Wazat

3 Tactician Auzitucks? It'll never work! (also Daredevil Wulf)

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I think I'm ready to move on to a different iteration now.  I felt my build for Wulffwarro was clever, but ultimately didn't provide the punch or target confusion I'd hoped for.  If I Raged with him often, he'd receive a bunch of shots with only Lowhhrick's ability to help, which was by design.  That's great for activating his ability, less great in that he could potentially eat a bunch of crits which he couldn't mitigate because he didn't have Breach Specialist.  That meant Wulffwarro could go down hard or, more likely, I'd have to be more cautious with him and he'd be the last target.  On top of that, Rage actually equates into an EPT which costs 2 points and one crew slot because it required Inspiring Recruit.

Next up is Lowhhrick and some Liberators.  Operations Specialist should provide the list with a lot more consistent punch with some target confusion (Lowhhrick or the focus machine?).  I like Rey crew here because even if the last Liberator misses, I can pass off that focus to Lowhhrick to save for next round.  I'll have to see how often that comes into play.  If it's not often, then I'd drop Rey in favor of another Tactician.  It's hard to argue against Rey crew, though.

I'll be more aware of my opponents list after the Ruthlessness/Tractor Beam beat down, though.  I'm looking at Lowhhrick as an expensive Liberator, only seeking range 1 if it's clearly a safe option.

Wookiee Liberator (26)
Predator (3)
Tactician (2)
Breach Specialist (1)

Wookiee Liberator (26)
Predator (3)
Tactician (2)
Operations Specialist (3)

Lowhhrick (28)
Predator (3)
Rey (2)
Breach Specialist (1)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

[edit] - One other thing I forgot to mention.  You can mess with target priority by taking focuses with different ships at different times.  Let's say Lowhhrick's had his shields stripped?  Go ahead and take focus for the other wookies to make your opponent consider attacking another target.  If they do, then they're spreading fire.  If they don't, then you have well-modded attacks for the other ships.  Win-win!  Just be careful if shields are down and you're not eating crits without Breach Specialist available.

Edited by gennataos

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1 hour ago, Mcpolle said:

Loving this thread, good to see something different, can I ask you guys, how are you playing the three ships?? In tight formation, or nice and spread out??

I had been flying them in a loose formation, but I think it needs to be more flexible than that based on what list you're facing and even how you kit out the wookies.  I wouldn't recommend them being too spread out, because it'd be difficult for them to come together quickly for concentrated fire.  For my latest iteration, I'll probably fly Lowhhrick close to the Operations Specialist Liberator, with the other Liberator creating separation as more of a flanker.  Of course, again, Lowhhrick's support position proximity will be based on the opponents list.

One key thing which I believe @Wazat covered in his wiki thread is angles of approach are important for the wookies.  You don't need to and likely don't want to approach things head on.  That just allows them to K-turn behind you with no shot for your wookies as they lumber around on their 2-turns.  Ideally, you want multiple angles of approach to keep the maximum amount of wookie arcs on the target.  

Edited by gennataos

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I like to fly my tucks in a loose formation that breaks apart at will, and occasionally reassembles in a round or two; I'd hazard a guess that the starting distance is around 1.5 bases apart, which means they can usually focus-fire naturally and support each other, but they have lots of space to maneuver.  I haven't been flying Lowhhrick in my triple tuck fleet, so I'm able to ignore range to each other and focus on optimal placement relative to enemies and obstacles and arcs.  (@gennataos is wise to treat Lowhhrick as a Liberator with an extra feature that occasionally sees use; this helps avoid falling into the trap of letting a formation weaken your strengths)

I think you can see in the video I posted in my battle report on wikia, that I will scatter them quite readily, or peel one off to the side to swoop wide and set up a trap (or avoid an obstacle).  When arranging your ships at the start and from turn to turn, it's important that you're able to either turn outward and spread out to cover your bases (because you're not sure where the enemy will go, or they're behind you and you need to force them to pick a direction), or turn inward in a swooping two-round reverse-direction sequence that ideally keeps enemies in some arcs in the process.  Everyone being identical PS helps a lot here.

 

BTW, as for range & tacticians:

I did not get frequent direct use from the tacticians during the tournament.  Either I'm bad at lining up the perfect distance, or my opponents were very wary of the stress and were good at avoiding range 2.  And that's exactly the benefit: even if I fail to pull off tactician, it had my opponents fumbling to avoid it.  They were damned if they got stressed, and they were damned if they had to take suboptimal paths to avoid it, often reducing their effectiveness or throwing off the way they normally play (stress builds often do this IMO, e.g. Asajj, Y-Wings, and Braylen).  And when I did pull off a tactician stress or especially double-stress, it was usually a source of grief for the opponent instead of trivial, so they were right to try to avoid it.  They may also be wary of self-stressing abilities like PTL and Zuckuss (Crew), because you could pile it on and interrupt their shedding cycle.

