Tarvalar

Disappointed with Mini Size

119 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

As far as I know, it hasn't been formally addressed yet- and I'll be thrilled to be proven wrong here!- but all indications are that Legion minis will be incompatible with Imperial Assault minis. I'm honestly really disappointed with this, and it's certainly going to affect whether or not I buy the game. I'm irked for the following reasons:

  1. From what we've seen, the minis are just large enough to make the two next to each other look goofy. Exactly why the minis couldn't be the same size isn't at all clear. If they were much larger or smaller, it would be one thing, but it seems almost as if they were specifically designed to be just different enough to be incompatible.
  2. Furthermore, I'm a little surprised that the scale of the battles involved looks like they'll be pretty darn close to Imperial Assault skirmishes. In fact, the core box for Imperial Assault included one more miniature than Legion (34 vs. 33). I'd anticipated that FFG would release another SW game focusing on larger battles (a la Hoth, with AT-ATs and air support, but this doesn't seem to be it at all. So if the number of combatants are as similar between games as it looks, why change the scale of the minis?
  3. While I suppose the larger Legion size allows for more detail, I'm honestly perfectly happy with the detail of IA miniatures, which are already on the larger side of my preference- though I may be in the minority on this point!.

I don't know whether to ascribe it to poor coordination, or, to be less charitable, to wonder if this is a more cynical move on their part to encourage their customers to buy more of their products. If it's the latter, I'm really disappointed. You'd really hope that they would encourage loyalty from their customers by creating opportunities for crossovers between games, not discouraging them.

Let me know if you guys think this is an overreaction- I'm happy to concede that there's plenty about the game that we don't know. Still, this seems like a decision that they really didn't have to make that hurts their customers more than anything, and doesn't make me excited at the prospect of shelling out $90 just for access to a new game.

Thanks for reading!

Edited by Tarvalar
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Well, I'm not sure this is an actual answer, but I would say you don't want to fault a company for "encouraging customers to buy of their products."  Certainly they are going to do that

 

But probably a better way of describing it is that you want a company to produce products where customers WANT to spend that money and are HAPPY about doing it.  Truth: FFG is in the business to make money.  But they also, I assume, want to make excellent products that make customers happy to come to them and return many times to do so.  So, I suspect it is probably a little of both, and I think that's okay.  I would suspect it is less malicious than simple bleeding their customer's wallets.

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Is this all conjecture or are there pictures of the two side by side? If there are pictures please post a link to them. I know someone said 34mm as a scale, but 34 is not a standard mini scale. 32mm is. Some imperial assault figures are 28mm some are closer to  can mix them together fairly well.

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1 minute ago, DiggityDug said:

Is this all conjecture or are there pictures of the two side by side? If there are pictures please post a link to them. I know someone said 34mm as a scale, but 34 is not a standard mini scale. 32mm is. Some imperial assault figures are 28mm some are closer to  can mix them together fairly well.

Aside from a rough comparison to Sorastro's painting guide of Luke there is no evidence of a scale. The 34mm was the most unsure answer I've ever hear from an in-flight report question so it has no actual credence. He really had no idea.

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Yeah, if they are compatible, it would encourage me to pick up the new game.

Otherwise ... I'm not starting over to pick up a game that's still essentially a squad level skirmish game on the same scale (AT-ST largest piece down to individual troopers) as a game I already own.  It feels like rebuying the same game, only with some assembly required.

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Posted (edited)

Well looking at the pictures in the other thread they look to be really really close in scale. Any variation could easily be explained by not all humans being exactly 6" tall. I mean just looking around my office right now i see a lot of my co workers that are apparently out of scale.

Edited by DiggityDug

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14 minutes ago, schuwa said:

Well, I'm not sure this is an actual answer, but I would say you don't want to fault a company for "encouraging customers to buy of their products."  Certainly they are going to do that

 

But probably a better way of describing it is that you want a company to produce products where customers WANT to spend that money and are HAPPY about doing it.  Truth: FFG is in the business to make money.  But they also, I assume, want to make excellent products that make customers happy to come to them and return many times to do so.  So, I suspect it is probably a little of both, and I think that's okay.  I would suspect it is less malicious than simple bleeding their customer's wallets.

 If they were the same size I would be at my local LGS cleaning out their IA stock *right now.*  I allay have a large IA collection that I haven't played enough (and really won't be able to until the app comes out).  Now I have to consider either stopping with IA or doing IA and skipping Legion. 

