what the heck! U-wing vs Upsilon

[TBot 589]

Why is the U-wing so bad compared to the Upsilon? They were released the same flippin wave! For 7 points more you get plus 1 attack, plus 2 hull, plus 2 shields, coordinate, 2 techs, ISYTDS.

Oh nm didn't realise the U-wing had a white 4 straight. U-wing is totally OP now.

[KommanderKeldoth 2,600]

U-wing has an extra agility (with title) and can actually turn around if it needs to.  It's not as bad as people think it is.  It mostly just suffers from the lack of good rebel crew options for it.  Imperials use their shuttles as Palp-mobiles or Hux carriers.  Rebels don't have the same awesome support crew.  I would say its a slightly better lambda, but who flies a regular lambda (with the exception of Doom shuttle which is also imperial crew dependent).

[Hos 173]

According to meta wing, U wing is now the worst ship in the game

[SabineKey 6,238]

1 minute ago, Hos said:

According to meta wing, U wing is now the worst ship in the game

Whoa. It beat the Punisher? Dang.

[DodgingArcs 343]

14 minutes ago, KommanderKeldoth said:

U-wing has an extra agility (with title) and can actually turn around if it needs to.  It's not as bad as people think it is.  It mostly just suffers from the lack of good rebel crew options for it.  Imperials use their shuttles as Palp-mobiles or Hux carriers.  Rebels don't have the same awesome support crew.  I would say its a slightly better lambda, but who flies a regular lambda (with the exception of Doom shuttle which is also imperial crew dependent).

What I wouldn't give as an Imperial player for Rey, Jyn, Jan style abilities, but I totally get the point. The type of support the Imperial crew offers is better on Shuttle style ships, but the Imperial crew is often quite expensive. Kallus is the cheapest and Rey is significantly better for the points. Imagine Rey on a Phantom. Ouch. 

I think the main problem with the U-Wing is the role they tried to give it. It needs to be a Shuttle that can fly alongside and support X-Wings and Y-Wings. Cost is probably a factor in that, but ultimately the crew probably isn't right - yet. Im sure new crew will come out that might change things. 

Also it turns out people mostly fly the most busted stuff in each wave and the U-Wing is far from busted. It's actually fair. I think the Upsilon is fair too. If they wanted the U-Wing to be better they should have given it Co ordinate. 

[DR4CO 5,719]

33 minutes ago, KommanderKeldoth said:

Imperials use their shuttles as Palp-mobiles or Hux carriers.  Rebels don't have the same awesome support crew. 

And even if the Rebels did have such crew, they'd be more likely to put them on an Auzituck now, denying the U-wing even the theoretical option of being the Crew Delivery System of choice.

[Ailowynn 1,723]

Yeah, if the U-Wing had Coordinate, it would at least have a niche. As it is, the Upsilon is just so much better...not being able to turn around isn't so bad when you can get a few four-dice shots in, and then feed actions to your buddies. The 0-stop turnaround on the U-Wing is honestly just trash; it's so circumstantial and so punishing to use that it's hardly worth the zero points it costs. 

On top of that, they made it a large base ship, which makes it incredibly difficult to fly alongside other Rebel jousters. I think they wanted to make it a blocker, a concept that is frankly laughable with that dial and no repositioning. 

[markcsoul 2,122]

26 minutes ago, SabineKey said:

Whoa. It beat the Punisher? Dang.

Punisher has gotten LWF, bomblets, and unguided rockets.  If you take all 3 for 7 points it makes punishers playable at least.

[BadMotivator 1,261]

24 minutes ago, SabineKey said:

Whoa. It beat the punisher? Dang..

Punisher can take minelayer, and it has a normal kturn

[SabineKey 6,238]

3 minutes ago, markcsoul said:

Punisher has gotten LWF, bomblets, and unguided rockets.  If you take all 3 for 7 points it makes punishers playable at least.

 

3 minutes ago, BadMotivator said:

Punisher can take minelayer, and it has a normal kturn

Both fair.

[Azrapse 3,101]

Sometimes the game feels like designed by 3 different people that don't talk to each other, that have different visions on the direction the game should go.

That the U-wing and the Upsilon came in the same wave is as hard to believe as the Mist Hunter and the JumpMaster 5000 also being released together, or the K-wing and the TIE Punisher, or, I don't know... R3 Astromech coming at the same time than anything else in that wave 9.

It has been said several times that some ships and upgrades released lately seems like recovered from a dusty drawer where someone in the design team forgot them during waves 1-3.

Also, ships totally overriding each other is another thing that I find hard to understand. As @DR4CO says, it feels like it went like this:

Developer A: Guys, since the new movie has yet another shuttle for the Empire, I will just increase all stats and improve the dial and abilities, at the cost of increasing the price by... er... 10 points. Okay?
Developer B: That's broken. I will design this ship for the rebels that will be their shuttle. And since I hate all the overpowered stuff you two have been releasing lately, it will feel like belonging to Wave 1-3. Big base, clunky, underarmed, crappy pilot abilities...
Developer C: Sure... Go ahead! (To himself) Overpowered my ***. I will make behind your back a rebel shuttle better at everything than yours, small base, 180 firing arc, reinforce, another "Biggs"-like pilot... **** it, he took the cool new ship from the movie... Hmm... I will take this wooden one that appears 1 minute in this series instead. People love when obscure ships are better at everything than movie ships.
 

