Jump to content
Velvetelvis

Pretty sure there's no real reason for this game to use dice anymore.

Recommended Posts

On 2017-08-04 at 11:50 PM, Boom Owl said:

I know your post is about action efficiency creep but it got me thinking about dice creep. 

I wonder if they need to just add the following unbreakable rule to the rules bible and force the developers to design mechanics and hp around it forever:

"It is impossible for any ship to roll more than 5 red dice."

Even 5 is a bit too mutch. I had a match last week. I took out a Bwing in the 1st round of combat with 2 cruise missiles. IMO the game loses it's appeal when you can reliably take down 1/3rd of your opponent squad in a single turn.

4 dice with an optional 5th (range 1 PW) should be the max. Then you can add extra effects like shield removal, evade denial, etc. 5 dices should come with a penalty similar to heavy laser canon or unguided rockets.

Also, the # of dice wouldnt be that much of an issue if they were not fully moded with TL+focus most of the time.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Rinzler in a Tie said:

um.. please elaborate

I can't remember the exact details, basically bumped Nora and the put his other deci right behind the first one so I couldn't get past, then bumped her again, he took either stress or damage to give me damage and in two turns did 8 points of damage. I lost in 15 minutes. The blocking one was Captain Oicrun.

Edited by Deadfool

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Deadfool said:

I can't remember the exact details, basically bumped Nora and the put his other deci right behind the first one so I couldn't get past, then bumped her again, he took either stress or damage to give me damage and in two turns did 8 points of damage. I lost in 15 minutes. The blocking one was Captain Oicrun.

Sounds like ye olde Dauntless + Daredevil shenanigans. Anti-Pursuit Lasers thrown in for good measure?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I tend to agree with the OP.

 

The game should be 90% Maneuvering and 10% cards,   right now it's 70% cards and 30% maneuvering.

 

Perhaps they could do something like give a free re-roll each turn for any squad with less than 10 pts of upgrades.     They could use it at any time.

Or maybe they could make some type of squad composition rules,  like Warhammer.

 

Right now every list is loaded with cards and the newer ships have so many upgrades they are total customization, which makes the old ships obsolete.     

 

don' t know, several of my players have sold everything, because they believe the game is not about flying well anymore, but more about combinations with cards.    Hence the OP opinion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

11 minutes ago, eagletsi111 said:

don' t know, several of my players have sold everything, because they believe the game is not about flying well anymore, but more about combinations with cards.    Hence the OP opinion.

Can we have a quick poll: 

In your area, are you seeing more people joining or leaving the game? Feel free to put your geographic location. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ohio.  2 People Left game.     Sold everything.    Seriously.     More people are playing destiny and Armada.    In fact our Thursday night X-wing has now been made into Armada and X-wing, because of how popular Armada is becoming now.

Mind you both of the players that left have stated that only play Armada because it's star wars and hasn't been dice creeped completely yet

 

No new players.

Edited by eagletsi111

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Louisville, KY.

At least eight new players in the past year I can think of off the top of my head, and only one guy I know of who's gotten out and sold his collection to one of the new guys. All still excited. I know of one who took a break after Worlds, but came back to play a little because of Nym (hint: a former member of our podcast).  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/4/2017 at 11:09 PM, Rat of Vengence said:

Then I'd suggest, like any other game, people need to get back into the skill of picking a list that is good against all-comers. It's much more fun too.

 

That said, yes there will always be lists that your list won't handle as well of course.

 

RoV

Funny, I remember a time when skill won games, not list building and luck of match ups. And what about all the players who bought into this game because the wanted to fly their favorite ships from Star Wars, now most of our collections are useless or liabilities in a list. People are flying ships they don't even know about just to have a chance of winning. 

Whenever I open up my collection now, I look at all the ships I was excited for and still love to see on the table, but I have to pass them by or loose the match. 

You lose if you play what you want to fly, and you lose when you win flying the ships you don't really want to fly (or buy, for some).

No problem here, reassure yourself by calling me or anyone else with a similar opinion a whiner if it helps, and keep drinking the cool-aid.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Radarman5 said:

Funny, I remember a time when skill won games, not list building and luck of match ups. And what about all the players who bought into this game because the wanted to fly their favorite ships from Star Wars, now most of our collections are useless or liabilities in a list. People are flying ships they don't even know about just to have a chance of winning. 

Whenever I open up my collection now, I look at all the ships I was excited for and still love to see on the table, but I have to pass them by or loose the match. 