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13 minutes ago, schuwa said:

Well, I'm not sure this is an actual answer, but I would say you don't want to fault a company for "encouraging customers to buy of their products."  Certainly they are going to do that

But probably a better way of describing it is that you want a company to produce products where customers WANT to spend that money and are HAPPY about doing it.  Truth: FFG is in the business to make money.  But they also, I assume, want to make excellent products that make customers happy to come to them and return many times to do so.  So, I suspect it is probably a little of both, and I think that's okay.  I would suspect it is less malicious than simple bleeding their customer's wallets.

Totally valid point! I suppose I should clarify that I don't at all like the feeling that developers are angling for ways to make me spend more money than I'd rather spend. If there's one developer that I feel is all about trying to milk their customers for money, and the other seems to be genuinely more excited about developing new and interesting games and being responsive to the fans' concerns, then if the quality of both companies' games is otherwise equal, I'll feel much better spending my money supporting the latter.

At the same time, I'm encouraged by what folks are now saying that the minis may in fact be more compatible than I initially assumed. I'll admit that I'm not too familiar with miniatures - Imperial Assault and War of the Ring are my main mini investments thus far- and I'll confess to relying on the rest of you to figure out how they'll look next to one another. We'll see how it develops!

Still, I can't help but scratch my head at why, if IA skirmishes and Legion battles look like they'll be around the same size, why they wouldn't just make the scales identical. Though that may have something to do with me being surprised that the scale of the battles will be as similar as it's looking...

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Posted (edited)

Even if they were the same size, you would still need the cards included with the Legion minis to play with them. Also the base size is going to be very important as it interacts with the movement tool.

My guess is they went slightly bigger so the models could have more detailed and be more competitive in the miniature space.

Edited by Mep

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15 minutes ago, EastCoast said:

Sorastro posted that IA Luke was 30mm, Legion Luke was 35mm.

If anyone would know it would be him.

Link?

It could just be a difference in the stance of the miniature, depending on how he's talking about it.

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2 minutes ago, player1750031 said:

You should rebase them.

HR and Mrs Diggitydug would both have a problem with that.  I mean how do you even start that conversation? "Excuse me, but would you be interested in a good flocking?"

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Posted (edited)

35 minutes ago, Tarvalar said:

I'm really disappointed. You'd really hope that they would encourage loyalty from their customers by creating opportunities for crossovers between games, not discouraging them.

I'll admit that I'm in the same boat as you and there's already crossover in the art they use for cards in their many Star Wars games (e.g. X-wing/Armada and Rebellion/IA).

 

If this had been IA scale with a tacit nod to being able to use IA figures (e.g. IA stormtroopers useable in Legion for larger armies etc) I'd have been in on day one. I may sit this one out though, unless I can find someone who'll play it with me!

 

Still, I imagine you could get some bases and add them to your IA figs - maybe that would work?

 

Anyway, wait and see from this old Sheepy!

 

QS =D

Edited by quantumsheep

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31 minutes ago, Tarvalar said:

As far as I know, it hasn't been formally addressed yet- and I'll be thrilled to be proven wrong here!- but all indications are that Legion minis will be incompatible with Imperial Assault minis. I'm honestly really disappointed with this, and it's certainly going to affect whether or not I buy the game. I'm irked for the following reasons:

  1. From what we've seen, the minis are just large enough to make the two next to each other look goofy. Exactly why the minis couldn't be the same size isn't at all clear. If they were much larger or smaller, it would be one thing, but it seems almost as if they were specifically designed to be just different enough to be incompatible.
  2. Furthermore, I'm a little surprised that the scale of the battles involved looks like they'll be pretty darn close to Imperial Assault skirmishes. In fact, the core box for Imperial Assault included one more miniature than Legion (34 vs. 33). I'd anticipated that FFG would release another SW game focusing on larger battles (a la Hoth, with AT-ATs and air support, but this doesn't seem to be it at all. So if the number of combatants are as similar between games as it looks, why change the scale of the minis?
  3. While I suppose the larger Legion size allows for more detail, I'm honestly perfectly happy with the detail of IA miniatures, which are already on the larger side of my preference- though I may be in the minority on this point!.

I don't know whether to ascribe it to poor coordination, or, to be less charitable, to wonder if this is a more cynical move on their part to encourage their customers to buy more of their products. If it's the latter, I'm really disappointed. You'd really hope that they would encourage loyalty from their customers by creating opportunities for crossovers between games, not discouraging them.