So you should be trying to land foes at range 2, but perhaps you shouldn't be trying nearly as hard as your opponent is trying to avoid range 2.  Your firepower is hot enough and your ships are tough enough, you don't need to make compromising maneuvers to try to get the most use out of tacticians.  Let them do their work when you can get into range, and let them psyche out your opponents even when you can't.  ^_^

 

Beyond that, reinforce as often as possible, as it lowers damage and lets you shed potentially game-ending crits like Damaged Engine and Blinded Pilot.  But don't be too afraid to plow through an asteroid to line up a great killbox.  Do be very wary of stress, and judicious about when to take it on.  Even if you're not using expertise, stress is dangerous because it's so hard to clear unless you have no need to turn hard for a while, and it blocks your reinforce and breach specialist defenses.  Stress fleets will make this hard, but you can make wise decisions about which obstacles to tangle with...  Asteroids are probably better than debris clouds, IMO, but it's very situational.  You should be thinking a turn ahead when able, so you don't put yourself in rotten situations.

Consider practicing maneuvering close to obstacles and learn the exact maneuvers you can get away with, because it's more important with Auzitucks than with many ships that you be able to fly aggressively and gamble with edges to surprise your opponent.  You can't k-turn to joust, but you can scatter your tucks in different directions and make it very hard to outmaneuver everyone, then converge on the enemy with the ships behind him.  Particularly when you pull off a maneuver they didn't think you could, you can turn a problem situation into the round that wins the game for you.

 

At least, that's how I remember things working out... it's been long enough that it could all be the delusions of a sick mind.  ;)

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Quote

 think you can see in the video I posted in my battle report on wikia,

Think they have taken it down, have tried the link, but shows nothing, 

Thx for the tips guys, will give it a run tonight, see how they go

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Played the list tonight, the first one with 

 

Wulfaroo

Lightning reflexes, 

Rey

Breach spec

 

Wookie Lib,

Breach Spec, Tactician, Expertise *2

 

Game two, changed it to

Lowrick, 

Lightning reflexes, Rey, Breach Spec

Wookie Lib,

Tactician, Breach Spec, Predator, Vectored Thrusters*2

 

I found that Pred version and Lowrich to be better,  the Vectored thrusters actually helped out, more than I expected, meant I had more options.

 

I like the list, lots of fun to play

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11 hours ago, Mcpolle said:

Think they have taken it down, have tried the link, but shows nothing, 

Thx for the tips guys, will give it a run tonight, see how they go

Interesting, they removed all the Intermountain Cup videos, probably to make room for more stuff later.  (I'm not familiar with Twitch's policies but they probably have a size limit on the account)

Sorry to send you on a wild goose chase.

 

I've found Vectored Thrusters to be valuable on my own tucks as well.  The problem is points cost and actions... hard to fit them in, and I'm often only using them when I won't get shot.  I should probably work my way out of the rut and try something new when I get a chance (reinforcing every round is just so strong).

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38 minutes ago, Wazat said:

(reinforcing every round is just so strong).

It sure is, but realising when to take a focus or barrel roll is just as important, I feel.

But the list sure was fun to play, played it into Miranda twice, and won both games.

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Yea, barrel rolling at the right time can mean the difference between taking a shots and having nothing in arc, vs dodging shots and getting a shot in.  I'm also fond of boost but it's even harder to fit in the triple tucks fleet.

 

As for the video disappearing, I've decided the reason is that the Triple Tucks winning was too spicy even for Twitch.  The outrage was too great, they had to take the video down.  ;)

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On 10/2/2017 at 4:23 PM, Mcpolle said:

Loving this thread, good to see something different, can I ask you guys, how are you playing the three ships?? In tight formation, or nice and spread out??

 

When I first picked up the list, I flew in a super tight formation, but when I saw Miranda / Nym across the map, I opted for a very very loose setup to avoid getting bombed together and I have been flying it that way since. I have been using 3 wookiees in the Vassal League and am currently 4-0 with the highest MoV of any player in the League (mind you - I am in the lowest tier). All but one of my games has a Vassal Logfile that anyone can download to watch.

http://lists.starwarsclubhouse.com/league_player?player_id=1615

Edited by Incard

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I played the following triple Wookiee list at the club last night:

Wookiee Liberator, Lightning Reflexes, Tactian, Op. Spec.

Wookiee Liberator, Lightning Reflexes, Tactian, Gunner

Wookiee Liberator, Lightning Reflexes, Tactian, Gunner

 

It worked great. Went 3-1 with it, which isnt bad for it's first run out. Lightning Reflexes gave me some options for keeping my quarry in the kill/stress box. The Op Spec was nice when it triggered. As I was only shooting at Nyms and Firesprays, I didn't miss that often to get the value out of it, but I think against agi 3 targets it'll be great.