Edited August 9, 2017 by Azrapse

[RufusDaMan 2,299]

I'd sure like if the Lambda had U-Wing stats and dials and slots and everything... Wanna trade?

[Ralgon 983]

Outside of epic they are both useless. In a 100pnt format both are overcosted for what they take from the rest of the list.

[Quadjumper King 319]

1 hour ago, Azrapse said:

Sometimes the game feels like designed by 3 different people that don't talk to each other, that have different visions on the direction the game should go.

That the U-wing and the Upsilon came in the same wave is as hard to believe as the Mist Hunter and the JumpMaster 5000 also being released together, or the K-wing and the TIE Punisher, or, I don't know... R3 Astromech coming at the same time than anything else in that wave 9.

It has been said several times that some ships and upgrades released lately seems like recovered from a dusty drawer where someone in the design team forgot them during waves 1-3.

Also, ships totally overriding each other is another thing that I find hard to understand. As @DR4CO says, it feels like it went like this:

Developer A: Guys, since the new movie has yet another shuttle for the Empire, I will just increase all stats and improve the dial and abilities, at the cost of increasing the price by... er... 10 points. Okay?
Developer B: That's broken. I will design this ship for the rebels that will be their shuttle. And since I hate all the overpowered stuff you two have been releasing lately, it will feel like belonging to Wave 1-3. Big base, clunky, underarmed, crappy pilot abilities...
Developer C: Sure... Go ahead! (To himself) Overpowered my ***. I will make behind your back a rebel shuttle better at everything than yours, small base, 180 firing arc, reinforce, another "Biggs"-like pilot... **** it, he took the cool new ship from the movie... Hmm... I will take this wooden one that appears 1 minute in this series instead. People love when obscure ships are better at everything than movie ships.
 

Lol, but the Azutuk really does almost completely phase out the Uwing and now it's an odd large base version of a Bwing with two crew...

 

however the Uwing is my favourite ship in Star Wars (loved Rogue One) and I have been using it in casual nights to decent affect (won more than I've lost :P).

it has roughly five uses from what I've seen... (number 2 is my main use as I can't bring myself to build a rebel list without it...)

1. Generic, give it a crew or FCS and its damage is decent in the opening joust, similar to a Bwing....

2. Heff Tober (rebel bumpmaster) **** I've run this since it came out. Give it Boshek and either Rey, Cassian or Zeb (Boshek plus intel agent is nuts) and you've got a way to hold a ship captive while still outputting damage, the zero Kturn is actually somewhat useful here...

3. Bodhdi Rook (crew or otherwise...). Bring him in, let the Z-95's target lock and and follow up with a "decent" beat down.

4, Cassian Andor. Shreds stress, however until that's a larger part of the game (stress control sees more play) it's not all that useful....

5. The "not Fat Han" give it C3P0 or Fcs, Rey and R2D2 and it can perform well enough. But other ships generally want and can make better use of those upgrades

 

[GreenDragoon 8,315]

3 hours ago, KommanderKeldoth said:

It mostly just suffers from the lack of good rebel crew options for it.  Imperials use their shuttles as Palp-mobiles or Hux carriers.  Rebels don't have the same awesome support crew.

Eh... I don't believe that.

Rebels can choose between 38 crew, imperials between 26 (both including the 15 faction neutral), on a vide range of points from 0 to 7. Imperials are bound to expensive crew (3 and higher).

And roughly 50% of all crew being used was on rebels.

So if the U-wing suffers from a lack of good crew while it has most options and best options to choose from, then it was just designed very, very wrong.

[Quadjumper King 319]

34 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

Eh... I don't believe that.

Rebels can choose between 38 crew, imperials between 26 (both including the 15 faction neutral), on a vide range of points from 0 to 7. Imperials are bound to expensive crew (3 and higher).

And roughly 50% of all crew being used was on rebels.

So if the U-wing suffers from a lack of good crew while it has most options and best options to choose from, then it was just designed very, very wrong.

It's because rebel crew support the ship their on (generally speaking, of course their are exceptions) and the U-Wing wants to support other ships. The closest that rebels have is Jyn as she gives focus tokens or possibly Jan and neither of them fill the same niche that Hux or the Emporer did. 

They also don't have any instant damaging crew like Vader, or stupid good debuff crew like Kylo.

[Ralgon 983]

1 hour ago, Quadjumper King said:

It's because rebel crew support the ship their on (generally speaking, of course their are exceptions) and the U-Wing wants to support other ships. The closest that rebels have is Jyn as she gives focus tokens or possibly Jan and neither of them fill the same niche that Hux or the Emporer did. 

They also don't have any instant damaging crew like Vader, or stupid good debuff crew like Kylo.