Let me know if you guys think this is an overreaction- I'm happy to concede that there's plenty about the game that we don't know. Still, this seems like a decision that they really didn't have to make that hurts their customers more than anything, and doesn't make me excited at the prospect of shelling out $90 just for access to a new game.

Thanks for reading!

The battles you're seeing are core set only... Look at all of their mini core sets and tell me if that is a true representation of the games size.....

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Posted (edited)

6 minutes ago, Mep said:

Even if they were the same size, you would still need the cards included with the Legion minis to play with them. Also the base size is going to be very important as it interacts with the movement tool.

It is much easier to do and it is much easier on the eyes to proxy a card than it is to proxy a squad of miniatures AND a card. Also, you could possibly be able to buy extra cards on eBay. Or boxes might come with variant cards, like IA's regular and elite units that share miniatures. Promo cards are also a possibility.

The movement tool seems to simply be a bit of straight cardboard/plastic with a crescent shape cut out on the edges. If the new bases are 25mm circles, there is no physical reason for it to not work.

Edited by player1750031
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2 minutes ago, Tiberius the Killer said:

I'm just sad it's not 10mm or 15mm.  I don't know how we are going to see AT-ATs with this size.

 

1 minute ago, Ma22a said:

I think they've missed a trick tbh, I was really hoping for FOW scale (10/15mm) so we could have some truly epic sized battles. Currently its giving off the vibe of being a small skirmish game which is such a shame. 

Yeah, I'm firmly in the camp that wanted a game in the 10mm-15mm range. I want AT-ATs (note the plural) to be realistic to field- and I'm not just referring to physical size. My wallet is a consideration too. $40-$50 for an AT-AT would have been just about right, but at this scale I don't see AT-AT's happening for less than $90-$100 a pop, and very unlikely you'd be able to field more than one per battle- if they ever happen. They might end up being like the mythical Super Star Destroyer that has yet to appear in Armada. 

 

Oh well, now I know. I'll probably be skipping this one. In fact, if anything, I'll probably pick up someone's IA collection on eBay instead- I'm sure there will be a few people who want to sell IA in order to dip into Legion. I've played the IA campaign mode with my friends a ton and it's a blast, and I've always wanted to try out the skirmish mode. 

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1 minute ago, Ma22a said:

I think they've missed a trick tbh, I was really hoping for FOW scale (10/15mm) so we could have some truly epic sized battles. Currently its giving off the vibe of being a small skirmish game which is such a shame. 

Particularly when they already sell a Star Wars small skirmish game ...

10-15mm with a 25mm base for a squad or half-squad would have been perfect IMO.

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Just now, Hawkstrike said:

Particularly when they already sell a Star Wars small skirmish game ...

10-15mm with a 25mm base for a squad or half-squad would have been perfect IMO.

Exactly, I don't play IA but it just looks like it without the board sections lol.

 

I was hoping for mass AT-AT's and AT-ST going at repulsor tanks and the like with air support and speeders thrown into the mix. Imagine that!!! 

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Did everybody see the two Lukes pic?

Definitely different in that case, and if they are purposefully different I don't want to make excuses for FFG, that seems rather unfriendly on their part to their customers, profit motives or not. But, on the other hand, that Luke mini is pretty small, I mean even IA Han looks like he's 8 inches taller than Luke, I could entertain the idea that they scale creeped a bit.

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I really want to play IA. There is very little in a local scene here. Looks like we are going to try and rekindle it this fall.  This game may kill it if it is a skirmish game. Right now...it essentially looks like IA, but on a larger scale... and I don't mean larger as in more epic, I mean larger as in bigger miniatures.... an outdoors IA? less linear movement.

I was hoping for a larger format game where the field is a 3x6 and with AT-AT's and snow speeders doing snow speeder and AT-AT stuff...that may still happen, but require a much larger play space...and a much larger amount of money. 

 

I'm going from incredibly excited to skeptical... 

 

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Just now, Ma22a said:

I was hoping for mass AT-AT's and AT-ST going at repulsor tanks and the like with air support and speeders thrown into the mix. Imagine that!!! 

Same here.  Battle of Hoth, Battle of Scarif ... those movie moments where you have air & ground units, infantry and vehicles all mixing it up.  Such a missed opportunity IMO.  

FFG, please fill in the blank: X-Wing: Armada :: Imperial Assault : __________.

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