You lose if you play what you want to fly, and you lose when you win flying the ships you don't really want to fly (or buy, for some).

No problem here, reassure yourself by calling me or anyone else with a similar opinion a whiner if it helps, and keep drinking the cool-aid.

Since when has list building NOT been part of the game? Seriously? The game has always had list building as a factor; pick ships that don't synergise well, or don't complement each other, and you are going to have a hard time of it.

My comment was directed towards the scissors-paper-rock mentality, where people make lists that have hard counters. A balanced list should be capable of taking all-comers, not just be anti-meta or whatever.

You can keep your cool-aid kiddo, I'll just call it as I see it :)

 

RoV

 

Image result for scissors is overpowered

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, DR4CO said:

Sounds like ye olde Dauntless + Daredevil shenanigans. Anti-Pursuit Lasers thrown in for good measure?

No APL but yeah dauntless and daredevil, he beat me in 15 minutes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, Rinzler in a Tie said:

Can we have a quick poll: 

In your area, are you seeing more people joining or leaving the game? Feel free to put your geographic location. 

Norfolk, UK: We've had half a dozen-ish new players join in the last year, and one person leave the game (who's focusing on non-gaming hobbies in general).  We've had a few people split their gaming time between 40k and X-Wing, but that's to be expected with the launch of a new edition that's actually quite good. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 hours ago, Radarman5 said:

Funny, I remember a time when skill won games, not list building and luck of match ups. And what about all the players who bought into this game because the wanted to fly their favorite ships from Star Wars, now most of our collections are useless or liabilities in a list. People are flying ships they don't even know about just to have a chance of winning. 

Whenever I open up my collection now, I look at all the ships I was excited for and still love to see on the table, but I have to pass them by or loose the match. 

You lose if you play what you want to fly, and you lose when you win flying the ships you don't really want to fly (or buy, for some).

No problem here, reassure yourself by calling me or anyone else with a similar opinion a whiner if it helps, and keep drinking the cool-aid.

So bring the ships you want to bring, and play to have fun.  Who cares about winning?  I'd much rather lose with ships I like than be competitive with ships I don't.  I have only bought ships from the original trilogies, rogue one, the force awakens starter, and the new falcon.  I'm happy with that.  They're ships I know from the movies I know, flown mostly by pilots I know.    Rebel and Imperial, about a dozen ships of each.

A lot of the time, I'm playing against other people using my stuff too.  I lose some, I win some, I honestly couldn't tell you if I won or lost my last game, because that has nothing to do with why I play.  The reason you all seem to get so twisted up about it is that you play to win too much without focusing on the fact that it's a game.  Fly casual! :)

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/9/2017 at 6:49 AM, DailyRich said:

And I remember early on when the complaint was that this was basically a dice game that happened to have some ship models in it...

My main thought was....having the dice play a part is interesting. I don't think if like a straight up " dice off" any more then I like " no dice".

I think I might be nostalgic for a time when you planned maneuvers...tried something sneaky or set up a combo then rolled with a mod if everything went well and you took your quasi random lumps.

 

Expertise bombs and a couple more seem so prevalent that you might as well skip the dice step and just assume max damage incoming.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Brighton, UK

Definite decrease. X-Wing night used to be massively busy with several notable regulars, now we're lucky to get 6-8 people across the entire night and several of them play Destiny instead for a lot of that time. I am stepping back from it, too - my dissatisfaction with the game has forced me to take a break from it because it isn't fun any more. Too much complexity (as opposed to depth), too many hard counters, and a very questionable design ethos.

As for dice, there has been definite 'creep' there - time was that a 4-dice shot or a fully modded shot were rare and special, and that bumping or getting stressed had consequences. Too many combinations exist to allow the former and ignore the latter, often both at once.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/8/2017 at 11:36 AM, Rinzler in a Tie said:

 

Can we have a quick poll: 

In your area, are you seeing more people joining or leaving the game? Feel free to put your geographic location. 

both the game stores near me stopped doing X-wing nights after wave 11 was announced. i check ebay every morning for cheap used ships. since wave 11 landed multiple people a day are listing their entire collections, including the ships they got with wave 11. thats new this month, i'd say a 10 fold increase

I also work conventions for a living and game vendors I buy from have told me X-wing isnt selling anymore and no longer carry the game in store. 

also after wave 10 my local Barnes n Noble clearanced exerything x-wing because people stopped buying.

if they dont stop the broken unfun crap its gonna die off

Edited by Vontoothskie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...