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1 hour ago, timg_83 said:

I played the following triple Wookiee list at the club last night:

Wookiee Liberator, Lightning Reflexes, Tactian, Op. Spec.

Wookiee Liberator, Lightning Reflexes, Tactian, Gunner

Wookiee Liberator, Lightning Reflexes, Tactian, Gunner

It worked great. Went 3-1 with it, which isnt bad for it's first run out. Lightning Reflexes gave me some options for keeping my quarry in the kill/stress box. The Op Spec was nice when it triggered. As I was only shooting at Nyms and Firesprays, I didn't miss that often to get the value out of it, but I think against agi 3 targets it'll be great.

I played my latest version (several posts above above) against two x/7 defenders and Omega Leader and OpSpec triggered ALL THE TIME, because it's impossible to hit those things.  I've played against defenders a few times with different variations of triple wookies, and the wookies are getting out-jousted.  The problem is you can get a defender down to 1-2 hull, but then they're behind you and surprisingly hard to catch in arc again.  More than anything I've faced yet, I feel I really need to have an approach vector plan for them.

Edited by gennataos

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Tried Lightning Reflexes? It is only one use, but the ability to do a hard turn 180 spin , to put your facing at right angles to the ship you were just jousting not only keeps them in arc, but also means they probably won't get behind you on their next move either.

I'm finding it really fun and worth way more than 1pt on a ship with no K turn.

Originally, I was planning to run crack shot, but the manouverability that LF gives was too interesting to pass up. Really liking it.


Would love Predator, but I don't have anywhere near the points I'd need to fit it in.

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56 minutes ago, timg_83 said:

Tried Lightning Reflexes? It is only one use, but the ability to do a hard turn 180 spin , to put your facing at right angles to the ship you were just jousting not only keeps them in arc, but also means they probably won't get behind you on their next move either.

I'm finding it really fun and worth way more than 1pt on a ship with no K turn.

Originally, I was planning to run crack shot, but the manouverability that LF gives was too interesting to pass up. Really liking it.


Would love Predator, but I don't have anywhere near the points I'd need to fit it in.

I've looked at other options like that and definitely see the value, but I'm waving off for a couple reasons:

  • I feel they need some sort of inherent dice modification, which means either Predator or Expertise
  • I feel more practice and better approach vectors/angles can compensate 

Also, and this is outside the scope of triple wookies, but I've also considered Miranda with a couple Liberators.  For that approach, I'd have to either give up bombs or Tacticians, neither of which is really appealing.  

 

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If you're down to one Wookiee against a TIE Defender, that's very tough.  :(  Edit: Also they can do bad things with their cannon, be it tractor, flechette, or ion.

However, while you have two or three ships you can split up and head in different directions before converging, or turn with one and slow-roll with the other to block or tighten the killbox.  TIE Defenders love to joust but they hate making hard turns; come at them from the side, or split up and make them pick a target so the rest can whip around and hold them in arc.  They're also bad at slow-rolling, having to choose between 1- or 2-banks, straight-2, or red turns.  Slow-rolling with one wookie at the right time while your others bank or turn inward can often put that TIE Defender in a lethal killbox.

Edited by Wazat
headcannon!

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7 hours ago, Wazat said:

If you're down to one Wookiee against a TIE Defender, that's very tough.  :(  Edit: Also they can do bad things with their cannon, be it tractor, flechette, or ion.

However, while you have two or three ships you can split up and head in different directions before converging, or turn with one and slow-roll with the other to block or tighten the killbox.  TIE Defenders love to joust but they hate making hard turns; come at them from the side, or split up and make them pick a target so the rest can whip around and hold them in arc.  They're also bad at slow-rolling, having to choose between 1- or 2-banks, straight-2, or red turns.  Slow-rolling with one wookie at the right time while your others bank or turn inward can often put that TIE Defender in a lethal killbox.

Hah, all of that is great in theory, but it's harder to pull off in practice...at least for me.  The folks I play, they won't slow roll behind a wookie, they'll just K-turn in front of it and tank whatever I can throw at it...because they can!  Coming from the side works once, then they're either behind me or gone to reset the engagement.  You usually have to have at least two guns on a defender to scratch their paint with a lost shield.  You can spread your arcs to guarantee a shot, but one shot isn't likely to do much.  It's not that I don't put a hurt on them, it's that after the initial engagement, it's really hard to put through those final 2-3 points of damage for a kill.

I'm moving on to the next iteration.  Operations Specialists + Rey (which I remember her) absolutely increases the damage output, but I think the threat of Tactician on all three ships is stronger.

