "A ship must be assigned command dials until it has a number of command dials equal to its command value."

There is no rule saying you pull off extra command dials from your ships.  All your ships have a single command dial faceup on their ship's ship card.

"A ship with a faceup command dial on its ship card cannot be activated."

Your ships cannot activate.

Ever.

I like this argument. Thrawn is useless now.

[BiggsIRL 6,725]

5 minutes ago, Undeadguy said:

Wouldn't this be limited to the ship? The ship reveals the dial vs Thrawn reveals the dial. If Thrawn is revealing it, it doesn't work. I didn't keep up with this thread so I'm not sure on that verdict.

Thrawn's dial gain cost IS a reveal - "At the start of each Ship Phase, you may reveal and discard 1 of those dials."  This means you (the ship Thrawn is on) is revealing a command dial.  But a dial from Thrawn's card, not from your command stack.

[BiggsIRL 6,725]

[ShoutingMan 100]

I played Thrawn for the first time today. I had a situation where:

1. Thrawn revealed Engineering; Command Dial set to Engineering given to ships
2. ISD activated, reveals Command Dial to Engineering
3. Command Dial is converted to Token
4. Token + Thrawn-Dial spent as Dial+Token to repair ship

Was that legal?

 

Thanks!

[Belegon 29]

Perfectly legal

[Drasnighta 26,832]

Yes.

as long as it was declared as so.

only the Ship dial can be made a token.  The Thrawn dial cannot.

[ShoutingMan 100]

Yes, I declared what / how I was doing during the reveal command step. We took a minute to discuss if it was reasonable, and felt it was probably ok.