Hrathen

The real question everyone has about Legion

21 posts in this topic

Why can't speederbikes stop?

 

If you've seen any of the demos, you probably have noticed that speederbikes have a compulsory movement.  I have seen this sort of thing before, but it is usually for aircraft, that will crash if they don't keep moving.  But we see two speeder bikes hovering with drivers on them in the speeder bike battle on Endor in the movie.  

So, Why can't they stop in the game?

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Posted (edited)

Probably because bringing your speeder bike to a controlled stop and then dismounting or hovering in place while in an active combat situation facing at least moderately trained and equipped troops is pretty close to a death sentence.  Speeder bikes don't seem to be particularly small or hardy targets, their speed is their main defense and offensive tool.

Edited by FatherTurin
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59 minutes ago, Dr Zoidberg said:

Because game play/mechanics > fluff. 

This is a terrible answer.  There is no reason in the rest of the game that requires speederbikes to keep moving.  

DScipio likes this

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There is no reason in a battle to slow down your vehicle unless you are one that relies on armor. Think of cavalry and motorcycle troops. They were actually used as fast moving forces that dismounted for battle. Guns+slow moving vehicle with no armor=death

 

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1 hour ago, Hrathen said:

This is a terrible answer.  There is no reason in the rest of the game that requires speederbikes to keep moving.  

Well then read the post above yours here and you'll get a better answer.

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It is also, you know, kind of a great ability.  Free move, and then you can move again and do two 90 degree turns?  Crazy range on those things.

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Posted (edited)

3 hours ago, Hrathen said:

Why can't speederbikes stop?

 

If you've seen any of the demos, you probably have noticed that speederbikes have a compulsory movement.  I have seen this sort of thing before, but it is usually for aircraft, that will crash if they don't keep moving.  But we see two speeder bikes hovering with drivers on them in the speeder bike battle on Endor in the movie.  

So, Why can't they stop in the game?

Well first of all, this ISN'T the real question everyone has about legion; kind of a minute one at best.

 

More importantly, you're wrong about the bikes in the movie. We see two speeder bikes sitting and waiting, and then power-up to catch Luke and Leia; there's a sense of speed build up and inertia. We never see any speeder bikes go from 310 MPH to zero in the movies, and for good reason. Many vehicles in Star Wars operate on modern vehicle styles, ie: Fighters in space are like WWII fightercraft, and the Endor speeder bikes are like motorcycles. For the same reason an X-Wing can't just stop mid-flight and hover in a space battle is the same reason a speeder bike doesn't drop to 0 MPH in a split second. The most we see is a 90 degree turn with Luke and a Scout Trooper, and luckily that seems to be something the bike miniatures can do.

 

FURTHERMORE, this doesn't make any sense in terms of transitioning the bikes to gameplay. Think of how long a single round would take in Legion, what with a few squads of infantry firing off some rounds or making some quick battlefield movements per turn. There simply isn't enough time in the allotted 6 turns for a speeder bike to decelerate and come to a complete stop, and then force-forbid, start up again in another direction; especially within a turn or two as you're implying. And as others have noted, it wasn't balanced for that either.

 

Basically, you're wrong on pretty much ALL fronts here.

Edited by samus17
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Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, Hrathen said:

This is a terrible answer.  There is no reason in the rest of the game that requires speederbikes to keep moving.  

no, it's not. My guess loading them up for offense and using it as a turret never occurred to you and might be gamebreaking.

 

Edit: or dead boring instead of having to factor in a plan on where it will it up

Edited by Ralgon

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3 hours ago, Hrathen said:

This is a terrible answer.  There is no reason in the rest of the game that requires speederbikes to keep moving.  

Sorry that you don't like it; but it's a core rule of game design.  The mandatory rule is clearly meant to help simulate the high speed of the speeders as a 'nod' to the lore; but mechanics over fluff will - if a game is designed properly - win out every time.

Ref: See the many iterations of W40K for examples of where rules have sought to emulate lore/fluff and just end up with massively broken & OP combos.

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4 hours ago, Dr Zoidberg said:

Because game play/mechanics > fluff. 

