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Doc, the Weasel

Are advanced careers necessary?

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 Why do we need Advanced Careers in this edition? They were necessary previously because they extended how much you could advance your stats. But now that's not the case.

After going through the different advanced careers we have I can't find anything appealing about them, crunch-wise; They don't provide an advantage to justify the additional advance that they cost (since they all have the "intermediate" trait rather than "basic"). They seem to be there just because they were there in previous editions (which is odd, considering how much of this game is rethought from the ground up).

There are the caster careers that use them, but it seems like there would have been other ways to handle that. We could have multiple variations of the priest/wizard careers that determined what kind of priest/wizard you were (bookworm, battlemage, lab researcher, councilor, etc). Your rank would just be determined by how many of those you have completed (much like what they did with the slayer careers).

Any thoughts on this?

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There is no need for advanced careers, except for a few rare careers. The open system is much better. But wizards and priests should be advanced careers to show the dedication it requires. I am fine with the few advanced careers there are, although I have ruled that iron breaker, sword master and wardancer are all advanced careers. To progress to the iron breaker career for instance you need to completely finish one combat career first and then aquire a set of Gromril armour (costs 200g - full plate at 20g and x10 because of superiour quality). I see the advanced careers as more of a prestige career. You can't just pick the Witch Hunter career in my game either... you have to be appointed and show you're dedicated and loyal to the empire.

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Advanced Careers make sense, game mechanic wise there careers that players shouldn't start out as for gameplay/roleplaying reasons.

The reason why ironbreakers, sword masters and war dancers are basic careers is because they offer great story potential, there all slightly more powerful then other careers so they are "advanced" in a way.  Think of the starting careers as an origin rather then an actual career or job and It all kind of makes sense.

Wizards aren't advanced becouse the adventure leading up to becoming a wizard is "spend 10 hours of every day reading and experimenting with little to no contact with the out side world." which isn't interesting and explains why despite being more experienced in there trade they are on a level playing field as far as adventuring is concerned,

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reidchapman said:

I don't know how to edit so forgive the double post:

Gromrils armour is definetly not bought, It's probably earned through diligent study in the art of dwarven warfare.

 

In our world everything can be bought if you have the money. To become an iron breaker you need to first find a smith willing to make you the armor and then pay him what it costs to make it. Even nobility is bought... honour is bought. That's the state of our world... While being an actual iron breaker serving isn't the point... fighting like one is for the characters. If a player had enough money I'd also let him pay off officials to appoint him witch hunter. Making the player pay 200g for a gromril armor sets a very tangible goal for the player and not just being at the mercy of the GM letting him "earn" the armor. But he will still need to find a dwarven smith with the skills and willingness to create it. The player characters are always outcasts in their career. A wizard not studying at the university, a rat catcher not catching rats, a witch hunter roaming without an official mission etc. And before the player in question has 200g he WILL have earned the proper honors through combat happy.gif

 

As a GM I just don't like dumping things in the players lap. Oops there was a gromril armour in that dirty bag on the floor. I want to give them tangible goals so they are the masters of their own destiny in a very visible way. This idea extends to all areas of my GMing.

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I think more advanced careers are definately needed, but I don't think we need as many as in 2.ed as the basic careers are quite good and give decent advancement choices.

But some careers just need to be advanced requiring either experience or a specific background (read previous career) before being available - so you don't start out as an assassin, captain or knight. And seeing how Swordmaster, Iron Breaker, etc. are basic I think there needs to be advanced versions of these careers as normally you'd never leave them.

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Yep advanced careers are probably going to be used to help define specific career progression, allowing you to remain in the same general career, but still progress your skills, action cards etc, just as the wizard, priest and zealot advanced careers allow for in the core set.

The witch hunter is really there for an iconic bit of fluff i think, but asl oas an alternative to the zealot progression.

 

I've mentioned it before though and I think we will see some more "generic" advanced careers as more boxes come out, but to make them desirable compared to another basic career, i reckon they will have something like additional talent sockets or much more options on things like stances and wounds which are currently pretty limited buying wise within a single career

 

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They are when you factor in the "Advanced Carreer Card-pendium" slated to come out later this year!!!!

Just Kidding, btw...

I think progressions are more keeping in line with the original system. Plus, who wants to be a rat catcher forever?

Although a SBVD named Boo, might be in order. "Go for the eyes Boo! The eyes!!!!"

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I think there should be a basic career that leads right into witchhunter, currently it's kind of lonely. I mean most other advanced careers have a obvious basic version.

Also there should be some cool WH only cards like Absolution (An attack that starts with 4 purple dice, but drops by one for each law you can prove they've broken. Inflicts unnatural qauntities of critical damage)

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That sounds right NVM: It should read reduce difficulty by 1 purple die for each word of faux latin you seamlessly integrate into your speach prior to using the card.

"There is no such thing as innocense, only degrees of guilt."

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I guess I would just point out that the career advancement system, with various careers to aspire to, is an awesome roleplaying tool.  Sure, maybe it costs some extra advances, but not everyone is about min-maxing their character.  The idea of the lowly rat catcher dreaming of one day becoming a wizard, and the steps he has to go through to achieve that, is epic roleplay fodder and something a GM ought to relish because of all the character hooks it provides.

 

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Sorry if this is somewhat unrelated, but are we allowed to retake the same career when changing a new one after the 10 advances? I don't see this in the rules anywhere, but I don't see why not. Of course, there's not much mechanical benefit from doing so, but it might make sense in some stories I'm sure.

What do you guys think? 

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Qingtian said:

Officially, no you cannot take the same career again to get another 10 advances from that carrier.

Unofficially, do what ever you like to do.  happy.gif

 

Yes when you return to a career you use the old character sheet with all the advances on... but it doesn't matter really, because there is no big benefit from staying in the same career, so it could bge considered cheating.

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Qingtian said:

Officially, no you cannot take the same career again to get another 10 advances from that carrier.

Unofficially, do what ever you like to do.  happy.gif

I thought so as well ;)

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LeBlanc13 said:

They are when you factor in the "Advanced Carreer Card-pendium" slated to come out later this year!!!!

Just Kidding, btw...

I think progressions are more keeping in line with the original system. Plus, who wants to be a rat catcher forever?

Although a SBVD named Boo, might be in order. "Go for the eyes Boo! The eyes!!!!"

 

That would be SBVH right?, or even SBVSH.

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