Bodhi has the potential to  be valuable to an alpha strike list even without crew, but it's nothing tracer blount cant do (with limitations ofc) for cheaper. Once again,it's hotness comes into it's own from being magnified by epic where you have the ability to synergise without runing out of points way too fast.

Edited August 9, 2017 by Ralgon

[Elavion 512]

The U-wing suffers from the same issue as mist hunter and b-wing. it's relatively immobile, arc-bound and not very durable. If you put too few points in it, it fails to do enough to justify the chassis, if you put too much it just dies before it has a chance to be useful. Also, it's true the Auzituck does pretty much the same job but better.

 

If I had to run a U-Wing, it'd be a blue squadron pathfinder with rey, hera, title and FCS.

[Boom Owl 11,739]

Cassian Andor — U-Wing	27
Daredevil	3
Fire-Control System	2
Captain Rex	2
Gunner	5
Engine Upgrade	4
Pivot Wing	0
Ship Total: 43 This is what I fly when i want a U-Wing with dmg and mobility. Doesnt care much about stress to push through focus/tl shots. The second one below is also one of favorites as an 8 health xwing. The ability to boost 1 before doing a 0 turn should not be underestimated, it gives the u wing a k turn and sloops. Same with using daredevil before anything on his dial to clear the stress. Hera lets you turn 1 left or right and then k turn and double stress. And if the rules allowed it(they dont), you could do that and only single stress with kanan/daredevil. Is it reliable dmg? No. Forget the meta. Cassian Andor — U-Wing 27 Daredevil 3 Advanced Sensors 3 Kanan Jarrus 3 Hera 1 Engine Upgrade 4 Pivot Wing 0 Ship Total: 41  When this eventually gets a buff with K2S0 or an Ace.. It could be really strong. Actually....this reminds me Kanan Jarrus is total BS. Its such a massive universal dial modifier and its absurd that only rebels have access to it or that its in the game at all. Without it those stupid white rey sloops wouldnt be a thing. And the U-Wing's dial and upgrades and cost seem to have been designed with  that specific crew card in mind.

Edited August 9, 2017 by Boom Owl

[Hexdot 1,340]

From my Fly Casual perspective the Upsilon is simply one more example of undercosted New Codex ship. But interesting to play with really clever named pilots and such a large ship with Tech slot is a good adition to the game. Capable of performing 90 degree white turns, Coordination plus Red 4 is from my perspective simply broken about pts value. Poor Lambda.

When the Upsilons hit my shelves we simply perform a change that I was a little afraid if. Not now. Change 90 degrees Lambda's Red turn to White. And it works fine. 

The Upsilon was decisive to the most radical rule change we implemented. Simply forgot about points value. Cinematic Play only.

[Elavion 512]

52 minutes ago, Hexdot said:

From my Fly Casual perspective the Upsilon is simply one more example of undercosted New Codex ship. But interesting to play with really clever named pilots and such a large ship with Tech slot is a good adition to the game. Capable of performing 90 degree white turns, Coordination plus Red 4 is from my perspective simply broken about pts value. Poor Lambda.

When the Upsilons hit my shelves we simply perform a change that I was a little afraid if. Not now. Change 90 degrees Lambda's Red turn to White. And it works fine. 

The Upsilon was decisive to the most radical rule change we implemented. Simply forgot about points value. Cinematic Play only.

This is funny to me because Upsilon is actually doing worse than the Lambda shuttle.

[Gibbilo 255]

I find it interesting the reflex here seems to be to compare the Uwing to the Aztuk. In my mind the biggest failing is when you compare it to the Scurrg and note that the scurrg has more health, the same attack, better actions, more flexibility of loadout, and is on a small base even though it looks as big or bigger than the Uwing. The funny part is the Scurrg is supposed to be a far older ship (or at least as old as the Uwing) but seems superior in almost everyway when translated into the game.

[Hexdot 1,340]

18 minutes ago, Elavion said:

This is funny to me because Upsilon is actually doing worse than the Lambda shuttle.

If you are having fun, then I am funny too.

[Elavion 512]

1 minute ago, Gibbilo said:

I find it interesting the reflex here seems to be to compare the Uwing to the Aztuk. In my mind the biggest failing is when you compare it to the Scurrg and note that the scurrg has more health, the same attack, better actions, more flexibility of loadout, and is on a small base even though it looks as big or bigger than the Uwing. The funny part is the Scurrg is supposed to be a far older ship (or at least as old as the Uwing) but seems superior in almost everyway when translated into the game.

 

It's because both the U-wing and the Auzituck are fat crew carriers (A.K.A. Shuttles, though the auzituck is a little bit more than that due to wookie commandos and his 180), whereas the scurrg is a highly customizable multi-purpose combat ship, not unlike the millenium falcon. Comparing Scurrg to U-Wing is like comparing a Spitfire to a Boeing 747.

[TasteTheRainbow 8,636]

7 hours ago, Hos said:

According to meta wing, U wing is now the worst ship in the game

If that's true the game is in a pretty good state, because the U isn't that bad.