Wookiee Liberator (26)
Predator (3)
Tactician (2)
Breach Specialist (1)

Wookiee Liberator (26)
Predator (3)
Tactician (2)
Breach Specialist (1)

Lowhhrick (28)
Predator (3)
Tactician (2)
C-3PO (3)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

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Have now played 10 games with tactician gunner opspec and have come to a couple of thoughts after going 5/5 against a mixture of opponent skill levels and meta lists  

I love flying the list. It is genuine fun and requires skill to maintain that range 2 band. 

Loose formation trumps tight formation

opspec carrier might as well have a giant target painted on his back. 

Crits kill the list.

Going to run the expertise variant for a bit and see how that compares with my play style. 

Then get the 4th ship and run the walking carpet. 

 

#addict

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5 hours ago, Dreadai said:

Have now played 10 games with tactician gunner opspec and have come to a couple of thoughts after going 5/5 against a mixture of opponent skill levels and meta lists  

I love flying the list. It is genuine fun and requires skill to maintain that range 2 band. 

Loose formation trumps tight formation

opspec carrier might as well have a giant target painted on his back. 

Crits kill the list.

Going to run the expertise variant for a bit and see how that compares with my play style. 

Then get the 4th ship and run the walking carpet. 

#addict

Those are two things I wanted to point out.  I do really like the idea of OpSpec, it definitely increases damage output, but then it falls down when that wookie goes down.

Wookies suffer from more crits than a lot of ships, which is why I'm leaning toward all of them with Breach Specialist.  

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8 hours ago, Dreadai said:

Have now played 10 games with tactician gunner opspec and have come to a couple of thoughts after going 5/5 against a mixture of opponent skill levels and meta lists  

I love flying the list. It is genuine fun and requires skill to maintain that range 2 band. 

Loose formation trumps tight formation

opspec carrier might as well have a giant target painted on his back. 

Crits kill the list.

Going to run the expertise variant for a bit and see how that compares with my play style. 

Then get the 4th ship and run the walking carpet. 

 

#addict

C-3PO on the Ops Spec, Lowhhrick's ability, and the old damage deck are my attempts to counter those weaknesses.

Sadly I still haven't had a chance to put it on the table to test, not been able to play for over a week now. So I might be going down the wrong path without knowing haha.

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2 hours ago, timg_83 said:

For those that have been running Breach Specialist, how have you found it?

 

 

 

It's extremely good.  I have it on all three of my Tucks and I can't justify removing it.  It lets me prevent crits like Damaged Engine (red turns are devastating on tucks), Blinded Pilot (liberators are low-PS), stress, recurring damage, effects that like to consume your actions for multiple rounds, etc.

It trivialized the RAC + Kylo + Palp with Quickdraw fleet that battled me for the final prize at the Intermountain Cup, and my opponent couldn't believe how OP the ability was.  :)  His strategy had served him so well up until then: Kylo a blinded pilot onto the victim, then have RAC or Palp force a crit onto it.  Pound the victim to a pulp and it can't shoot back.  My fleet said "nope!".  And the Reinforce tokens helped me shed a lot of damage along the way, because I can reduce damage before discarding the token to flip crits facedown.

Particularly if you've designed your fleet to Reinforce often (e.g. Predator, Expertise, etc), it's an excellent choice.

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19 minutes ago, Wazat said:

It's extremely good.  I have it on all three of my Tucks and I can't justify removing it.  It lets me prevent crits like Damaged Engine (red turns are devastating on tucks), Blinded Pilot (liberators are low-PS), stress, recurring damage, effects that like to consume your actions for multiple rounds, etc.

It trivialized the RAC + Kylo + Palp with Quickdraw fleet that battled me for the final prize at the Intermountain Cup, and my opponent couldn't believe how OP the ability was.  :)  His strategy had served him so well up until then: Kylo a blinded pilot onto the victim, then have RAC or Palp force a crit onto it.  Pound the victim to a pulp and it can't shoot back.  My fleet said "nope!".  And the Reinforce tokens helped me shed a lot of damage along the way, because I can reduce damage before discarding the token to flip crits facedown.

Particularly if you've designed your fleet to Reinforce often (e.g. Predator, Expertise, etc), it's an excellent choice.

What @Wazat said.  I've found it pretty instrumental.  I've been experimenting with various lists which usually only have 2 of the wookies with it, and I usually find myself kinda sad when the third one starts taking crits.

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I have started experimenting with the following setup:

Lightning Reflexes + Gunner + Tactician on two wookiees

Trick Shot + Operations Specialist + C-3PO on the third.

I miss the total independence of Breach, Tactician, Expertise on all three. I miss the magic of Breach Specialist. I don't like relying on Ops spec for offensive mods. I like the possibility of double-stressing with one ship, and I like that lightning reflexes really opens up some possibilities. It may be a matter of taste. More games!

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