Thats always a very lazy and bad decision.

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4 hours ago, FatherTurin said:

Probably because bringing your speeder bike to a controlled stop and then dismounting or hovering in place while in an active combat situation facing at least moderately trained and equipped troops is pretty close to a death sentence.  Speeder bikes don't seem to be particularly small or hardy targets, their speed is their main defense and offensive tool.

Even behind a whole building block`?

 

1 hour ago, samus17 said:

Well first of all, this ISN'T the real question everyone has about legion; kind of a minute one at best.

 

More importantly, you're wrong about the bikes in the movie. We see two speeder bikes sitting and waiting, and then power-up to catch Luke and Leia; there's a sense of speed build up and inertia. We never see any speeder bikes go from 310 MPH to zero in the movies, and for good reason. Many vehicles in Star Wars operate on modern vehicle styles, ie: Fighters in space are like WWII fightercraft, and the Endor speeder bikes are like motorcycles. For the same reason an X-Wing can't just stop mid-flight and hover in a space battle is the same reason a speeder bike doesn't drop to 0 MPH in a split second. The most we see is a 90 degree turn with Luke and a Scout Trooper, and luckily that seems to be something the bike miniatures can do.

 

FURTHERMORE, this doesn't make any sense in terms of transitioning the bikes to gameplay. Think of how long a single round would take in Legion, what with a few squads of infantry firing off some rounds or making some quick battlefield movements per turn. There simply isn't enough time in the allotted 6 turns for a speeder bike to decelerate and come to a complete stop, and then force-forbid, start up again in another direction; especially within a turn or two as you're implying. And as others have noted, it wasn't balanced for that either.

 

Basically, you're wrong on pretty much ALL fronts here.

Acutally we see the stopping to zero quite a lot in the movies, its just not very pleasant for the drivers.

FatherTurin likes this

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Its not the question i ever asked to myself, but imo they should be able to stop - taking some big penalty (like - when defending, all attack dice are crits). But it's a game mechanis - and we just have to accept it. 

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Posted (edited)

Why can't speederbikes stop? Because it is a genial idea. Motorcycle cavalry is pure Lucas, visually brilliant, militarily moronic. The Wehrmacht used motorcycles in WWII for a short period, detected it was a dumb idea and reassigned the motorcycles to recon duty. Only motorcycles with sidecars were armed with machine guns and they never charged guns blazing like some Agincourt knights on speed. So to prevent players who never are as dumb as Lucas from doing the sensible thing and using the guns on the fragile speederbike as a mobile mg nest for long range support, the designers force the players to do the fluff thing - silly, but fun (which is the essence of Star Wars).

Edited by Rumar
typo
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6 hours ago, FatherTurin said:

Probably because bringing your speeder bike to a controlled stop and then dismounting or hovering in place while in an active combat situation facing at least moderately trained and equipped troops is pretty close to a death sentence.  Speeder bikes don't seem to be particularly small or hardy targets, their speed is their main defense and offensive tool.

Stopping troops in the open might be a death sentence, dosnt mean you need a rule saying you cant end movement without cover facing enemy fire?

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As lazy or stupid it may sound it probably was a game design/balance decision  and if you want to know why you have to ask FFG/the designers.

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Because I'm quite sure getting a space motorbike to go from 300mph to a full stop in the relatively confined space of a Legion battlefield would be a bit challenging.

Also, the actual real question, and one that has haunted me since childhood, is: who in their right mind picks a space motorbike going 300mph as the most elegant solution to traverse a densely overgrown forest with huge trees and low-hanging branches literally everywhere?

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14 minutes ago, player1750031 said:

Because I'm quite sure getting a space motorbike to go from 300mph to a full stop in the relatively confined space of a Legion battlefield would be a bit challenging.

Also, the actual real question, and one that has haunted me since childhood, is: who in their right mind picks a space motorbike going 300mph as the most elegant solution to traverse a densely overgrown forest with huge trees and low-hanging branches literally everywhere?

Shipment for Tatooine landed on Endor. If the Emperor knew...

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